Access Toyota on the West Coast (sorry if this has been discussed to death)

um ... sorry if this has been gone over a million times. i tried a google search in this newsgroup + edmonds auto but nothing definitive
and current has come about.
with the price of gas going nuts in Canada (and particularly schizophrenic in Vancouver), i also find myself in the market for a new car. i'm looking at a 2005 Echo RS (or waiting for the new + rumoured Echo 2006/Vitz -- supposedly due anytime between now and december). after all is said and done with my package i've gone from a base of $12000 to over $22000, after taxes, freight, etc.
but what is the deal with Access Pricing? on several parts of the Toyota website, it states that individual Toyota dealers are allowed to set prices ... and yet five different Toyota dealers i've spoken to have identical pricing -- with no room for negotiation.
i've even asked them point-blank "so if there's nothing to negotiate, why should i buy from you or any other Toyota dealer?" ALL of them replied with "service", and two of them also added, "but there really isn't any difference." (i'm paraphrasing, of course.)
i've found info on lawsuits against Toyota for "price-fixing" because of Access Toyota, and also rumours of the demise of the Access program ... but those date back more than one year.
so ... is Access Toyota REALLY here to stay? any pointers for a buyer interested in a new Toyota? and also: does Access Pricing also apply to any used Toyotas i might buy from a Toyota dealer?
thanks for any info!
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What an innocent fellow you are. You've never bought a car from a dealer before, have you?
Car prices are made of Play-Doh. That's life, son. Get used to it.
Oh, read this. It will help: http://tinyurl.com/a73uq
--
TeGGeR


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says...

LOL. it's true! i'm a total virgin. was it that obvious? well, sorta. not new cars and not Toyotas with Access Pricing. i guess i didn't/don't know how to handle being told there was "no negotiation."

url doesn't work for me ... ?
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Opened ok for me.
Good advice on buying a car, especially the part about if it's a hot seller. They just stick their nose into the air and let you go.
--


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Don't know why. It just opened fine for me.
An excerpt from that URL:

There is one big one: Have the willingness to walk away. That's the one and only weapon they have zero answer for. Don't use this tactic as a bluff. It won't work. You have to really mean it, and that takes some guts.
Just remember, they see people like you every hour of every day. Every tactic you'll try, everythng you say, they've heard it all a dozen times over. You will not fool them and you will not say anything new. Walking out is the one thing they can't control and cannot fight, except by dropping their price.
If you decide to walk away, be firm and don't look back. Don't hesitate. Don't vacillate. You might just find a call from the salesman on your answering machine when you get home, or you will be physically pushed back into your seat, meaning you're going to get your price. If they let you walk, your price was unrealistically low.
Having said all that, you've also got to be realistic in your expectations. If a car is a hot seller, the ball's in their court and you will be unlikely to get any sort of break on the price they want for it. If you get up and walk out because you can't get your price on a hot seller, they'll let you go.
If at all possible, avoid financing and trade-ins unless you have no choice. Those two things are where they get most of their money. Do your homework, then walk in with a set, ON-THE-ROAD price, and stick to it, asking the salesman "what can you give me for that price?". On-the-road means the final bill after ALL charges of ANY kind are added in. Don't budge, and don't let them tack on other charges to your on-the-road price at invoice time. If they do, get up and walk out.
The above approach gives the salesman the impression you're serious, that you have the cash, and he will be hard-pressed to let you leave without finding something that will fit the check amount you'll write.
He's more likely to hunt around for you for something to fit your price. You may end up with a less-than-popular options package, or an unpopular color, but at least you've got your price.
Oh, and one more thing: Forget this "below invoice" nonsense pushed by some consumer groups. It's a mug's game and you won't win it.
--
TeGGeR

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
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More from that URL:
Others have given good advice in this thread. Here are some warnings about sly tricks.
If your wife is with you and the salesman leaves you alone in a little office while he "checks with the sales manager", watch what you say. Dealers have been known to bug such places so they can get hints about how ready you really are to buy and what your price is.
Watch the guy with the adding machine! Re-check his totals. They've been known to tell you they're knocking $ off and slip them right back in again. Not so important if there aren't a lot of options.
Don't be a rug merchant. Haggling is all very well but don't be too greedy. Know what the car is worth and don't ask for too large a price cut.
Make sure your bank or credit union can't do better for you than their finance guy. If you have cash from a personal line of credit at your bank, don't tell the dealer. He may be giving you a deal on the car with the intent of screwing you on the financing.
With hybrids, don't forget to factor the cost of replacement batteries into the maintenance costs.
Then there's that 'extended warranty' business which I'll leave others to comment on.
----------------------------------------
Another pece of advice, related to the excerpt above. Shop ALONE. If you bring your wife, they /will/ find a way of working the two of you against each other, to your disadvantage. Your wife should decide beforehand what she wants, then YOU (or her) go in alone to negotiate.
--
TeGGeR


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awesome advice! thanks.
say, do you wanna come help me haggle a price for this car?
the one thing i have going for me is that there's six or seven Toyota dealerships in Vancouver city proper ... i could "walk away" from a bunch of them no problem.
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wrote:
~um ... sorry if this has been gone over a million times. i tried a ~google search in this newsgroup + edmonds auto but nothing definitive ~and current has come about. ~ ~with the price of gas going nuts in Canada (and particularly ~schizophrenic in Vancouver), i also find myself in the market for a new ~car. i'm looking at a 2005 Echo RS (or waiting for the new + rumoured ~Echo 2006/Vitz -- supposedly due anytime between now and december). ~after all is said and done with my package i've gone from a base of ~$12000 to over $22000, after taxes, freight, etc. ~ ~but what is the deal with Access Pricing? on several parts of the Toyota ~website, it states that individual Toyota dealers are allowed to set ~prices ... and yet five different Toyota dealers i've spoken to have ~identical pricing -- with no room for negotiation. ~ ~i've even asked them point-blank "so if there's nothing to negotiate, ~why should i buy from you or any other Toyota dealer?" ALL of them ~replied with "service", and two of them also added, "but there really ~isn't any difference." (i'm paraphrasing, of course.) ~ ~i've found info on lawsuits against Toyota for "price-fixing" because of ~Access Toyota, and also rumours of the demise of the Access program ... ~but those date back more than one year. ~ ~so ... is Access Toyota REALLY here to stay? any pointers for a buyer ~interested in a new Toyota? and also: does Access Pricing also apply to ~any used Toyotas i might buy from a Toyota dealer? ~ ~thanks for any info!
Hey, the access price is $20 below MSRP -- what more do you want? Toyota feels that's a fair <cough> market price in Canada.
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You are doing well, if on a cash deal, the dealer pays your one tax. You are doing very well if he pays both taxes, this is unlikely.
On a $30000 msrp, the dealer profit is about 15% without any rebates or incentives. ($4500). Some dealers will not negotiate, unless there quota is not met. So getting it down to $27900,, would be notting to sneeze at. Try buying on the net, and not in person, stick with the one dealer for awhile, ( about 5 or 10 emails.)
Some models are so hot that they could sell over the msrp, as supply is short. Supply to the west coast got the short end of the stick onceinawhile.
wrote:

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