Quality is important

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D snipped-for-privacy@l-c-s-1.n-e-t (Jeremy=A0Chavers) wrote........

Prove competence a second time? Not with me they don't.

Not with me either. (I actually do *all* my own work, except mounting/balancing tires and front end alignments),

but working in retail, if I make a mistake with a customer (pull part for wrong year or something brain dead like that), I'd expect to be able to make it right, and keep the customer.

Granted, me handing the wrong part to someone is alot different than me doing a poor (or downright wrong) job on a service. Now I'm up to $.04... :-)

Jeremy =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Jeremy, so it's okay for you to hand out the wrong parts? But the poor slob in the bay can't make a mistake every once in a while? That's kinda hypocritical......don't yuh thunk?

Let's say......he handed over a 30 amp instead of a 5 amp fuse?

Let's say....he handed over 16 gauge wire instead of 12 gauge?

Let's say ....he handed over Dot 3 fluid instead of Dot 5?

Let's say......................................

everybody makes mistakes ...........and give the poor slob a break.

I have worked on Auotmobiles for over 27 years.......

AND I STILL MAKE MISTAKES..................

it's comforting to know......there are so many perfect people in this NG......

that means everyones giving perfect advice EVERY TIME...........

yeah rite.......

your ass in a pickle jar......

marsh monster ~:~would've punched the complaining idiot if he was a jerk about it~:~

Reply to
Marsh Monster
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Re: Quality is important Group: alt.autos.4x4.chevy-trucks Date: Mon, Oct 13, 2003, 9:00am (CDT+1) From: snipped-for-privacy@comcast.net (Jbew3)

Hmmmm. If this august group does not know for sure if the crankcase on a

2003 is positive or negative pressure, who would know? The customer like me? I don't think so. Does the term "factory trained" mean anything? How about "Certified ..."

This dealer was so close it is a shame I must go elsewhere for warranty or service. ========= ========= Yeah......that sucks......for YOU.

If you raised the stinch that it sounds like you did........you wouldn't be welcomed back there anyways.

If the truth was known...... I bet he even chewed the poor slob of a mechanic...a new one rite there in front of you. He probly fired him on the spot. He probly kick em in the balls fer yuh....jest fer good measure. I bet the service dude even took the time to stop the whole damn work process.......called all the other piss poor mechs over.....and made them watch the poor slob "what wuz coming to him". The service dude probly ripped his Mr Goodwrench patch off his arm......rite there in front of you and the whole damn shop. I bet he took his 4 ft. pry bar and busted the handle off in front of the whole shop....then pointed at the entrance and told him to leave!!!!!!!

yeah rite........

you raised hell.......embarrased yourself....

and the tech got a pay raise and big arse laugh with the rest of the guys after you walked out.

and now......poor you gotta go somewhere else to get shoddy work done.

git a life......it was a freek'n oil cap, and everybody makes mistakes bud....... EXCEPT YOU....I'm sure you never made a single one.

marsh monster ~:~has worked on automobiles for over 27 years and STILL MAKES MISTAKES~:~

Reply to
Marsh Monster

. snipped-for-privacy@home.org (Steve=A0W.)

Guess you never noticed the spring and valve that regulates the pressure?????

What do you think that rattle is????

It sets the amount of vacuum needed to open the valve as well as how much pressure is in the case at the same time.

Steve =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D No it does not!

Dammitt... Steve, I bought you those books to read......not to put on the chair so you could reach the keyboard.

scrib ~takes the keys to the roll-back from steve.... yer on restriction again~ =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D

Reply to
Scribb Abell

============ ============ snipped-for-privacy@l-c-s-1.n-e-t (Jeremy Chavers) wrote........

Prove competence a second time? Not with me they don't.

Not with me either. (I actually do *all* my own work, except mounting/balancing tires and front end alignments),

but working in retail, if I make a mistake with a customer (pull part for wrong year or something brain dead like that), I'd expect to be able to make it right, and keep the customer.

Granted, me handing the wrong part to someone is alot different than me doing a poor (or downright wrong) job on a service. Now I'm up to $.04... :-)

Jeremy ============ ============ Jeremy, so it's okay for you to hand out the wrong parts?

---- I never said it's "OK" for me to hand out wrong parts, just that I'd appreciate the chance to make it right.

