need good forum site for sand/buff/polish old paint back

I am trying to find a good forum for finding advise to solve a problem with a faded dirty 15 yr. old finish with sanding, buffing and polishing. I have
got sand papers, a m/c, and one version of polishing compound, and a wax, but my attempts so far have not been completely successful. Can you guys point me to a good, better, best forum site so I can finally get around to spending some time on this specific task. I haven't been to successful on this either yet.
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Fifteen years is not old for a finish, is it sun damage, and does it have a clear coat?
Tell me exactly what you are using and in what sequence. What sand paper, wet and dry or flint (heaven forbid), final grit should be no more than 1500 grit and would be better to be 2000. Buffer/polisher, rpm, bonnet, sponge pad, whose are they? What compound, how many different grits?
Mainly how bad is the condition of the paint? Next, if it is savable, cover the car before you start and do a small area at a time, no more than a fender. You'll be slinging the light compounds all over and it can save you some cleanup time. Sanding should be as little as possible and as fine as will allow it to cut off the damaged surface using water. Then you can start with a wool cutdown pad and work your way to the finish buffing pad with the very fine, normally white, buffing compound. Tape all leading edges, cutting into, before you hit it with the buffer and cut through.
Let me know what you don't understand and I'm try to help you through it.
--
Dad
05 C6 Silver/Red 6spd Z51
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love to, have it together for tomorrow
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http://meguiarsonline.com
Check out their Detailing 101 and G-100 Dual Action Polisher section. Polish/Wax technology has come a long way in the past several years. You can get a great finish with a lot less effort with some of these products.

