Red-light cameras, the good and the rantable

Note the critical phrase at the end: "if he or she can do so safely"

Note also that this is *CANADA* law you're citing, not California.

SHE ran the yellow as it turned red, (Nissan) The Fiesta ran a GREEN and hit said pathfinder. Nissan's fault. IF there was a slight delay, Perhaps she wouldn't have had a collision. Sorry I wasn't clear enough

Steve

I treat a yellow as a warning, and try not to get my speed to a point that stopping safely isn't possible;

The cops cited the nissan driver, for the fiesta was proceding thru a green light.

I still would perfer to see the slight delay.

Out of curosity, i'll; time the yellow

Steve

Maybe you should have read the whole thing... I seem to be able to decipher the words 'Ontario Canada' in my post quite clearly.

I also quoted Maryland *USA* law which says the same thing. If you look up California, you will find the same again.

Never mind, I looked up California *USA* for you and it says almost exactly the same thing.

QUOTE: When you see the yellow light, stop if you can do so safely. END QUOTE

Mike

86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view! Jan/06 (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)

Once again, note that critical "if you can do so safely" part.

Correct.

So if a cop sees you gunning it to make the intersection before the red comes on, he can nail you. If you were doing that and got hit like was mentioned, you are at fault, not the bozo that was at speed when the light turned green and just kept on going.....

As mentioned, but was cut by someone, I got a ticket for 'running' the yellow light. I went to court over it and said I didn't think I could safely stop due to a tailgater and rain. The judge believed me. It was the cop tailgating me.

That still cost me 2 days. One to hang around court to plead not guilty, and another to come back for the trial.

Also as mentioned, this thread has been played before and everyone that looked up their state or country has the same type of law on the books. "A solid yellow signal means "stop" unless it is too dangerous to do so.... Not 'the red is coming, goose it". LOL!

Mike

86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view! Jan/06 (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)

Good that someone will take the time to fight this sort of thing. Maybe the cop will reevaluate his tailgating and his ticketing.

When/where have I so much as hinted at the "red is coming, goose it" concept?

Let me save you some effort in trying to find it: Unless my evil twin has been typing under my name while I wasn't looking, I haven't.

Passing through a yellow *IS NOT* illegal anywhere I've ever been licensed, and is not actionable. The law prefers a stop, if it's safe to do so. But *MY* determination of safety - a *HIGHLY* subjective one - overrides the law's preference. As such, any cop issuing a ticket is wasting time and taxpayer money. *I*, as the driver of the vehicle, define what is "safe" or "not safe", and I'll cheerfully waste as much time and effort on the part of "the system" fighting it as needed should such a ticket be issued - Even if it means going down in flames in the end. A nickel here, a dime there, and sooner or later, the word comes down "from on high" that Officer O'Malley better start getting his shit together and stop issuing bullshit tickets.

(BTW: It's my opinion that you "didn't do it right" with your two appearances - The proper method is to drag it out as long (and ex$pen$ively) as possible by demanding (if the option is available in your area - it does vary from place to place) a jury trial, subpeona anybody and his dog that might have any bearing on the case, generate as much paperwork as possible, delay in every way possible, motion for whatever can be motioned for, make sure the cop has to show up and waste HIS time, if radar is involved, demand the daily testing and calibration logs, tie up the courtroom in any way possible, and so on - Bury the system under a blizzard of as much paperwork and effort on their part as you possibly can - In other words, "be celery" - Make it more effort and cost to the system than the fine you (might, in the end) pay is worth.)

Now there is someone who must have been shafted more than once. lol. Not intending great offence but your attitude towards traffic law seems a bit childish. Some might have more of a moral quandary to wasting tax-payer money ( which you have with utmost certainty complained about at some point) rather than stopping when recommended. I am from Ontario, Canada. For most a yellow light means "gun it" it is sad and juvenile but true. If one is truly paying attention while driving there is no reason you should not be able to stop safely at a yellow light. hint for driving in Ontario: yellow lights at intersections are preceded by the changing of a "walk" light to "don't walk". For intersections without pedestrian traffic there is an extended yellow for 60km/h plus zones. for more traffic advice feel free to contact me.

The Mike Romain entity posted thusly:

Gee, Mike, later on in your post, yo quote the statute for Ontario that says it is legal to go through a yellow.

Yup.. thought so. There it is. "... if he or she can do so safely" says that you can indeed go through on a yellow. In fact, in BC, the red light cameras take a sequence of pictures (two or three, can't recall), and they are checked for one condition, and one condition only; "did the vehicle enter the intersection after the light changed to red". If it did, the driver broke the law, period.

Only if you define you define 'running' as 'entering the intersection after the yellow is replaced by the red, in the specific case of BC and/or Ontario.

Why are all you 'smart asses' snipping the part about me actually getting a ticket for 'running' a Yellow light?

Don't fit with you criticism eh?

Mike

86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view! Jan/06 (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page

Hardly...

Try because, as you relate, the charge was tossed as bullshit (which is exactly as it should have been, though I think you should have figured out a way for it to cost "the system" more than just a "case dismissed") which is proving the point that's trying to be made: THERE IS NO SUCH THING as "running a yellow light", for the simple reason that if the light isn't already red when you enter the intersection, YOU HAVE THE RIGHT OF WAY, even if it's only for the few moments of time it takes to complete your motion through the intersection.

The "if he/she can do so safely" clause in each cite you've made makes it clear that "stop if you see yellow" is only a (wise) SUGGESTION, and can (and should) be ignored if stopping isn't safe.

(To save you the time and finger wear, no, I'm not so much as hinting that "goose it" is the correct move. I *AM* suggesting - no, lets make that "flat out stating" - that there is nothing actionable, according to either the letter OR the spirit of the law, in blowing through a yellow light if you feel that stopping is unsafe.)

The Mike Romain entity posted thusly:

Say what? You got charged, and not convicted, yes? Sorta seems to me that you answered our criticism of your misinterpretations of the law as she is writ by relating your experience.

If the cop(s) that sees you run the yellow light can convince the Judge that there was no reason you could not have stopped safely, you will be convicted.

Simple eh.

Mike

86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view! Jan/06 (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)

The law exists on the books.... If you are 'not' being tailgated and decide to gun it to make a yellow light, you can be charged and convicted for not stopping at a solid Yellow light.

If the cop that sees you run the yellow light can convince the Judge that there was no reason you could not have stopped safely, you will be convicted.

If like the accident mentioned, you are gunning it to make the yellow and it turns red before you clear and you get hit, you can be charged and maybe convicted depending on the witnesses....

No matter what, you will have to spend 2 days in court to fight it.

It gives the cop an excuse to pull you over and then.... well here in Canada if it is an old vehicle, they can do a roadside safety inspection, tires, brakes, lights, etc., check for seatbelt use, make sure you have all the correct paperwork in your pocket. Make sure you are not drinking alcohol, etc.....

Mike

86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view! Jan/06 (More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)