Quality is important

I know that this is not a specific newsgroup for diesel questions BUT where do I go? My son recently bought a used (97) diesel Chevy Silverado. When we looked at it (and had a mechanic look at it), everything seemed fine. All of a sudden the engine stops. Diagnostic lights came on that said "check Battery". We fixed a connector that showed a little corrosion...it stopped again. Now, we are replacing the battery. Question 1: are we barking up the wrong tree? does this problem seem fuel related or electrical related? Question 2: If you don't want me on this newsgroup, is there a suggestion as to where to look? John

well you have ever right to be HOT, i would be too. thats why i check everything before i leave the dealer, and make the tech reset the change oil light in front of me. i had one teh tell me he NEVER resets it UNLESS its on. well after he said that, i went straight to the service writer and told them that that tech is NEVER to touch my truck again. when asked why i said that, i told her what he stated.

Diesel question(s) Group: alt.autos.4x4.chevy-trucks Date: Sun, Oct 12, 2003, 3:45pm From: snipped-for-privacy@compassnet.com (John=A0Fregia) I know that this is not a specific newsgroup for diesel questions BUT where do I go? My son recently bought a used (97) diesel Chevy Silverado. When we looked at it (and had a mechanic look at it), everything seemed fine. All of a sudden the engine stops. Diagnostic lights came on that said "check Battery". We fixed a connector that showed a little corrosion...it stopped again. Now, we are replacing the battery. Question 1: are we barking up the wrong tree? does this problem seem fuel related or electrical related? Question 2: If you don't want me on this newsgroup, is there a suggestion as to where to look? John

Ok John... I have some questions for you.

1.Does the engine turn over? 2.Does your battery have voltage? 3.When you checked the battery connections. Did you check you check just the terminals? Or did you also check the batter connections at alternator,starter,also where its grounded? 4.If it does start . Do you have voltage to your battery from you alternator? 5.If its yes to all of the above. Do you have fuel pressure? See you need more information. Just that it started ,stopped,and you replaced a terminal isnt enough. Give more info and we might be able to help. Steve C

Quality is important Group: alt.autos.4x4.chevy-trucks Date: Sun, Oct 12, 2003, 4:35pm (CDT+1) From: snipped-for-privacy@comcast.net (Jbew3) Here is a letter I sent today to my dealer and to Chevrolet. Does anybody think they care? Letter to: Vice President of Service Criswell Chevrolet

503 Quince Orchard Rd. Gaithersburg, MD 20878 Vice President of Service General Motors- Chevrolet Division 300 Renaissance Center PO 300 Detroit, MI 48265-3000 Gentlemen: A customer's attitude about quality is something that once lost is rarely re-established. 300 miles after a 12,000 mile service on my 2003 Silverado I found the oil refill cap missing. What damage was done I, nor you have any idea? The mechanic that replaced the cap on Saturday told me the engine runs with 2 lbs. of positive crankcase pressure. I have no idea if he told me the truth. I suspect it is the other way around. Please advise. Criswell quickly replace the cap, but they DID NOT CHANGE THE OIL. With only 300 miles on the oil I can understand a thrifty attitude, you are not leaving me with a satisfied attitude. I paid someone else to change the oil in the event something got into my engine. What hurts most is that I do not have confidence that the engine will now see its service life. Criswell uses a 27-point vehicle inspection. Item 13 refers to Engine and Transmission oil leaks. Considering what happened do you for a minute I think any of the 26 other items were performed. Sincerely

OK um the chances of something jumping into your engine is slim. Unless you have a filthy engine compartment or you drive with your hood up. As far a GM goes they may express their concern. But Dealers are usually indenpendant . The dealer is responsible not GM. There is positive crank pressure. And if there was a problem I think you would have seen symptoms by now. Usually they look for leaks before changing the oil. Mind you i'm in no way takeing sides. But i think your over reacting just a bit. Steve C

Quit whining like a little girl. An air-headed mechanic forgot to put the oil fill cap back on. Big deal. If anything got in there it would have grenaded by now. What do you expect them to do, replace the goddamn truck because you drove without an oil filler cap for 300 miles?