But the poor slob in the bay can't make a mistake every once in a while?

---- I never said he couldn't. I just won't take my vehicles to anyone - because I can't justify spending whatever the hourly rate is for labor now (about 60-70 bux?) to have someone do something I know I can do, especially when I myself don't make anywhere *near* $60/hr.

That's kinda hypocritical......don't yuh thunk?

Let's say......he handed over a 30 amp instead of a 5 amp fuse?

Let's say....he handed over 16 gauge wire instead of 12 gauge?

Let's say ....he handed over Dot 3 fluid instead of Dot 5?

Let's say......................................

everybody makes mistakes ...........and give the poor slob a break.

I have worked on Auotmobiles for over 27 years.......

AND I STILL MAKE MISTAKES..................

it's comforting to know......there are so many perfect people in this NG......

that means everyones giving perfect advice EVERY TIME...........

yeah rite.......

your ass in a pickle jar......

marsh monster ~:~would've punched the complaining idiot if he was a jerk about it~:~

---- And lemme tell ya MM......about 95% of the people that come in and say "You gave me the wrong part" falls back on them having given me the wrong information to start with. No, I'm not perfect, just confident in my skills.

Jeremy

Reply to
Jeremy Chavers

I love guys like MM. They know everything. Most of it wrong.

Let's start straightening the spaghetti.

  1. The guy who did the deed was watching the Maryland game, I expect. It was Saturday. 2. The Service Advisor, when he took the truck, said "don't worry Mr. xx, I'll have the mechanics check out the engine and make sure there was no damage." Some Saturday Service Advisors are C-. 3. I am a retired Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic with an Inspection Authorization. I don't think I am the brightest bulb re: new autos, but I think I know a thing or two. Do I think the mechanic needs a kick in the ass, yes. The whole maintenance department needs a good talking to. Maybe my standards are a little high, but considering you don't pull over to the side of the road when I screw up, then, maybe not. 4. I pay others because I made enough money in my life time to afford it. When I don't get what I pay for I get p*ssed. 5. Embarrassed myself, hardly. How about you? 6. If you are still making mistakes after 27 years maybe you ought to try something easier!!!!

Reply to
Jbew3

worry Mr.

Inspection

I think you are right about that. Trouble is, their management is leaderless, and greedy, so what good would it do? They don't set examples for good work, in fact its just the opposite. The poor techs that actually do the work get kicked around all day by other incompetents that are in charge. Equals one thing, morale problems and lots of fuckups.

Maybe

Amen.

Nope, not me.

Well, before getting all bent out of shape guys, he said, "maybe." I don't think anyone is perfect, and those who think they don't make mistakes probably make the most mistakes. I was a professional, for a long time, and I always made mistakes. Not always, I mean often, even after 20 years at the trade. I always fixed them too, and, fixed a lot of other employees f*ck ups that I had absolutely nothing to do with me, except work at the same place, and I COULD fix them. I didn't get paid any more for it. I learned to pay myself by realizing I'm probably going to be the only one who ever really appreciates what I do. And, you can make other people rich all day long, and they still don't give a shit about ya.

Hatt

[snip]
Reply to
DJ Hatt

i believe that gm really does care, it's the dealers who don't give a crap...all they want is the sale and your money. as with hatt, i had an overheating problem with my brand new 4x in '79, dealer refused to fix it, said that i abused and overused the truck too much (damn thing was just a month old). i wrote to gm about the problem and about a month later i received a letter from both gm and the dealer to bring my truck in for repair...but alas, it was too late...i can't wait around for this type of b.s. so after the dealer's refusal i went and tore the engine apart, ported and matched the cooling system, threw the fan shroud and thermostat away. worked real good ever after. never bought a new car after that...figured if i have to fix up a new car, i might as well save my money with a used car and fix whatever problems come up myself.

Reply to
Kawika

"Jbew3" wrote

I'd be interested to know if you ever had to work under the flat rate system while you were active as an Airframe and Powerplant Technician?

Please!! Even after a long time in the trade, I still make mistakes. Everybody makes mistakes, at least Marsh is honest enough to admit it. The people that can't admit it are deluding themselves.

Ian

Reply to
shiden_kai

"Jeremy Chavers" wrote

Jeremy, I hope that you don't really think that technicians actually make 60 dollars an hour? That would be a mistake.

