I recently had major repairs to my '99 Dodge Ram 2500. I had the timing chain cover and gears, water pump, and thermostat replaced, as well as a coolant system flush (among multiple other repairs). Today, 250 miles later, I spring an antifreeze leak. The guy says that the bypass hose in the thermostat housing is what sprung a leak and is not related to the repairs already performed. My question is shouldn't they have inspected the hose when the water pump and thermostat were replaced? Any ideas?
I can't imagine replacing the water pump without replacing the bypass hose. To replace the water pump on a gasoline powered '99 you have to remove the bypass hose from the water pump. The hose should cost a few dollars tops.
Tracy, inspecting a hose for wear-n-tear is an objective view. If, at the time maintenance was being performed, the mechanic determined that your bypass hose were not so far gone that it required replacing, was his professional opinion. Up until the day you took the truck in for the maintenance, I will assume you've never had a problem with the bypass hose. So, had the mechanic replaced that hose and told you later that he did so because he thought it should have been replaced, your comment below would focus on whether or not you think the mechanic "ripped you off" by replacing a perfectly good hose with a new one!
Auto ma> I recently had major repairs to my '99 Dodge Ram 2500. I had the timing
Bullshit. No mechanic in his right mind would replace a water pump and re-use a $2 hose. To do so is complete incompetence, given the cost of the replacement hose vs. the amount of labor required to get to it.
As an after thought, you might look into whether or not they even replaced the water pump. The water pump should be easy to find because the hose that comes off of the bottom of the radiator goes into the water pump and the hose from the top of the radiator goes to the thermostat housing just above the cut off hose in question. The cut off hose is a molded piece with a 90 degree turn and has just enough rubber to connect it at either end. The water pump and thermostat housing will be behind a bracket and you may need a flashlight and/or mirror to see in there. Look for new hose clamps and clean, new gasket and/or silicon sealing compound between the water pump and engine block (this may be very difficult to see).
I'm not suggesting the mechanic in question defrauded you, but, if you suspect fraud and aren't experienced enough to tell the difference between old and 250 mile old parts, take it to another mechanic for a diagnosis.
I did a quick search online and found them ranging in price from $14.99 to $4.59. Given the hourly rate for an automotive technician to get that far into this repair the difference between $2 and $15 (at the high end) is insignificant and not replacing it makes me suspect the technician in question. Before the repair was even started he should have said "lets replace all your belts and hoses because it will cost you less now than later" and she could have made up her own mind. I don't think Tom's statement is the least suspect.
Even if it were $10, so what? You still have to remove it from the pump to replace the pump and its is an inexpensive hose that damn well should have been replaced since it was half removed anyway.
Hell, I can't remember but a handful of time when replacing a pump that I didn't have to cut or otherwise damage the bypass hose to get it off, so it is ALWAYS smart to replace them. Even a simple minded shadetree mechanic would replace the hose(s)
I second that! I understand Tom has stuffed so much knowledge into his brain that, he keeps having to find increasingly larger hats to put on his noggin, and he's seriously top-heavy! OTOH, I learn something new every day... and forget two!
On my personal vehicles I'm working on, no way in the world would I fail to replace that PITA hose. But from my "production" mechanic days yes I DO see the reason(s) for not doing it if it looks okay.
Please remember, ALL of my comments are predicated on "IF IT LOOKS OKAY!" See above again if you forget.
Production, the customer has to be contacted to get approval. Very slow for almost no money. Think about it, you can't put it back together while you're waiting for approval. If you do it without approval you'll get hammered for unnecessary work. If the customer asks for the old parts and "IT LOOKS OKAY", you'll be busted for unnecessary work. Some people would demand their money back in that situation.
Self interest, if it fails they'll be back and you'll get paid again.
Bear in mind these aren't my reasonings, they're just things I picked up on in a few years of mechanic work. Also note I'm NOT in that line of work anymore. I don't like production mechanic work. I used to enjoy working on my own stuff but I'm older now and just as soon let someone else fool with anything major these days. I can't even justify the $10 I save on oil changes vs. the hour it takes me to do one at home from start to cleaned up.
So, were you ripped off? No, I don't think so. I think it was just bad luck. That hose on my wife's '93 Ramcharger (yes a magnum engine like in your '99) lasted 180,000 miles. My '93 Ramcharger is at 150,000 miles on the original hose(s).
Why yes, I HAVE adopted the "if it ain't broke dont' fix it attitude", glad you asked. But when I DO fix things I do it all so it doesn't have to be done again, like that stinking little PITA hard to get to hose.
Now that I've covered the "stinking little PITA hose" to death, did you know the leak "might" be the intake gasket and NOT related to the infamous "stinking little hose?" Until you can get it apart you can't be certain. That happened to the wife's '93 Ramcharger as well.
Let's expand on your post for a minute. I'm NOT knocking you, it's just a good place to make a point.
I doubt ANY shop is buying parts on the internet. When I was doing this for a living we bought things from retail outlets, mostly NAPA motor parts, remember when it WAS motor parts? Anyway we got jobber prices, for the sake of argument, let's say your $15.00 is retail and $10.00 is jobber cost. In the early to mid seventies our (the one shop where I KNEW what it was, it's probably more now ) markup was 182%. So now we're at $18.20 retail for the hose alone.
Now let's consider labor. I know I'm on thin ice with the magnum engine but did the job the original poster have done require the A/C compressor and bracket be removed? If not I think those need to be removed to get to the intake end of the hose? (See these--->???, those are question marks, means I'm asking a question and assuming to be true until shown otherwise) How much labor is that? .3, .4, .5 hours? At what labor rate? $80 , $100/ hr? So now maybe we're talking around an extra $75 for the hose that might have looked okay?
Since my other post in this thread I had another thought. It's also possible the shop didn't do the original job correctly and are trying to cover their ass, as it were with a red herring. We may never know the entire story here.
I really appreciate the information from all of you who replied. I got a call from the mechanic this morning. They say that the hose could have gone at anytime, and I am responsible for parts ($6.50 for the kit) and labor ($74.50 an hour). I do understand that the need for a hose being replaced is objective view of the mechanic, but considering I just shelled out $3,000 last Wednesday for all the other repairs, I guess I am just little pissy about paying them anymore money. Especially considering they placed new parts on either side of an old hose. I am by NO means very mechanically inclined, but even I know, that old hoses don't hold up to new parts very well. So, thanks again for your help.
That is why any good service writer or mechanic should package in those lower cost parts that are know to cause problems as part of the job especially for any vehicle as old as a 99. The customer knows the cost up front and knows you are a pro-active service center. You send the job out knowing that the probability of that vehicle coming back with a related failure is very low, you make alittle money off the part and labor without raping the cust., there are no come backs and everybody is happy. It is called service and in my opinion sending out any job with even a slightly questionable part with out atleast contacting the cust is not considered service. You would think that shops would be trying to find all the work they can, that's how they make money. I think any person would rather say that there repair cost alittle more than they expected then say that after spending all that money they still had problems and had to take there vehicle back to the shop. Makes no sense to me.
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