Vintage diesel swaps-do any survive?

Locally there's a Humber Super Snipe (1960's) with an original factory fitted Perkins diesel - some sort of special order or something. Still runs and attends the car shows. My thought was what a way to ruin a nice car....

Alex

IIRC this was mainly done to take advantage of the reduced tax rate on (agricultural) diesel. Once the tax inspectorate caught onto it the number of conversions dropped off fairly sharply..

Saw an Austin A60 diesel (diesel automatic, in fact - probably not exactly a ball of fire, performance-wise) a few weeks back. That was a factory product, but mainly aimed at the taxi-cab market I think.

I knew there was a diesel Farina, but not about the auto option. It must have been an absolute dog.

Think Standard were the first with the Vanguard diesel. But then the Ferguson designed engine was available in both petrol and diesel for tractors, etc.

Which is why I was pretty amazed to see one. They weren't uncommon at one time (mostly manuals, though) - rumour said they sold to foremen and lower-management in haulage companies where they could run 'em on the company diesel. I certainly can't think of any other reason for owning one.

Ditto the BMC B-series, of course - there was a diesel version for vans and the like: it also made a popular marine engine in its Thorneycroft varient. No comments about anchors, please.

Back in the 1950s I used to see a green Bentley complete with leather bonnet straps and a large Perkins Diesel badge on the front. This was in Ryde, Isle of Wight

Thats just sacrelige!

Alex

I'm surprised the 'B' series was strong enough for a diesel version - given the number of cranks and conrods I've been able to 'inspect' from the outside. ;-)

We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the drugs began to take hold. I remember "Dave Plowman (News)" saying something like:

Dieseling a perfectly sound petrol engine was an irritating habit of BMC, Leyland, whoever they happened to be at the time. The worst one of the lot was the 2.25 LandRover diesel. Had a nasty habit of breaking cranks, to the extent many engine reconditioners refused to grind the crank, knowing it would fail if only taken one size under.

The only time the BMC/Leyland/AustinRover dynasty got it right was when they farmed out the design work and had Perkins produce a dieselised version of the O-series (which had 'B' lineage, istr) for the Maestro/Montego. That turned out to be an outstanding little engine and almost unbreakable.

Dave Plowman (News) ( snipped-for-privacy@davenoise.co.uk) gurgled happily, sounding much like they were saying :

Not so - another example of the British motor industry being decades behind in offering technology, even though it was developed here.

Citroen were the first with a commercially-available diesel version of a car, with a Ricardo-developed unit in the Rosalie, in 1935.

Oh, I'm sure you're right. I was meaning in the UK.

Stuff snipped that I'd not argue with..

The Thorneycroft marinisations of the B-diesel weren't that bad, for moderate values of "bad". Not wonderful, either, and rarely rated to deliver more than 25-odd bhp. Even given that they were pretty much restricted to leisure craft. Owners of working boats preferred something really tough and low-revving.

Well yes. If you restricted a basically not too strong petrol engine modified to diesel to a modest power and torque output it might well be tough.

But 25 bhp for a heavy largish car would be a joke - that's about the same as a side valve Morris Minor.

Dave Plowman (News) ( snipped-for-privacy@davenoise.co.uk) gurgled happily, sounding much like they were saying :

UK market? So was I. The diesel Rosalie was available here.

And the diesel Rosalie was Ricardo developed. Ricardo are and were in Shoreham.

So not quite vintage then .

David Betts ( snipped-for-privacy@motorsport.org.uk) The Classic Car Gallery:

David Betts ( snipped-for-privacy@ntlworld.com) gurgled happily, sounding much like they were saying :

I'll give you that...

But a bit closer than a Standard Vanguard...

Besides, the Rosalie was an orphan, living on borrowed time by then - the Traction had come out in 1934, and the RWD Cits were barely clinging to life by 1935 - they'd died by 1938 - the last RWD cars Citroen built.

I wasn't suggesting that it was remotely like a decent engine, merely that in spite of its awfulness some use could be found for it. mind you, this probably just reflected the shortage of affordable small diesels in the 1960s. The marinising firms also had a go at the F*rd Y*rk (apologies for the four-letter words there) diesel in the 80s. Restricted right down they just about worked for a while. Nowadays its wall-to-wall (or hull-side to hull-side) Peugeot and Isuzu blocks, I believe.

I never said you'd want to put it in a car.. :)

In 1962 200 Morris Oxfords were sold to Paris for use as taxis. Lord knows who bought them, as the Peugot of similar appearance was a vastly better car.

Geoff MacK

Going a bit off topic - as usual - a while ago I worked in Chennai (Madras). Loved the India Enfield Bullet; but would you believe there was actualy a diesel version? Claimed four and a half BHP, and if you have to go into halves you do have a bit of a performance problem. Using the throttle increased noise but no apparent difference in velocity. OTOH it would do

Geoff MacK

There is a little single-cylinder Indian diesel which some people use to power small narrow boats. Makes a wonderful 'tuf-tuf' noise and blows smoke rings.

David Betts ( snipped-for-privacy@motorsport.org.uk) The Classic Car Gallery: