Hyundais as Dodges?

They've been in bed with Hyundai for a while. There was(is?) some car smaller than the Neon sold in Mexico, that is really a rebadged Hyundai.

The two are also working together on future models / platforms / powertrains.

As well even when they were providing crap, Chrysler didn't cut ties with Mitsubishi, so I doubt they've learned anything.

Mits, Hyundai and DC's Chrysler Group had agreed to manufacture engines together under the "Global Engine Alliance LLC" banner back in Feb 2003. The US plant, located in Dundee, Michigan, was to have started ops in 2005. Chrysler backed out in May 2004, when it announced it was to sell it's 10.5% stake in Hyundai.

Chysler still involved with Hyundai and Mits to produce the Hyundai "World Engine" in Japan and the US. The engines look to be all aluminum

The next generation Neon (2007) is rumored to use at least one of the family. Mits will sell a version of the Neon, with different interior and exterior, to s. America.

The Atos, yes.

Oh, joy.

Looks like not.

...assuming Mitsubishi lasts that long.

DC has the distribution rights for Hyundai in Mexico. Hyundai has not been there that long, so they do not have a national office or distribution arm setup. Only because DC was in bed with them, that they distribute them. But since they sold out there stake, they might not be the distributor for hyuindai's to soon in Mexico.

"Daniel J. Stern" wrote

Could be worse. Hyundai used to make poor cars (but cheap, which is what kept them in business) but lately their quality seems to be improving considerably. The Excel, for example, is a better car than the Neon by almost every measure. Hyundai is a huge and very formidable company - they dominate the large ship construction industry for example.

"Getting into bed" is not only fashionable, it's absolutely necessary to survive in today's market. It's the only way to finance the R&D, and this will become more important in the future with new types of fuels, drivetrains etc.

Besides, it's hardly new. For example, the CVT transmission that Ford is introducing in the 500 and Freestyle goes all the way back to the Dutch DAF car in the 1950s, and has been developed in cooperation with Volvo and other companies since then.

Are you sure you mean the Excel? If you mean the Elantra or something MAYBE.

1998 Neon

"Bill 2" wrote

Sorry, Elantra.

Well, "better" what? Refinement, power, economy, fit 'n' finish, etc? OK, good, I wouldn't have too much trouble with that. But durability and long-term dependability and serviceability are three big unknowns with these "better" Korean cars. So far, Korean cars get old and unworth fixing (or impossible to fix) in a big hurry. Will the more recent models be significantly better in this regard? Maybe, maybe not. We don't know yet, and won't for a number of years.

Not that a Neon is the sine qua non of vehicular durability, but servicing remains *possible and affordable* in the long term.

DS

Agreed - but you will have to admit the Elantra is much farther ahead of the excel than the excel was ahead of the Pony.And the excel was a quantum leap above the Pony. Parts availability and pricing will be, to a large extent, what determines how repairable todays Korean cars will be 5 or more years down the line.

Fit and finsh, engineering, and design of Hyundai, Kia, DaeWoo(GM) et al are at LEAST on a par with Mitsubishi, Suzuki and many european cars - very competetive with the Mazdas and Nissans of the world, and breathing heavily down the necks of Honda and Toyota.

Where does that put them in relation to Ford, Chrysler, and GM? GM, for one, is banking heavily on its DaeWoo designed engines (and cars).

And the Korean vehicles are significantly less costly to purchace than the Japanese "equivalents"

I thought DC now had a large interest in Hyundai, and I remember reading some years ago that the next Neon would be on a Hyundai platform.

Ah, I hadn't seen that -- glad to hear it!

So... the next Neon won't be a Hyundai after all? That would be

Not true. At least, not true on the money part. All the automakers have the money to finance their own R&D. In fact, GM developed the EV1 entirely by themselves, without partnering, see:

The problem is one of patents, and key researchers. In todays specialized market you can count the chemists that are specialists in passenger car hydrogen fuels on the fingers of one hand. And I don't mean just ordinary types I mean the gurus that write the scientific articles that get published. The same goes for any other itty bitty tiny extremely specialized facet of automotive manufacturing. These people all command top dollar and they only work for one company at a time. If your GM and you need a problem solved that is extremely specialized, and the few guys in the world that can do it aren't working for you, you have no choice but to partner. And of course the patents also come into vicious play. It's a lot cheaper to partner with some other company who has the patents in their portfolio that you want, and exchange licensing with them, than to go it alone and try licensing their crown jewels from them.

Ted

I heard it was going to be based on a Mitsu. Might end up with a Mitsu with a Hyundai engine.

Why? Not like Mitsu is any better.

Wouldn't be the first time. (Mitsubishi Precis = rebadged Hyundai Excel)

Was a time when Hyundai cars were basically built under licence from Mitsu. The pony and excel engines and transmissions were exact copies of Mitsu Colt and Galant engines. They soon had enough of that crap and got their engine designs elsewhere. Can't remember where the second generation engines came from, but it was a european company. Currrently Hyundai/Kia are designing their own engines, as is Daewoo (now GM owned).

"I was jumping to conclusions, and one of them jumped back" as Al Stewart once wrote. The one I was jumping to was that this meant the next Neon would be a real live American car. You're right, it's much more likely to be a Mitsu.

I'd really like for it to be American. If it isn't, I won't be buying it, and will look at Ford or GM.