Re: Ford Posts Loss of $5.8 Billion, Worst Since '92

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something wonderfully witty: <snip>


How many Billions to Iraq? How much is wasted in social programs that has just led people to become dependant on public largess? Social Security dollars dumped into the general fund to be squandered year after year with no return on investment. I was a soldier, a career one matter of fact. At no time during my entire career did I ever really feel I was really defending the country. I could go on, but the only point I am making is that it is a two-sided coin with worth that has grown a little to large for its britches.

highway, but I think I'll pass. I do motorcycle in good weather though. Does that count?
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ZombyWoof
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Jeff wrote:

Really? Where do you buy your used cars?
Here in the real world used cars go for about 3/4 the price of a new one, with 50K-70K on the odometer. As a matter of fact I have seen used cars selling in suburban Phillly for more than the new ones cost. Don't know who would buy them. The local Jeep dealer had a used Wrangler on the lot with a sticker of $16,900 while on the other side of the lot sat a new Wrangler with a sticker of $16,800. The used Jeep had about 50K miles on ot too! I think they keep the price of used stuff high to get people to buy new.
Mark
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Price stickers are startingpoint for negotiations
A used car may have a lot of extras installed
Nemisis wrote:

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Because the new car side of the lot doesn't offer buy here pay here, the the fool buying the over priced used one's credit is soo screwed up he cant buy a new one, and the lot doesnt mind repoing it and selling six times before its actualy gone.
Whitelightning
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wrote

Really? According to Kelly Blue Book, a 2001 Ford Taurus with 70,000 mi should be around $5,000 to $6,000 depending on condition and accessories (private party price).

And which had more accessories? Probably the used one. You are comparing a Jeep that costs around $30,000 new to one that costs $20,000 new (list price).

And, if you were a dealer, what would you do? Sell cars at the minimum profit to keep you in business or try to make as much money as you can on each vehible. Hell, if they could sell a used one for $50,000, they would. In fact, if anyone is interested in my used Contour for only $50,000, you can buy it today.
Jeff

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something wonderfully witty:

and yes if you are flexible on the options it does make a difference. Case in point I originally want to buy a 2/3 year old pickup to avoid the initial depreciation hit. Most of the ones available for sale in my area were fully equipped XLT/LT models in the $18k range with about 30/40k miles on the clock. I was able to get a 2005 Ford SXT, V8, auto, air, cd, tow package, stepside body new design during the 2005 model year for $18,444 out the door. Which vehicle was the better buying decision? The used one with milage and a minimal warranty or the new, redesigned model with a full factory warranty?
If their used pricing was a trick to get me to buy new it certainly worked in my case, but what are they going to do with that used vehicle?
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wrote

Every employer with 5 or more emplyeees is required to do all of those except the Health Insurance, and big companies arent mandated to do that ether
Whitelightning
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Really? I see what you mean. There are fewer and fewer cars on the road and fewer and fewer cars sold every year. Families have fewer cars than ever before.</sarcasm>
In real life, more often, there are families with more cars than drivers.
Actually, adjusting for inflation, is the cost of a car more or less than it was say 30 years ago? Actually, about 0.2% more for domestic cars. Then, also adjust for the fact that cars last longer no than 30 years ago. So the price of a car has actually been falling when adjusting for inflation, decreased maintaince and increased life-span.

You can always by a used car without airbags, antilock brakes or other safety equipment.

Requiring drive by wire in 2 1/2 years? Are you nuts? No one does than now. It will take more than 2 1/2 years to bring that on. It might be that some cars will be drive by wire, but not more than a few.
Jeff

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It is all relative, I guess. In 1955 the median income was $3,200. I bought my first HOT car, a Black/White 1955 Buick Century 2 dr hardtop for around $3,900. My wage at the time a quite respectable $1,84 an hour, about $3,800 a year.
When I was in college in 1947 I worked in a gas station for the minimum wage of .25c an hour and gas was .17c. Today the minimum wage is around $5.70, and going up, to over $7 and gas is down to 2.10 here ;)
mike hunt

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Whatever, but I know I was paid a quarted an hour and 5c on each can quart of oil ;)
mike

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something wonderfully witty: <snip>

costs. I really do think that the quality paradigm is a figment of Consumers Reports. I am more then happy with my Ford & Lincoln products from a quality standpoint. The only major complaint I have is the interiors still seem to wear faster then on my GM products, but that just maybe my perception.
I think all corporations in America are battling major costs in the benefit arena regardless if they are Unionized or not. Health care expenses are completely through the roof. My own organization has been experiencing double digit increases in premiums for a number of years now. Since our creation over two decades ago we offered no cost coverage to all our employees with only a small additional charge for family coverage. Four years ago we simply could not eat the entire increase in the premium and were forced to charge each employee $15 a payday for primary coverage with a $10 co-pay. This year that charge has risen to $45 with a $20 co-pay with the company picking up $417.00. You really don't want to know what family rates are.
We pay a decent local wage, but no where near what people at the local Ford plant (which will be closing next year) make for similar jobs. Their health care plan also covers a lot more then ours does as well and offers a lot more benefits with a more comprehensive dental plan. However, later next year all of our employees will have a job and the poor guys & gals over at the Ford plant won't be working there. I hope they find something, but it won't be making $70,000 a year for putting on door handles.
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On Tue, 24 Oct 2006 23:18:12 GMT, "Whitelightning"

so, but I do believe your right that the family would love to take the company private again for the reasons you've listed and many more. It would be great to be able to run a car company for the long term as opposed to short sighted return on investments & bond ratings. We actually get to see some really interesting products and some true research into alternatives.
I think Bill being a car guy really had something to do with some recent Ford products that did turn out to be successful. Without his input/control there might not have been much soul in the Mustang redo. We might have saw a four-banger econobox version instead of pretty closer to performance six as the baseline offering.
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