I am about to change the oil on my new Stang.... has about 600 miles on it... went to the dealer and they recommended I get the Motorcraft "synthetic blend" 5W-20. Normally it is not a good idea to use any type of "synthetic" oil during the break-in period... but the dealer claims that this is the exact oil that FORD puts in brand new engines and recommends it for all use. I hope the dealer is telling me the correct thing. I am tempted to put some other brand of non-synthetic oil in the engine for the next say 1,500 miles until the engine is truly "broken in", then switch back to the Motorcraft synthetic blend after that. However, I would prefer to follow the dealer recommendation if indeed I can determine whether or not they are correct. Any thoughts?
Resist the urge to second think the people that designed the motor..... 5W20 is the factory recommended oil. Additionally, there is no real "break-in" period on these new technology motors.
GT-Vert-03 wrote: > I am about to change the oil on my new Stang.... has about 600 miles on > it... went to the dealer and they recommended I get the Motorcraft
Nevermind the rude responses you're getting from some people... *SOME* of us understand your concern. I was always concerned about putting synthetic oil in a car during break in. Some manufacturers--such as Saturn--actually recommend NOT using synthetic oil in their original
4cyl cars.
However, many manufacturers are releasing cars from the factory with Mobil 1 these days. (Cobra, AMG, Vette, Viper, BMW M-series, and so on). With that being the case, I'm not as worried about synthetic in a new engine.
The final answer for you is in your manual...what does your owners manual say to put in? It should have a Motorcraft part number. I use Motorcraft (non-synth) oil in my 2000 GT.
Bad day? Why take it out on a guy asking a realistic question? Surely you know that dealers have been known to rape a customer or two, right? You don't believe everything the dealer tells you, do you? Lots of questions - all are rhetorical.
No need to break it in. Newer engines are built to tighter tolerances and don't break-in the way the old cars did. One thing I'll recommend is that rather than paying Ford's price for their 5W-20, put commonly available Mobil 1 (or pick a brand) 5W-30 in it. No harm to be done and it gives a little better protection in higher temps and more demanding operating conditions - i.e. cars that are typically driven a little harder than average. That's what I do.
I agree to the newer engines, but typically I recommend a regular oil until the normal oil drain interval. Mainly to clean out any debris that might be in there from the manufacturer to begin with. After this point, switch to a synthetic. As for the 5W-20 only rule, these engines never changed when they started recommending this viscosity, it simply gained them a little extra MPG in tests and made Ford (and Honda) look better on paper. You are safe with a 5W-30 that meets the spec as well. The "older" Mustangs, like my 99 GT, recommend a 5W-30. Also, if you look in your manual, it will show a range of viscosities you can use, based on the type of climate you live in. I'm not sure who makes Motorcraft oil, but remember, it's probably the oil manufacturer that gave the best deal to Motorcraft on that oil. Ford makes cars, not oil, so I'd look at some of the other oils out there, if you are really interested. Many of these will provide better protection, and probably be cheaper. Try and get a Group IV Synthetic, as far as I know, Amsoil and Mobil 1 are the only ones still making this, most brands have gone to a Group III oil, because it's cheaper to manufacture, and guess what? This is a petroleum based oil. It's better than the normal Group II dino-oils, but debates are out on how it compares to the PAO based Group IV oils. Same goes for rear end fluids. I know someone who works with the Powerstrokes that use a "synthetic" in the rear end, a "fill for life" Motorcraft Gear Lube, and when he did analysis on many of the Powerstroke rear ends, all had already been breaking down much more rapidly than he expected and the gears showed discolorization from heat. This is a Group III synthetic fluid, and it can't hold up the same. I'm reading movements to promote the difference between the Group III and Group IV synthetic oil. Many manufacturers who require a synthetic, are finding these Group III fluids not holding up causing warranty issues they need to take care of. I'm not sure, but I think the newer Mustangs have "synthetic" in the rear as well. Keep an eye on it (and all your fluids). :-)
I just picked up our new Mercedes C320 coupe on Saturday (I needed something to go with the 96 Vert...) and asked a similar question about oil / break-in / changing etc...
The Service Manager (no, his name wasn't Dieter...) told me that they use a synthetic oil from the factory, and that they recomend NOT changing it until approx. 15,000 km's. I was a bit surprised so I checked the owners manual and it said exactly the same thing, that the first oil change isn't until
15,000 or when the service monitor system says it's time. From then on, they highly recommend synthetic at every change.
The manual also talked about the first 1,000 km's as being a break-in period, and not to use WOT etc, but after the first 1,000 it is business as usual.
MBZ started this about 2 years ago when they were having problems with their FSS system (flexible service system). This is where the car figures out when it needs an oil change. Turns out that some cars went over 10,000 miles on standard oil before saying they needed an oil change. There were then cases of engine sludge, and engine failure. MBZ extended the warranty on the engines of affected model years, and began using Mobil 1 from the factory in all models.
Mercedes just settled a lawsuit because they neglected to inform their customers to use synthetic oil with this wanring system on earlier models. Apparently people were using regular oil and it wasn't holding up for this amount of time and people claimed to experience engine problems.
I place a great deal of trust in Ford's engineers, but none with Dealership personnal. Dealer 'claims' should be regarded with suspicion...always.
Use the best oil and filter possible. For me, that's Mobil One 5w30 (an excellent Group IV lubricant) and a Motorcraft 820-S filter. Use the best lubricants you can afford for the entire drivetrain, not just the engine.
at 09 Sep 2003, JD Adams [ snipped-for-privacy@Promedia.Net] wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:
I have to concur here. After a recent thread stated most synthetics went with Group III stock I queried Mobil. And was assured all Mobil 1 is either group IV or Group V base stock. I use the Motorcraft Fl-400S as it's actually cheaper than Fram and seems better. All three our vehicles now use Mobil 1 oil. The oil pressure in my wife's Geo Storm GSI is even slightly higher. (That car has real gauges, not idiot lights like my Mustang)
Here's a link to a comparison on oil filters. Quite enlightning.