Ian

Reply to
shiden_kai

No, they don't, and I know that, but that's what I have to pay a service dept for them to work on my vehicle. I used to work in a shop and I know how the game is played.

Jeremy

Reply to
Jeremy Chavers

=3D=3D=3D=3D Marsh Monster asked Jeremy some questions.........

Jeremy, So it's okay for you to hand out the wrong parts....but the poor slob in the bay can't make a mistake every once in a while?

That's kinda hypocritical......don't yuh thunk?

I have worked on Auotmobiles for over 27 years....... AND I STILL MAKE MISTAKES..................

Marsh Monster =3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Jeremy put forth this in his defense.....

=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0---- =A0 I never said he couldn't. I just won't take my vehicles to anyone - because I can't justify spending whatever the hourly rate is for labor now (about 60-70 bux?) to have someone do something I know I can do, especially when I myself don't make anywhere *near* $60/hr.

=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0---- =A0 I never said it's "OK" for me to hand out wrong parts, just that I'd appreciate the chance to make it right.

=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0---- And lemme tell ya MM......about 95% of the people that come in and say "You gave me the wrong part" falls back on them having given me the wrong information to start with.

No, I'm not perfect, just confident in my skills. Jeremy =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D all this chatter caused Marsh to quit picking his nose long enought to reply.........

Jeremy, Point well taken.

I served a sentence in the Parts Biz years ago...and even now in the service sector..... the 95% rule is true, when it comes to misinformation.

I can also understand the reasoning for doing your own work. I lambaste no-one for pinching a penny.......but as with you.....I am sure the poor slob would have much more appreciated an attitude of understanding, and a chance for "making it right".........instead of the attitude that was presented to him.

Eons ago.......I served sentences in dealerships. I know todays techs approach vehicals with a different manner than the old guns did.......but the basic attitude is still prevelant among the Dealer Techs.......... THEY ARE CONFIDENT IN THEIR ABILITIES. And very justifieably so. They by far have access to the best training ....and hands down they have access to better technical support. But......everyone makes mistakes......that's a fact of life my friend. And if "The Pissed Off Dude" is in his own little mistake free world.... and has no understanding of how daily life is actually lived.......THEN FK EM!!!!!

I still say I would've punched em in the nose. Maybe not 27 years ago.......but now....yeah.. I would've given him a poke. As a matter of fact, I would like to know why one of the Vets in the dealership didn't stand up fer the poor mechanic slob....and poke em in the nose fer him.

any whoooo.......

The first comment in your reply to "The Pissed Off Dude".....sorta,kinda,maybe..... sounded like you took agreement with the way he handled the situation.

AND THAT PISSED ME OFF.......

so......if you will make a public statement in this NG.......stateing.......you are sorry fer duh misunderstanding........and that in the future you will attempt to get yer point across in a more explicit manner......

I will accept it as my misreading the situation... and i will forgive you.

however.....if you don't ......

I will log you into my "No Compassion" file, and open it ever onced-in-a-whilst to mess with you.

marsh monster "Master Fool" ~:~experience is a hard school to learn in..... but fools will learn in no other~:~

Reply to
Marsh Monster

=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D marsh monster slapped "the pissed off dude" across the face.....and gave him a chewing out with........

=A0=A0=A0=A0I bet he even chewed the poor slob of a mechanic...a new one rite there in front of you.

He probly fired him on the spot. He probly kick em in the balls fer yuh....jest fer good measure.

I bet the service dude even took the time to stop the whole damn work process.......called all the other piss poor mechs over.....and made them watch the poor slob "what wuz coming to him". The service dude probly ripped his Mr Goodwrench patch off his arm......rite there in front of you and the whole damn shop. I bet he took his 4 ft. pry bar and busted the handle off in front of the whole shop....then pointed at the entrance and told him to leave!!!!!!!

yeah rite........

you raised hell.......embarrased yourself.... and the tech got a pay raise and big arse laugh with the rest of the guys after you walked out. and now......poor you gotta go somewhere else to get shoddy work done.

git a life......it was a freek'n oil cap, and

everybody makes mistakes bud.......

EXCEPT YOU....I'm sure you never made a single one.

marsh monster ~:~has worked on automobiles for over 27 years and STILL MAKES MISTAKES~:~ =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D snipped-for-privacy@comcast.net (Jbew3) threw rocks at marsh monster on the playground...and started stomping his feet and screaming.....

