Toyolet prius efficiency

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And high power or GHz+ transmitters and microwave ovens still use tubes. There will always be conventional power trains, too, in trucks and motorcycles. But just as most electronics applications today are solid state it is a safe bet that passenger cars will be almost entirely hybridized (or whatever comes next) in a handful of decades.
Change is something we either accept or not, but it occurs anyway because of market forces or government fiat. I would not have predicted the complete takeover of EFI in the US, but the requirements of emission control outweighed the high cost and modest benefit. If CAFE comes back with a vengeance the changeover to hybridization may be quicker than I expect. In the end, the performance will be what the public will demand even if the gov'ts don't.
"... 'cause it's understood I got a fuel injected engine under my hood! What, all of you too?" Apologies to the Beach Boys.
Mike
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Michael Pardee wrote:

"modest benefit"??? gotta tell you dude, my injected civics are /way/ more reliable than any carburetted car i ever owned. that's no "modest benefit". much easier to fix too. different, but definitely easier.

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On 21 Mar 2007 15:16:32 -0700, snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

This site is pretty silly, claiming that a Prius is more harmful to the environment than a Hummer. There argument sums up to:
Zinc for the battery is mined and this one zinc mine was an environmental disaster dating back more than 50 years. Response: Environmental standards have improved a lot in the last 50 years. The fact that the mine is in Canada assures me that it is no running in an environmentally sound manner.
The battery has a limited life and must be disposed of. Response: systems are well in place to recycle the materials which will reduce the need to mine new ore.
The materials for the battery are moved around the world during manufacturing. That wastes energy. Response: Silliest argument of all. This is true of any vehicle and most any large or complex manufactured item. How does the cost of moving those batteries compare with the cost of moving the steel for the Hummer from Korea or Japan or China to the US? How far did the coke and iron have to travel to the steel mill?
The Hummer will last 300,000 miles and the Prius will only last 100,000. Response: Pure speculation. If gas goes to $5, I could see the Hummer getting taken out of service immediately. Even at $3, putting $2K into a 100,000 mile, 45 mpg Prius makes good economic sense if you think it will go at least another 50,000. Most long-term Toyota (and Honda) owners will think that is a pretty good bet.
Some conventional subcompacts can get almost 45 mpg. Response: Prius isn't a subcompact and Hummers get about 12.
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It's true that the realistic mpg of Prius is about 45 mpg, which is only about 30% better than the 35 mpg I get from my gasoline Civic. But I think most people neglect the emissions benefit of hybrids: typically 90% less than gasoline cars. And probably way more than that compared to a Hummer.
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The one I was next to the other day in a parking lot DID have the gasoline engine idling so I don't see where you pulled the 90% number out of. From the tesla marketing materials? That one surely does not run the motor at idle.
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On Mar 22, 8:43 am, snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

man, you are skeptical. Tesla? that's an all-electric. which probably produces more emissions than a hybrid because the electricity is generated by burning coal, natural gas, and oil.
"Emissions - 89 percent fewer smog-forming emissions than the average new car, exceeding the standards for a Super Ultra Low Emission Vehicle (SULEV)" http://www.hybridcars.com/compacts-sedans/toyota-prius-overview.html
The reason why hybrids can have near zero emissions is because they keep the engine running at peak efficiency as much as possible.
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You are saying that the power plant that for example burns diesel does so with more emissions than a diesel car does? Nuclear plants produce relatively clean electricity unless they blow up or the by products are disposed of improperly. It's definitely easier to control the waste from immovable plant than from hundreds of millions of cars (some of which are even exempt from emissions testing in the US, and out of USA I bet some countries don't even have a requirement to test the cars as a part of an annual check).
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On Mar 23, 5:27 pm, snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote:

it's quite possible that the amount of emissions produced by the power plant to produce the electricity to charge a Telsa car could be more than the emissions than a gasoline car.

ok, but you cannot choose your power source when you use electricity. The power sources all mixed in the electrical grid. And about 80% of U.S. power comes from coal, oil, and natural gas.
http://energy.cr.usgs.gov/energy/stats_ctry/Stat1.html
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Doesnt follow? A gallon of gasoline burned in a Civic or a Hybrid still puts 22 pounds of carbon dioxide in the air. Its just the Hybrid goes 40% further per gallon.
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car emissions consist of hydrocarbons, nox, carbon monoxide, and carbon dioxide. A lot of the emissions occur when the engine is in a transitional state or not running at optimal efficiency. With a parallel battery power, hybrids can keep engines running at optimal efficiency (or off). Hybrids produce less emissions than simply the difference in mpg.
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Its a similar situation with computer chips and solar cells considering the nasty chemicals that go into manufacturing them. There several toxic waste sites around Silicon Valley from chemical leaks in older days when they were less careful. Its improved now, or been offshored.
Or that Google is one of the largest consumers of electric power in theworld because it has the worlds largest computer system- 2 million CPUS spread over 60 data sites. But to be fair, Google is also the most efficient computer operator in the world per terabyte of storage because they have paid both economic and ecological attention to efficient computing.
Being green isnt easy.
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