a604 Limp, Rebuilt, Sensors replaced, solenoid replaced still Limps!

The 95 stratus has an ODB II connector however I have been told that it uses ODB I communication over this connection. Ted has told me that there is another connection somewhere hoever I have yet to find it.

Regardless I dropped it off at a 5 star DC shop today. If they cant figure out wth is going on with it then I will probably unload the car somehow. It will be an expensive lesson for me in what NOT to buy.

I feel your pain, brother, on today, Memorial Day. But let us not grow bitter and remember our comrades who have fallen before the Chrysler Corporation with integrity, truthfulness, and vehicles that would not cooperate.

Your comment reminded me of the last Chrysler vehicle I purchased. One day it just would not start. No matter what I did, that Plymouth would not start up. So I took it to a good local shop. A nice independent. That car sat there for one solid year and no one could get it to start!

What happened in the end? The shop got sold to a chain and for all I know my beloved Plymouth is buried in the great beyond, gathering dust on its metal panels.

My current Plymouth I did not purchase. It was given to me by someone who could not ethically sell such a problematic vehicle to another person. So now I am developing intimate relationships with all kinds of people trying to solve its problems. And there is always a problem.

I'll leave you with one thought. Maybe I should not but what the heck. Some of my later Chrysler products were like beautiful women who have "problems." I just could never afford a beauty who came without problems.

Amen! I wish I had my 1969 Chrysler 300 with 84K miles on its back. I bought it when I was 21 years old and working at a self service auto dismantler in California. I paid $293 for it. IT had been sitting for nearly a decade as its owner was too old to drive it. I took it, babied it, and put Holle 4bbl Pro-Jection on it. It set me back many hours of work routing return fuel lines and wiring. Not to mention the

Oh it was a thing of beauty though, to pull along side of a punk kid in a new convertible Mustang at a light, blaring his stereo and hearing mine he would want to race off to show his woman that his car was better than mine even though my stereo was louder. Woe is him when I would burry it and walk away... Many a Mustan and Camaro's ego fell to my 300. But perhaps the biggest trimumph was the fact that with an open loop after market fuel injection system I could get 20MPG on the freeway... Ahh those were the good ol days.....

On my 1999 Plymouth Grand Voyager, the OBD-II (ALDL) data port is the only one used for engine, transmission & ABS communication. But you DO need a scanner capable of reading Manufacturer ENHANCED codes. A generic code reader won't do this for you. I just went out and read the codes on mine to make sure it works like I'm telling you, and it does. I'm using an OTC Monitor Elite, with a OTC System Smart Insert 25 pin Chryslers Motors 2.0 chip, a Deuce '01 cartridge, and the standard OBD-II cable. I would recommended a similar setup to anyone who's a serious Do-it-yourselfer. I have about $350 invested in it from Ebay. If you only need OBD-I capability, you can purchase a used OTC Monitor 4000E or (or equivalent), with cartridge on Ebay for under $100. The Chrysler A-604 Transmission and Chassis (CCD) Adapter needed to pull A-604 tranny codes is also available on Ebay. I paid about $35 for mine.

Ok here is todays update.

DC 5 star dealer said that they pulled the codes and the only codes were for the TPS. They replaced the TPS. They also said that the computer needed a flash update and did that. Total cost $470 approx.

They performed the repairs, took the car for a drive and it went into limp, NO CODES REPORTED.

So they say the problem must be that the tranny shop botched the rebuild. They want $3300+ to replace the tranny. Keep in mind the car cost $3800....

I called the tranny shop and they stood behind their rebuild. The told me that Myself or A Dodges technician can come down and watch them pull and disassemble the tranny to make sure that nothing is wrong.

WTF? Any bright ideas? I am currently on hold with DC 5 Star waiting to tell them this.

A dim bulb went off deep inside me. I had one bright idea which was flashing the trans computer which the dealer did. I assume there is ATF

You know this sounds like the problem when a fuse keeps blowing because of a surge that is not dangerous and could be disregarded. The situation sounds quite bad with you caught in the middle. Can someone disconnect the line or the whatever that put the transmission into limp mode? If it's a spurious warning, what danger can result? And would the danger be worse than what it is now, which is a vehicle that is quickly becoming useless to you.