Intersting study. AFAIK, Motorcraft filters are identical internally with Purlators in terms or filtration and construction, and the silicone anti-drainback valve is top-drawer. I get mine at Wally World for $2.99 which is quite a bargain for a filter of this quality. In fact, I bought 2 cases of these last year, which should last me about 12 years or so.
I've even switched my beater over to Mobil One 5w30. It's already looking pretty nasty, as it is cleaning 178,000 miles worth of varnishy-crud out of the internals, but other than that, no problems. A few changes, and it will start looking nice and clean, just like the GT. I'm hoping to make it to
300,000 miles before I consider selling it, and synthetics are the only way it will ever make it. Soon, I will switch the transmission over to Mobil One synthetic ATF as well. Very good stuff - I run it in my T-45 with excellent results.
And if anyone's looking for Mobil One at a bargain price, it can be had for $3.82/qt. at Wally World in 5-qt. jugs. It's up to $5.00+ everywhere else around here. You just can't go wrong with this stuff.
I asked the folks at Mobil (via email) if they were going to come out with a
5w-20 Mobil 1 oil for the newer GT's per the Ford spec and they told me to use their 0w-20 that it was to the Ford spec, and would not void the warranty on my 03 GT.
at 10 Sep 2003, JD Adams [ snipped-for-privacy@Promedia.Net] wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com:
In or ex sales tax? 5 * $3.82 comes out at $1910. The local WallyWorld here in Tampa sells it for $18.88 a 5qt jug. ($3.78/qt) They also seel my FL400S Motorcraft filter for $2.77. Which is one helluve price.
It is crucial to use synthetic oil if you are going to be practicing extended drain intervals. See article as it relates to Mercedes Class Action Suit below.
Conventional Oil Costs Carmaker $32 Million
By Tim Sullivan American owners of Mercedes-Benz cars were awarded a $32 million settlement this month on a complaint that their engines may have sustained early wear because they were not advised to use synthetic motor oil. The class action settlement, approved April 9 by a U.S. District Court judge in Philadelphia, calls for Mercedes-Benz USA to mail vouchers for a free oil change to more than 350,000 owners and lessees of cars from the 1998 through 2001 model years. In addition, the company commits to cover repairs estimated to cost $20 million. The case involved a Flexible Service System (FSS), included on nearly all Mercedes-Benz cars sold in the United States from 1998 to 2001. The system is designed to help owners lower maintenance costs and to reduce environmental impacts of used motor oil by advising owners when the oil truly needs to be changed. According to Mercedes-Benz, the system begins with a minimum interval of 10,000 miles and adjusts upward as it detects favorable conditions, such as extended highway travel.
Documentation brought forth during the case indicated that intervals ranged up to 20,000 miles, with the average being 12,000 miles. The problem, according to the plaintiffs, was that owners manuals and promotional materials advised motorists to use conventional motor oils. "The company's intentions ? to save its customers money and to protect the environment ? are certainly commendable," attorney Kenneth Jacobsen told Lube Report. "But it didn't work because conventional oils just don't stand up to those intervals." Mercedes-Benz mailed a letter to owners in 2001 advising them to use synthetic motor oils. Ironically, it was that letter that eventually led the original plaintiff, Joseph A. O'Keefe, to file suit. "He had worked for years in the automotive business, so he thought it was strange when he received this letter from out of the blue recommending that he switch from conventional oil," Jacobsen said. "He wrote to Mercedes to find out what was going on and received what he considered to be an unsatisfactory answer." Jacobsen added that the automaker did not dispute during the case that the intervals recommended by the FSS were too long for conventional oils. "It was never really an issue," he said. "They pretty much acknowledged that they had a problem. Their argument was that it wasn't as big of a problem as what we said and that the case did not merit a class-action suit." After the settlement, Mercedes-Benz issued a statement denying wrongdoing and maintaining that conventional API SH and SJ motor oils should withstand the intervals recommended by the FSS without sludging or related engine damage. The statement did not address other aspects of engine oil performance, such as fuel economy preservation or protection of emissions controls. It also noted that the vehicles were factory-filled with oil that "met the same standard as approved synthetic oils." Mercedes-Benz USA Public Relations Manager Frederick R. Heiler acknowledged that the intervals for which the FSS was programmed significantly exceed those typically recommended for conventional oils. He noted, however, that typical intervals are "blind" recommendations ? that is, made for cases in which neither oil nor driving conditions are monitored. "A system that monitors oil condition and the amount of highway driving can often prescribe much longer change intervals," Heiler said. The FSS does not directly monitor oil condition. The vouchers to be mailed by Mercedes-Benz will pay for installation of synthetic oils. With their face value of $35, that part of the settlement has a price tag of $12.3 million. Judge Franklin S. Van Antwerpen arrived at $20 million for potential repairs based on expert testimony. His decision approving the settlement cited allegations that several thousand owners had reported problems by the time O'Keefe filed his suit.
I would assume if you can use a OW-20 than you can use a 5W-30 with regard to the warranty. In 2002 when the 5W-20 spec was introduced to most Ford and Honda's that viscosity grade didn't exist. Therefore, they were factory filled with 5W-30. Some Honda manuals with 5W-20 specifications are worded with language that suggests you can use
5W-30 in a "pinch" if you can' t locate 5W-20. Its kind of a game.
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