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The almost new machine is a Simoniz 8" Random Orbit Polisher/Waxer from Canadian Tire: http://canadiantire.ca/browse/product_detail.jsp?FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id 08474396673156&PRODUCT%3C%3Eprd_id„5524443251621&bmUID66546252860&assortment=primary&fromSearch=true It has about 1-1/4`` of various foam layers, incl. flat app. surface, and came with 4 elastic wrap around access., 2 terry, 1 micro-fibre like rubber-lined for dryness, and 1 foam wrap
The compound is 3M Rubbing Compound``: "Removes scratches, swirl marks and water spots....Clear coat safe....removes grade 1500 or finer sanding scratches, medium oxidation, coarse swirl marks, or water marks, and leaves a fine finish". Says to use with a "compounding pad".:
http://www3.3m.com/catalog/us/en001/home_leisure/-/node_GSRNM1L51Lgs/root_GST1T4S9TCgv/vroot_GSHCV1ZFXKge/bgel_GS4ZY13BPGbl/gvel_V2G53V0FBRgl/theme_us_homeleisure_3_0/command_AbcPageHandler/output_html
I've got 220, 320 400, 600, 1000, 1500, & 2000 Silicone Carbide waterproof sandpapers; generally 3M Auto-Pak Wetordry, from Walmart.
Nu-Finish (soft paste) in the round orange canister, from Zellers. Synthetic, no wax. Used to use a wax. The once a year, Consumer`s Reports best Nu-finish paste.
http://www.nufinish.com/products.html
They also have a Scratch Remover. I wonder if this or anything else would be a good idea.:
i use a car wash, synthetic wool mitts, white terry towels, shop rags, syth chamois, mag cleaner, windex, vac, do the wells, etc. wet wash rinse dry even twice. Not my vette so stop there.
I must confess this is not for my black Corvettte, its for a green 1997 Ford Escort (only 10 yrs.old). The front hood ONLY has seen better days. I must have applied something in the hot (after running/sun). After I wash it, I can wipe my finger across it, and it feels smooth, and nothing comes away, and the problem seems in the finish. It is like dirty blotches. If you could describe a paint finish like filthy wallpaper. Whatever fixes this may `fix`any other problems; oxidation whatever I cannot describe otherwise now. I may have done scratch damage trying to fix it, don`t know. Been watching too many car shows. I`m even guessing this is a clear coat car.. With my procedure it seems to have gotten some of the dirt out, like a giant Mr.Clean stain eraser came out of the sky, did a short jig, and left. Like a 20 second water-only rag on filthy wallpaper. But I have left obvious scratches, full length. Less blotches, or more, dep. Overall, don`t know if its better, or worse. Its a mess. Its not serious.
I was gonna go from 600 though all of the higher grits incl 2000. But it would take forever. So I decided to experiment with 600, seriously in spots, only. May have done a once over with higher. Wasn`t running a hose, using a bucket, probably not good. Dried. Then I use the machine and the compound. I used the micro-fibre like fine nap (looks like a terry towel used down to nothing). Then I use Nu-finish Paste wax, by hand I think. Prob do at least twice a year. Usu wash regularly. (much) Less since problem occured.
Done this before and I swear I`m putting a ton of effort into it each time BUT nothing is happening. I`m thinking if I did it yet again, with similar amount of time & effort, but different approach &/or products it must work. Without need of re-paint. Wouldn`t get one anyway. Just stop washing the car (usu. 6hrs/wk.) Bought a m/c. Same. I assume I need to get a different compound than the rubbing compound I have, or a combination of them. Maybe new applicator pads. Washed the mint cond. ones I have. Don`t know which applicators to use. and a different sandpaper method, to get rid of, and not leave scratches.
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www.mothers.com they have a detailing guide.
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Well remember what i am asking. I have followed the general instuctions again recently with these specific products I acquired for that purpose. I tried before with other products - Meguiars "something compound". It didn't work either. It took a lot of effort. It can be done with the same amount of effort. Given different products, or a differnent number of products. I am not sure what the problem is, nor the correct products, but the execution is pretty much a given, as is the effort.
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The random orbital is way to tame to do what you are trying to accomplish. You need a buffer that turns 1,200 to 2,500 RPM with a cut down bonnet, wool. But first you need to clean up the dead paint surface. That's were the sand paper you have comes into the picture. With a good light on it to see the paint through the water and sanding residue try to clean a spot with 600 grit using a rubber sanding block. Doing it with just your hand will put deeper scratches in the paint from the pressure points of you hand. If that don't clean it up go with just a little bit more coarse paper, maybe 400, but avoid that if you can. When your paint look good with water running over it then go with a finer paper. When you think the sand paper has done all of the work you can expect go to the buffer with a wool cut down bonnet.
You will find that the paint gets hot and that will make it flow and kill the sanding scratches. It will actually soften and blend much the same way it will using a blending agent to blend and fade paint, but on a much smaller scale. You should be using something like 3M 06011 Microfinish, careful, even with that light cutting compound you can eat through a surface quick. Now change to a fine finishing sponge pad and repeat. Using the same sponge pad cleaned, go to a 3M 05993 liquid polish. Very thin and will fly all over the place but it will leave no scratches and will take out any blushing that the first two buffs may have left. After you complete this buff you should see no scratches from any of the previous work. If you do it's an easy task to lightly sand that area with 2000 and re-buff.
Always buff away from the edges and tape any that you may hit rotating into them. Open the hood a tad so you don't hit the fender edges. Do tight corners and grooves by hand after you're done buffing. By then you will see how quick it can be done once you have the sequence mastered.
Sorry I can't help you use the products you have but they just don't work as well as the 3M that I've used over the years of auto body repair and restoration. At the very least tell the paint guru what you have and see if it is as good or the same. They sell stuff by being helpful.
Good luck,
--
Dad
05 C6 Silver/Red 6spd Z51
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You state turns 1200 to 2500 rpm is required. The m/c I have is 2600opm, but is "too tame". Do I need something that rotates? (as opposed to oscillates). Are we talking about a rotation only? In which case I'm loking for a different type of tool. You did use the word "Buffer", where the one I have now is termed a Polisher/Waxer". Would either of these tools I own now do (they are a lot off?
4-1/2" angle grinder:
"A great tool for all your cutting, grinding, and polishing needs, 7A motor, 10,600 rpm " http://canadiantire.ca/browse/product_detail.jsp?PRODUCT%3C%3Eprd_id „5524443291144&FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id08474396672863&bmUID66578256815
or
1/2" hammer drill:
"Variable speed and reversible: 0-1,100 RPM allows for control and versatility " http://canadiantire.ca/browse/product_detail.jsp?PRODUCT%3C%3Eprd_id „5524443290986&FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id08474396673420&bmUID66578487994
Starting with the 600 Si-C, do I do a thorough job, touching everything everywhere with the same quantity/quality approach. Should I cover all ground equally on purpose?. Is this the point, or should I be doing as little as possible, and troubleshoot it, (only if needed). And what should be the next choice after the 600, 1000, 1500, or 2000. Or all? How should I approach that? Do everything, everywhere, or do a minimum, just doing where I went with the 600? Again, is it a minimum possible thing, or a chore.
Then you state a rubber block, wool cut down bonnet, fine finishing sponge pad, 3M 06011 Microfinish, 3M 05993 liquid polish. I'm gonna google for a better idea of the differences of the bonnet and pad for the next little while though. And see if rpm is used to describe a unit, beside one thats similar, but opm 'ing.
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ok, second round of questions
I am not sure I understand the problem I have, or the solution, and my previous questions are legit. I was just asking what is it gonna look like if I sand the finish w/ 600 + o/ only random areas to get rid of the dirty spots, but leave unsanded areas and everything in between. You said something about blending, so maybe you know something I don't about how the later process with the m/c will hide all the sanding, and then the answer will be "just do it". If understand your previous posts correctly, I can run a stream of water over the areas I have sanded already to see if the sanding has done its job (of getting it clean), and it will simulate a post m/c finish by hiding the scratches any/all which may or may not be here/there/anywhere/everywhere.
What exactly is the m/c I have now good for, and similarly what about the rubbing compound I have. Would these 2 things actually go together? Would either play any part in routine regular maintenance, which I like to do. Is my m/c a useless novelty? The problem is, there are soo many 3M compounds I can't keep track. I knew I needed a m/c, but wan't thinking which kind of m/c.
If I took the car to a detailing shop and said do the hood how much would they charge, and would they tell me to do the entire cars paint for it. If this gets up in price I ain't gonna want to pay for it. Still wanna know. I'll wait for thee m/c s to go on sale, theres no hurry. Is this an appropraite m/c?:
This place has nothing like what I'm looking for, but everything goes on sale. (no affil)
http://canadiantire.ca/browse/subcategory_landing.jsp?FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id 08474396672467&bmUID66637512769
2600 rpm, not opm, not too large, not too small, preferably not a cordless. I got to be honest, if it is a $200 m/c only, and I had/had to get the other products, I'd be pulling my hair out asking you where/how to get a m/c for less for this job. I wonder if I can rent one in Toronto.
I'm gonna go to a NAPA www site, to look around.
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heres one, can't find the other yet
http://www3.3m.com/catalog/us/en001/home_leisure/-/node_GSB69GQQNVbe/root_GST1T4S9TCgv/vroot_GSHCV1ZFXKge/gvel_GSRRLXTKF3gl/theme_us_homeleisure_3_0/command_AbcPageHandler/output_html
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I know theres lots of time. An auto parts store other than a dealership, e.g NAPA is something I almost never do. However I had to go there for Plasticote Vinyl Color which is great (the only way) for painting plastic parts, like computers. Anyways if I can get something I need at this link, I know it will be local, cheap, and I can wait for sale, can always get it, etc.
http://canadiantire.ca/browse/subcategory_landing.jsp ;jsessionid=FJXY1s6Dy1bvMjmoa5qzeSpSCMtOKoWE7xhCfKOkmUd32Vaj1QGk!-1838641420!172915483!7205!7305?postal=m4g+2r9&FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id08474396672467&bmForm=form_set_price_list&bmFormID66645144702&bmUID66645144702&bmHash;cc5f826f1c4c497fa4896e439d47dcaaa865fe
heres the same link as the m/c s agaiin, but do you think you can point out if they have the appropriate: 1)wool cut down bonnet, 2)fine finishing sponge pad
these are on pages 2 and 3, after the machines. If not, no problem, just more out of the (regular) way, especially for consumables
p.s. this is geting ahead of myself in post order, but I couldn't find liquid polish at 3M.com, or any m/c at napaonline.com
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http://canadiantire.ca/browse/subcategory_landing.jsp ;jsessionid=FJXY1s6Dy1bvMjmoa5qzeSpSCMtOKoWE7xhCfKOkmUd32Vaj1QGk!-1838641420!172915483!7205!7305?postal=m4g+2r9&FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id08474396672467&bmForm=form_set_price_list&bmFormID66645144702&bmUID66645144702&bmHash;cc5f826f1c4c497fa4896e439d47dcaaa865fe
nothing bad meant, just wondering what x-mas spirits have you been indulging in ? :-)
happy holidays
--
"Key"
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Yes, you can do just those spots that need sanding, the catch is to stay in the clear coat. If you start sanding the metalic green color the game is over.