About the dealer, can they test the TPS which they took out? This is the Throttle Position Sensor? It has to be testable. If it's okay, then what accepts the TPS signals is not okay. If it's not malfunctioning, they could put back the old one and refund your money. It's a wild shot there. And do they have some kind of super Chrysler engineer expert on call that you can discuss this with? If I recall, the vehicle was in limp mode before. The Factory Shop Manual and/or the tranny Superbook might have how to test the TPS in regards to the tranny.

I also do not understand the $3300 to replace the tranny since the last time I asked Chrysler, the cost was for me, $1800 for a remanufactured one. They want $1500 labor to put in a transmission? I don't think they want to really help you out. Maybe you need to swallow your pride and whine and plead and scream like a very frustrated customer. Make up a sign. The Chrysler Dealer Ripped Me Off and picket and picket. Okay, that's a little extreme, but jumping up and down might work. When various dealers ripped me off, slinking off embarrassed and defeated did not do anything except get me out of there for the next victim.

They must have spare computers and harnesses they could use to check out yours. Either your tranny is giving spurious signals which cannot be detected or your computers are not reading the signals properly or the cable has a crimp in it.

Fortunately I know so little that I cannot keep quite quiet :)

If the shop screwed up, then what did the shop screw up? Put it in writing or fix the beast. This is like the old hardware software run-around in computers. Not my problem, it's the hardware. No, that's not my problem, it's a software bug. Whatever it is, you are not getting any specific information.

Make sure the next mechanic who works on your car has gray hair and is going to retire in a few years. This is not a problem for anyone less than 55 years of age. You need a very experienced and thoughtful MASTER mechanic.

It should be ATF +3 but hopefully the dealer and the trans shop work that out tomorrow.

If the solenoid or speed sensors dropped off line it should gen a code I'd think.

I could ask them about testing the TPS but since both computers supposedly were fussing about it I would bet its bad. I never found my analog VOM to test it before I took it in. According to the ATSG manual for this trans the TPS failing can not put it into limp but who knows who is right at this point.

Dont ask me on the pricing the previous DC dealer before the tran shop told me 2800, 2200 for the trans and the rest labor.

I called their parts dept last week to price the harness and they didnt have one in stock. I dont know about the computer but you would think they should want to try it.

I asked the DC dealer this. Their answer was "I dont know what they might of made a mistake on but thats what our trans tech thinks it is" I said well can you put that in writing for me? So I can contest the rebuild with the other shop. Their answer was "since we havent opened the trans and our tech isnt really willing to (their tech doesnt want to open the trans and doesnt want to rebuild it because he doesnt know what the trans shop may have done to it) we cant put that in writing"

Thats part of the problem I think,. some of the ones you describe are set in their ways. I wish to go I could find one mechanic with the scruples to want to troubleshoot the problem till its 100% fixed. To have the balls to say I tried this and it didnt fix it so I'm not charging you because it was my lack of knowledge that meant I had to try to fix it willy nilly. Such a creature doesnt seem to exist near me.

This would make 600 for labor? 2800 - 2200 = 600.

But the other dealer now wants 1500 for labor or 2.5 x 600? Two and half times what the previous quote was? That strikes me as slightly curious, yes?

What is a trans tech? Is he certified by DaimlerChrysler? I have not heard of that but I do not know. Is he Gold Certified Chrysler trained? On what basis other than the ubiquitous of Cover Your Ass by blaming the other guy?

Let me suggest what I have done in dilemmas like this:

1. Allpar.com is a good place to ask. Rather tech type people are there. Their answers are sometimes quite detailed. Sometimes wrong. But that is where I learned about flashing the TCM and my 37 mph self-destruct shudder. Or so I think. Damn, I'll have to look in my notes. That's a qualified probability :)
2. To find a master mechanic with white hair who is not set in his ways and researches, you might want to do what I did:

a. Although universally reviled in this newsgroup, the Click and Clack Tappet Brothers at

b. Float an email to the Tappet brothers. Shhhh, don't tell anyone I told you this.

I'm a member of Allpar...

You can smell the difference between ATF+3 and Dexron/Mercon.

As for the harness.. I dont think it is just something that can replaced on a whim.. It is integrated into the rest of the harness in the van.

