Unscrupulous VW service dept.?

Gary:

This is a tough road, but if you have some of the basic characteristics of a Pit-Bull, you can make progress.

1. Contact your VW Zone Manager. This may take some finagling to get directly to that individual, you will get an unbelievable amount of smoke and mirrors but you will eventually prevail. Give that individual chapter-and-verse exactly what happened, days, dates, times, and all the specifics you have. Do this in writing, copy your state Attorney General, and if you are an AAA member, copy them as well. Also copy the NEW CAR section of that dealership. This is for documentation purposes to establish your claim and to establish that you went the full route within the VW system.
2. Get your complaints verified by an independent mechanic. Another VW dealer would be perfect if possible... and lest you think that is impossible, some years back a VW dealer around here got put out of business because of its service habits as other dealers were tired of undoing their messes. But GET SUPPORT from another mechanic that is CERTIFIED. Not just a shade-tree guy. There are actually forensic mechanics out there, if you are an AAA member, start with them to find one. They may even support the initial examination.
3. If you can get your complaints verified, and the limits of your money-damages are within the parameters of your local Small-Claims court file there immediately. DO NOT file if you are simply relying on your word and 'common sense'. The judge will throw it out unheard. But, two things happen if you file. The dealership will be required to respond with an attorney, that will cost them at-least thousands of dollars for the preparations and for the in-court representations. And, they will be required to prepare a specific response to your complaint, not just stonewall you. If, by chance, they do not show up on your hearing day you will also win automatically... and as long as the dealer remains in business, you _WILL_ collect in that case. You, by the way, DO NOT need an attorney to take this route. Just the time and the filing fees (small) which you get back if you win.
4. If you have the time and the inclination, and the physical circumstances permit it, form an Informational Picket outside the dealership. Check with your local township on this, but in most cases, you would be allowed to park your vehicle with a large sign near to the dealership and 'invite reasoned discussion' about your experience with passers-by.
5. Seek out others who have been burnt by this shop. Post in your local Supermarkets, churches, libraries and other venues that allow public posting. Post on the internet. If this shop is as bad as you suggest, there will be bodies piled up all over the place. There is strength in numbers and much that can be done with a few people that cannot be done by you alone.

Most unscrupulous shops do not survive long unless they are the only game in town. Similarly, those that are unscrupulous are so because of a momentary aberation in management for the reason noted above. Keep in mind also that the New Car Dealer and the Service Department are not necessarily the same people, with the Service group typically leasing space from the dealer (at a very handsome % rent). So, you will affect the New Car Dealer directly by your activities. That will get the attention that may do you some good.

There is no instant cure outside television and the Bible.

Peter Wieck Wyncote, PA

Care to provide some details on why you think they are unscrupulous?

You need to call a lawyer.

Where do you go to find the zone manager? VWOA? VW dealers? Is there one particular person at VWOA that you can write to with complaints? I used to have the name and address of an individual but I lost it. I wasn't aware of the fact that some service departments are leased out. Is this common with VW? Is there a way to find this out?

Thanks for the info.

The zone manager for your district may be reached either through VWoA or the dealership. As to Service being a separate entity from Sales, that is common across many brands, not just VW. *Mostly* both entities are held by the same company, individual or group, but not always.

Peter Wieck Wyncote, PA

Let's hear all the facts first!

Old business - posted in late Jan. and in ealy feb. timing belt noise - dealer couldn't look at it till next week - didn't tell him not to drive it gary took it to a ( vw jobber ?, i think that's the word he used) and the independant guy said shut it off and said don't drive it -- the belt was flappin' and shot . i responded to his post with a remark from one of his first posts in Jan, and you peter, asked what i was talking about.. I then posted the dates of his posts in a one line post, --- papa pounced on me for being a troll. ( apologized too) I feel sorry for gary cuz he did all the duck steps that vw ask in maintaining his vw with all the inspections paid for and maint. items done at the dealer and had he let the belt fail vw would have had to replace everything at no cost to him, but he paid the the indenpendent guy. Something about rust being noted one time .. waterpump or tensioner replaced w/o being asked to buy a new belt at that time. Gary , tell your story , I won't say a word on this anymore. :-x

Thanks Peter for the info. It's been really helpful.

Where are the zone managers usually located? At Hamilin Rd in Rochester MI? Or ar they lcated in the state or area of their zone?