I love guys like MM. They know everything.

Most of it wrong.

Let's start straightening the spaghetti.

=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A01. The guy who did the deed was watching the Maryland game, I expect. It was Saturday.

=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A02. The Service Advisor, when he took the truck, said "don't worry Mr. xx, I'll have the mechanics check out the engine and make sure there was no damage." Some Saturday Service Advisors are C-.

=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A03. I am a retired Airframe and Powerplant Mechanic with an Inspection Authorization. I don't think I am the brightest bulb re: new autos, but I think I know a thing or two. Do I think the mechanic needs a kick in the ass, yes. The whole maintenance department needs a good talking to. Maybe my standards are a little high, but considering you don't pull over to the side of the road when I screw up, then, maybe not.

=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A04. I pay others because I made enough money in my life time to afford it. When I don't get what I pay for I get p*ssed.

=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A05. Embarrassed myself, hardly. How about you?

=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A06. If you are still making mistakes after 27 years maybe you ought to try something easier!!!!

Jbew =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D marsh monster picked up a big freek'n stick and went running at Jbewhisnoseonhimself........ and threating him with......

1) that's a big part of yer prob....what you expect and what is factual is deluding yer brain cells and fogging yer thoughts.

2) I would'uh slapped the cap on fer yuh and told yuh to git a life.

3) well ....allrighty thennn....that explains alot. Yer an expector....not a tech. And I agree......yer not the brightest bulb..... when you fk up....the customer doesn't git to bitch and moan and groan.....he fall's out the sky and dies.....what a dip weed fer even admitting that. You should go back and erase that one.

4)yeah....well there's a lot of pissed off people out there because there families died in air plane crashes......how many of those planes did you OR SOMEONE YOU TRAINED, inspect? You don't even consider it do you? No not you. Not you. NOT YOU! You didn't inspect, or oversee the training of the inspectors, or oversee the asignment of the inspection.... for ANY plane that ever fell out of the sky..... EVER .....did you?

you're a puke.

maybe you need to go back and check on all those plane crashe's and see if ever, once, maybe,.....you inspected even one of them at any time......and if maybe....you could have SAVED A LIFE!!

you're a puke.

5) I fart in public....does that count?

6) What would you suggest....AIR FRAME INSPECTOR???? LMFAO....... Where my customers couldn't bitch if I made a slight mistake?

someone poke this guy fer me.....

marsh monster ~:~lives in the real world~:~ =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D

Reply to
Marsh Monster

Actually, if an aircraft that he worked on we involved in some type of an incident where maintenance may have had role to play he would definitely know about it - FAA and NTSB would probably investigate pretty much everything he ever did. Same thing if he signed off the inspection. And if someone that he administered a practical to screwed something up even if it was years down the road pretty much the same thing again.

If one of his "customers" had a problem with something he did just the suggestion would literally make a federal case out of it. Particularly leaving the oil cap off. You know, the kind of stuff Jiffy Lube is supposed to do, not a dealer. That's not a mistake, that is a lack of attention to detail, and pretty much inexcusable.

What do you think went through the guys head when at the end of the day he had an oil cap left over?

4)yeah....well there's a lot of pissed off people out there because there families died in air plane crashes......how many of those planes did you OR SOMEONE YOU TRAINED, inspect? You don't even consider it do you? No not you. Not you. NOT YOU! You didn't inspect, or oversee the training of the inspectors, or oversee the asignment of the inspection.... for ANY plane that ever fell out of the sky..... EVER .....did you?

you're a puke.

maybe you need to go back and check on all those plane crashe's and see if ever, once, maybe,.....you inspected even one of them at any time......and if maybe....you could have SAVED A LIFE!!

you're a puke.

5) I fart in public....does that count?

6) What would you suggest....AIR FRAME INSPECTOR???? LMFAO....... Where my customers couldn't bitch if I made a slight mistake?

someone poke this guy fer me.....

marsh monster ~:~lives in the real world~:~ ===== ====

Reply to
Tom Zweifel
*snipped for long-windedness*

any whoooo.......

The first comment in your reply to "The Pissed Off Dude".....sorta,kinda,maybe..... sounded like you took agreement with the way he handled the situation.