Doc

Top post..... Everyone I seen the you check you check mistake. And im very sorry. I will put the beer down. John more facts bud Steve C Re: Diesel question(s) Group: alt.autos.4x4.chevy-trucks Date: Sun, Oct 12, 2003, 6:54pm From: The_Gear snipped-for-privacy@webtv.net (Steve=A0Cook) Diesel question(s) Group: alt.autos.4x4.chevy-trucks Date: Sun, Oct 12, 2003, 3:45pm From: snipped-for-privacy@compassnet.com (John=A0Fregia) I know that this is not a specific newsgroup for diesel questions BUT where do I go? My son recently bought a used (97) diesel Chevy Silverado. When we looked at it (and had a mechanic look at it), everything seemed fine. All of a sudden the engine stops. Diagnostic lights came on that said "check Battery". We fixed a connector that showed a little corrosion...it stopped again. Now, we are replacing the battery. Question 1: are we barking up the wrong tree? does this problem seem fuel related or electrical related? Question 2: If you don't want me on this newsgroup, is there a suggestion as to where to look? John Ok John... I have some questions for you.

1.Does the engine turn over? 2.Does your battery have voltage? 3.When you checked the battery connections. Did you check you check just the terminals? Or did you also check the batter connections at alternator,starter,also where its grounded? 4.If it does start . Do you have voltage to your battery from you alternator? 5.If its yes to all of the above. Do you have fuel pressure? See you need more information. Just that it started ,stopped,and you replaced a terminal isnt enough. Give more info and we might be able to help. Steve C

No, I don't think he's necessarily over-reacting. He took his vehicle into a licensed repair facility, one that's very tightly associated with the manufacturer, and they failed to put his oil cap back on. I would be furious as well, and would be expecting the dealership to do everything within reason (ie - no new engine installed for free) to make their wrong right again. There is always a possibility within 300 miles of a severe amount of dust entering an engine through an open hole, or, just as bad, water.

Also, if a properly working engine ran on 2psi crankcase pressure, why aren't all the breather filters in the world soaked with combustion by-products? Haven't we all seen the older worn out engines with this problem - when the PCV system can no longer compensate for the amount of blow-by, but have we ever seen it on a properly operating new engine? I haven't.

I think compensation for the oil change done elsewhere and a free service at the dealership should be in order. They have to at least have a chance to prove compentence. If they don't, they no, I wouldn't go back there.

Just my $.02

Jeremy

No, I don't think they do care. In fact I know they don't.

Typical experience.

I don't know but check all bolts, particularly the oil pan drain, and look to see if they greased the idler arm. I'd bet they didn't.

There you go. From now on if you want safety, change it yourself. I do. No dealer will touch my rig again. Ever.

They especially don't care about this, thats why they are designed that way. And I don't care what anyone says about "needing to keep customers." They need to keep money more, and they don't think beyond the end of their fat noses.

Engine and

minute I

You wasted your time. Go in person and waste 4 more hours, or forget it. I wrote to GM in Detroit once, many years ago. After my second engine in less than 12,000 through valve through a piston. Local Dealer wasn't going to fix it again, they didn't care that I'd bought it new, and the warranty wasn't up yet. Thats why I wrote Detroit. They called the dealer and said, "we have sent you another engine," fix that man's car. It was quicker than the dealer could say no. I doubt that would work these days though. It was in 1974.

Hatt

idea? The

change the

I think he probably just expects them to acknowledge they screwed up. And yes, "they" screwed up. The dealer who hired the egg head, and the egg head himself. Doesn't need explaining or made excuses for. Period.

Hatt

positive

reacting

vehicle into

everything

What about that insulation crap plastered to the underside of the hood? My god, if it would have been my truck I'd have worried about that too. Even though it might not cause any damage! Sure seems like it might plug some of those tiny holes in the head, or even the oil filter.

amount of

engine? I

there.

Prove competence a second time? Not with me they don't.

Hatt

Not with me either. (I actually do *all* my own work, except mounting/balancing tires and front end alignments), but working in retail, if I make a mistake with a customer (pull part for wrong year or something brain dead like that), I'd expect to be able to make it right, and keep the customer. Granted, me handing the wrong part to someone is alot different than me doing a poor (or downright wrong) job on a service.