This is indeed old business and I am still waiting for word from VOA on their decision. You capsulised it perfectly except there was nothing about rust. The dealer did the waterpump on warranty but never suggested the TB should be changed as well. Also dealer said TB and it's components are not covered under powertrain warranty.........BUT

This is not the incident I am asking about now. It concerns another dealer (the one I bought my car at and who did all my maintenance until last summer. I brought my 2000 Beetle in after someone spilled pop in my gear shift, for it to be cleaned out. After it was cleaned for $250, it started sticking again about a week later. They said to bring it back to be recleaned. They called and said they tried to reclean it but they found the shift solenoid to be burned out and needed to be replaced for a large amount of money. I had to wait to have this done so I picked up the car and it was obvious that they never removed to console and thus never attempted to reclean the shifter. When I took it to an independent mechanic, the solenoid was find and only needed a little better cleaning. It has been working perfect ever since. Now a friend of mine just brought her 2003 Jetta in for a check engine light. They told her she needed a new combi valve for around $650. Before she brought it in for the scheduled work I marked the combi valve to make sure they really replaced it. After she picked it up, we found that they hadn't replaced anything! The marked combi valve was still there.

National Office: Manager, Customer Relations Volkswagen United States, Inc.

Colin Gour is one name to start with. Keith Price another.

If there is any way that you can view the Dealership Agreement for your problem dealer, they it be signed by the Zone Manager and are renewed on a fairly regular basis.

I guess we are lucky. There are two dealers of good repute about equi- distant from us (we have used both in the past with no complaints), Holberts and North Penn. We have purchased three vehicles from Holberts over the years, new and used. They were instrumental in getting considerable past-warranty service for my wife's Beetle and have always been responsive and helpful.

At this point, both our VWs are long past warranty and so we use our local shop, a family business working out of the same location and has just enjoyed its 50th (yep, 50th) anniversary. The shop is ancient, but the equipment is not.

Peter Wieck Wyncote, PA

If this can be proved, the state consumer affairs office should be involved. I'd suggest also contacting the local television stations as they love to do stories on this type of stuff...

Thanks for clearing up what this latest thread was about, makes me more sympathetic to the matter.

I stand by my original answer, to call a lawyer -- but now I'd advise that the lawyer be your local district attorney or your state's attorney general's office.

Isn't it amazing, after all the bad press and negative PR car dealers have suffered over the years, that they still try this kind of stuff? I once took my '85 Jetta in to a VW dealer to have a rear wheel bearing replaced, and when I returned for it, the service manager took me aside, put his arm around my shoulder, and said, "Mr. Running, we know that you're a conscientious, safe driver, and if you knew that there was anything at all wrong with your car, you'd want it repaired right away. So, we noticed that your brakes needed replacement, and we went ahead and did a full brake job on your car, without asking you first. We knew you'd want it done." They were asking something over $400 for the brake job, in addition to the wheel bearing. I was stunned. I said, "Take it off, I didn't ask for it, undo the brake job." He stammered, said they couldn't do that, and I said, "Where's the manager's office." He went with me, and only a couple of minutes later, I was leaving with a free brake job.

How on earth do dealerships think they can treat customers this way, and still stay in business?

I really think they count on ripped-off customers to just give up because they have to jump through so many hoops and get the runaround from all these agencies that are supposed to help consumers. I basically gave up on the the whole pop spill thing because these agencies required me to take my car to three mechanics and pay for them to take the console out and check the solenoid to see if it needed to be replaced or was cleanable at $250 + a shot! It didn't even matter that the service manager admitted to me! But now with this latest thing, it fired me all up again.

This dealer (Osborn VW in Lakewood CO.) is the worst dealer I have ever dealt with. When I bought my Beetle there they had different owners and were pretty good. But when the Osborn's took over, things really went down hill fast. The only reason I kept going to them is because they were the only close dealer to where I live. The other one's are over 2 hours or more away. The list of things they've done is so long but I will tell about a couple of the more egregious things they've done, besides the 2 just mentioned: When changing my oil, I watched them take the belly pan off my car. When I went to pay they told me I must have lost the pan while driving and they tried to charge me for a new one! When I told them that I saw them take it off, they blamed it on a "new mechanic" who I've seen there for at least 2 years! When my Dad and me went to test drive the new 2006 GTI last year we were told that they were required by "homeland security" for us to give them our social security numbers to make sure we weren't terrorists! When we refused, they tried to forcibly keep us there and said they would call the FBI! When my 74 year old Dad threatened to punch the salesman, they let us go.

One thing I forgot to mention is; You can tell VOA about this stuff until you are blue in the face and they won't do a thing about it!

did you rate the dealers here?

Perhaps you could hire an attorney. Even then you will probably lose because they usually charge a whopping fee of 33 percent or more. Have you considered small claims court? I think that can be handled without an attorney.

And you are correct about the BBB. Not only does it have no teeth, it is a business advocate, not a consumer advocate.

try to see if you have a consumer protection agency in your state ,they have alot more teeth and if they get too many complaints about a dealer like that they take it to the attorney general themselves ,another thing to do is find out if other people is having trouble ,too ,then contact your local network affiliated stations and find out if they do those kind of stories and let me tell you something, dealers hate that kind of attention . good luck