AND THAT PISSED ME OFF.......

so......if you will make a public statement in this NG.......stateing.......you are sorry fer duh misunderstanding........and that in the future you will attempt to get yer point across in a more explicit manner......

I will accept it as my misreading the situation... and i will forgive you.

however.....if you don't ......

I will log you into my "No Compassion" file, and open it ever onced-in-a-whilst to mess with you.

---- I never said that "I agree with the way you handled this", I said that I didn't think he was necessarily over-reacting, but I have had problems with Chevy service departments before (had a radiator hose rub thru on a battery tray on a car that was less than 2 months old and when I took it in half an hour before closing, they said they wouldn't be able to get to it that day, but wouldn't give me something else to drive (dealer I bought the car from), had a rack replaced in that same car 3 times and after the

2nd time, the subframe started 'clunking' on severe traction changes, and after 5 attempts to correct it, the dealer's answer was "these aren't normal driving conditions" (dealer close to where I worked), etc), but I didn't write a letter to GM. I asked one of the 'customer satisfaction' guys at the GM plant I worked with where the best service dept was and started going there, and had *excellent* service. It was a bit out of the way, but these people took care of me - as far as doing warranty work when the car was out of warranty (e-brake handle broke about 2000 miles out of warranty and they replaced it for me). (For those of you in the Pittsburgh area, that excellent dealer was Day Chevy on Golden Mile Highway in Monroeville -- I won't name the other two).

Jeremy

marsh monster "Master Fool" ~:~experience is a hard school to learn in..... but fools will learn in no other~:~

Reply to
Jeremy Chavers

"Jeremy Chavers"wrote

I used to work in a shop and I know

And that...probably more then anything....is why you don't want to pay anyone to do your work. Totally understandable....once you've been there.

Ian

Reply to
shiden_kai

Hmm...it's probably the fact that I know I care more about my vehicle than someone else does - I saw it every day at the shop. I can take my time and check over *everything* when I'm doing something, but the 'system' forces high job turnover rates to bring in more cash, which leads to hurrying up on jobs and not paying attention to the details, or taking the time to try to do things like let the PB Blaster soak in to free the bolt instead of just breaking it off and drilling/tapping (at more cost).

Jeremy

Reply to
Jeremy Chavers
.

mashedmunster wrote.....

*snipped for long-windedness* any whoooo....... =A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0The first comment in your reply to "The Pissed Off Dude".....sorta,kinda,maybe..... sounded like you took agreement with the way he handled the situation.

=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0AND THAT PISSED ME OFF.......

so......if you will make a public statement in this NG.......stateing.......you are sorry fer duh misunderstanding........and that in the future you will attempt to get yer point across in a more explicit manner......

I will accept it as my misreading the situation... and i will forgive you.

however.....if you don't ......

I will log you into my "No Compassion" file, and open it ever onced-in-a-whilst to mess with you. marsh monster ~:~ =3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D . snipped-for-privacy@l-c-s-1.n-e-t (Jeremy=A0Chavers) replies......

=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0=A0---- I never said that "I agree with the way you handled this", I said that I didn't think he was necessarily over-reacting, but I have had problems with Chevy service departments before (had a radiator hose rub thru on a battery tray on a car that was less than 2 months old and when I took it in half an hour before closing, they said they wouldn't be able to get to it that day, but wouldn't give me something else to drive (dealer I bought the car from), had a rack replaced in that same car 3 times and after the 2nd time, the subframe started 'clunking' on severe traction changes, and after 5 attempts to correct it, the dealer's answer was "these aren't normal driving conditions" (dealer close to where I worked), etc), but I didn't write a letter to GM. I asked one of the 'customer satisfaction' guys at the GM plant I worked with where the best service dept was and started going there, and had *excellent* service. It was a bit out of the way, but these people took care of me - as far as doing warranty work when the car was out of warranty (e-brake handle broke about 2000 miles out of warranty and they replaced it for me). (For those of you in the Pittsburgh area, that excellent dealer was Day Chevy on Golden Mile Highway in Monroeville -- I won't name the other two). Jeremy =3D=3D=3D=3D =3D=3D=3D=3D

Jeremy, I do beleive......

I definately misread the post.

marsh monster ~:~

.
Reply to
Marsh Monster

Reply to
tom davin

hmm.. must be the other 5%

Reply to
mac davis

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