If you can get your hands on a wiring diagram or a pinout of the tranny harnesses, you could test the harness to see if there is any problems.... I have the 1994 FSM for my Caravan. If need be, I can scan the pinouts of the tranny controller harness and solenoid pack harness so you can try to check some of the wiring.....

I could prolly do a complete copy of the wiring diagrams, but it would take some time... (about 120 pagess)

For $25 he could get an on-line alldata subscription and have access to all schematics for the one vehilce. To me, for the time involved, I'd rather pay his $25 than manually scan 120 pages.

Bill Putney (To reply by e-mail, replace the last letter of the alphabet in my address with the letter 'x')

Me too but thats what they said. Dunno why the difference and dont much care at this point as I'm not getting the trans replaced.

His in shop transmission technician, or trans tech as the dealer service manager likes to refer to him as. He is supposed to be a certirfied master technician...

There is nearly a complete echo of my conversation here up there. No answers forthcoming there either.

Ok I may do this...

Latest update.

Dodge never had their tech call the trans shop, didnt figure they would. The DC service manager did call the trans shop and tried to get the trans shop to pay DC to put in a new factory rebuilt transmission. Since the trans shop stands behind their product they refused the rediculous price.

The trans shop called me and told me what they want to do.

They are purchasing another transmission, rebuilding it and when its ready they will call me and do a one day swap on it. After that if it goes into limp then I get to take it back to DC and they will start charging me $85/hour to diagnose the problem again..

WHAT THE #@$@#.

So today I go pay $502 to pick up the damn car with its new TPS and flash upgrade.

So this will be the trans shops 3rd rebuild. I have to say they are sersiously standing by their warranty on this even to the point of justt rying to prove to DC that there is nothing wrong with their rebuild.

So we are back to the point of if I get it back and it limps again what would any of yall do if it were your car? Would you take it back to DC who has proven they cant troublshoot the damn issue? I mean hell their philosophy seems to be if tis broke and the computer doesnt throw a code to tell them why, then replace the whole trans, remind me not to go there with a spark plug misfiring.

"Richard Ahlquist" schreef in bericht news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com...

Sorry I did not read your hole story but I had the same problem with my Dodge Stratus (in Holland Chrysler Stratus) It goes in Limp in mode when it was very warm outside. I did not get any faultcodes. At last I bought a secondhand TCM at the junkyard for 50 Euro's and the problem was gone!

Succes Hennie.

But a really competant trans shop should be able to trouble shoot ALL problems related to the tranmission! Why the hell can't the trans shop look at the cable harnesses?

And yeah, at this po>>

It's too bad your not close to me here in FL. I have a spare TCM that has the latest flash on it I would let you borrow to check and see if that fixes the problem.

Is that pcsites address a valid address? If so, I am going to scan and send you a copy of the TCM pinout and the tranny harness pinout. They will be in Adobe PDF format.

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Yes the address is valid. I own the domain so I setup this temporary address so I could post with a valid email addy to the newsgroups.

Well if the DC dealer can be believed my current TCM is flashed up to latest now. Since I got the car back from them it has tried to go into limp on me but only when I put it in drive and when its in overdrive. If I drive th car in 3rd on the gearshift indicator it will not go into limp.

Waiting on the trans shop now to finish prepping a new tranny as soon as its ready they get the car for a day.

Just dropped in on this thread and I'm surprised it's still going on.

I doubt that another transmission will fix this. The whole thing smells like a control problem, just like the one I had. I'll say it again - it's either in the wiring harness connectors, or in one of the control modules. You might change the TCM or whatever and find the problem gone. While it could have been the module, it also could be the connectors on the module. Sometimes the very act of removing the connector and then re-installing it will make a problem disappear (which tells you where the problem is).

In the line of work I'm in , we see it frequently enough : a $500K UPS stops working properly because of one bad crimp on one pin in one connector on a ribbon cable (and there nearly 20 ribbon cables).

Phil

Richard Ahlquist wrote:

That might be worth the few minutes...Get a can of contact cleaner that is safe for plastics. Disconnect the TCM (I believe it is an 8mm socket) harness. Pull the harness off, and spray the harness down to remove any debris. Take a few minutes to let the harness dry, and inspect the connections. If possible, remove the cover that covers the back of the harness, and look for a possible pinched or broken wire.

I will try to get a copy of those two pages for you ASAP. I am waiting for a part to fix my server so I can print and scan again.