Now I'm up to $.04... :-)

Jeremy

Thanks, Steve

1. Engine does turn over. Sometimes it will start and run fine...no problems. Sometimes it runs for a few blocks, dies, restarts and has no more problems that day. Last week it ran for a few blocks, died and could not be restarted. When we reworked the battery cable (put on a new connector) it restarted, ran for 5 minutes at idle, died, restarted and made it the rest of the way home with no problem.
2. Batt has about 14v...didn't have a digital voltmeter.
3. Just checked connections at batteries...did not think to look at alternator since we were getting output from the alternator.
4. Yes

Diesel question(s)

Group: alt.autos.4x4.chevy-trucks Date: Sun, Oct 12, 2003, 3:45pm From: snipped-for-privacy@compassnet.com (John Fregia) I know that this is not a specific newsgroup for diesel questions BUT where do I go? My son recently bought a used (97) diesel Chevy Silverado. When we looked at it (and had a mechanic look at it), everything seemed fine. All of a sudden the engine stops. Diagnostic lights came on that said "check Battery". We fixed a connector that showed a little corrosion...it stopped again. Now, we are replacing the battery. Question 1: are we barking up the wrong tree? does this problem seem fuel related or electrical related? Question 2: If you don't want me on this newsgroup, is there a suggestion as to where to look? John

Ok John... I have some questions for you.

1.Does the engine turn over? 2.Does your battery have voltage? 3.When you checked the battery connections. Did you check you check just the terminals? Or did you also check the batter connections at alternator,starter,also where its grounded? 4.If it does start . Do you have voltage to your battery from you alternator? 5.If its yes to all of the above. Do you have fuel pressure? See you need more information. Just that it started ,stopped,and you replaced a terminal isnt enough. Give more info and we might be able to help. Steve C

I guess you have surveyed EVERY customer of EVERY dealer to get that "typical" rating.

It may NOT have a grease fitting. Might be a sealed unit.

If "something" got in the engine it would be showing symptoms by now. AND IT DOES RUN WITH POSITIVE PRESSURE in the engine, just like 90 percent of the engines out there, ever heard of a Positive Crankcase Ventilation Valve, Care to guess what it does???

Good for you, Some people don't have irrational feelings like you...

I doubt you will ever get the true service live out of the engine, you will trade it in LONG before it hit's the 200-250,000 mile mark, which is about a normal number for a small block..

The dealers DO care about keeping GOOD customers, however they also try to LOSE the ones with irrational demands...

THE LEAKS are checked before and after the service, The cap might have been loose on the engine or it could have been like the one on a Caravan I had, it broke and fell off on it's own.

Yep another customer in the TOSS pile...

Yeah, I've heard of it, and it's function is to vent that 'positive pressure', sucking it out and making a negative pressure so as to draw in fresh, filtered air via the breather to prevent the accumulation of combustion gasses in the crankcase which form acidic deposits in oil.....or does your PCV Valve blow? ;-)

Jeremy

Of course I have, how else?

OK, but on which rig are you talking about?

you...

Alright, I'll give you that much.

Well you are talking to the wrong guy now, but I hardly expect to get that service life, the truck will be rusted to a mere shell by that time.

customers."

Very well put, a good customer with a fat, fat wallet. he he. Especially commercial customers who don't pay for their trucks anyway.

dealer

He he. I thought you were going to put away the beer tonight?

Hatt

Guess you never noticed the spring and valve that regulates the pressure????? what do you think that rattle is???? It sets the amount of vacuum needed to open the valve as well as how much pressure is in the case at the same time.

Again, I guess you never noticed your breather filter that's *not* full of oil. How do you think that happens?

Hmmmm. If this august group does not know for sure if the crankcase on a

2003 is positive or negative pressure, who would know? The customer like me? I don't think so. Does the term "factory trained" mean anything? How about "Certified ..."

This dealer was so close it is a shame I must go elsewhere for warranty or service.

As has already been mentioned, the crankcase is positively pressurized by nature. When it gets to a certain point, the PCV opens up and the excess pressure is bled off.

Couldn't tell you how many pounds, but I'd guess it was a low number, and 2 doesn't sound too low. Keeping it low or close to vacuum ensures good ring seal and other assorted functions.

Sam