Correct.
All I can offer is what I know works for me, your material may be the same but I can only give you 3M numbers for reference.

3M doesn't go on sale where I live.

http://canadiantire.ca/browse/subcategory_landing.jsp?FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id 08474396672467&bmUID66637512769
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A while back, there was a segment on the Trucks! tv show, where the host (the good one, Stacey) took an old abused 10 or 15 year old bronco/blazer type suv (with a clear coat), laid out the tools, and demoed the process on one half of the hood, showing you what to do and what not to do. I know that seems an odd source for corvette info, but it was a good show when he was on it.
The site is difficult to navigate and I haven't looked in depth (http://www.truckstv.com/sites/trucks /), but from the front page there is a link that indicates you can download old shows for a fee. It obviously wouldn't be the same as a tutored class on the subject, but if you can find the one I'm referring to, it might be worthwhile.
The episode listing also has a link to all of the products and tools they used during each episode, so it would also give you a handle on where to get what you need.
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been there done that
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NO!
http://canadiantire.ca/browse/product_detail.jsp?PRODUCT%3C%3Eprd_id „5524443291144&FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id08474396672863&bmUID66578256815
NO!
NO!
http://canadiantire.ca/browse/product_detail.jsp?PRODUCT%3C%3Eprd_id „5524443290986&FOLDER%3C%3Efolder_id08474396673420&bmUID66578487994
NO!
There are some good sponge cutdown pads but they still come up short of the wool.
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what about the opm vs rpm. Since you stated my m/c is too weak, but at the 2600 you stated, I'd like to clear that up. Is the m/c you recommend a rpm-type m/c? Or is there something else I am missing?
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I have never seen or used a random orbital to buff a bad paint finish that required sanding to correct the problem.
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