Well, I didn't see "Mike Hunter" posting to this thread before, although
he seems annoyed that he has "had his fill." And "Jim's" posts are
every bit as opinionated and full of himself as I've come to expect from
"Mike." So they may or may not be the same person but I thought that
"Mike" was implying that he was "Jim."
In any case, this has gone on far too long, and "Jim" certainly seems
every bit as pleasant to interact with as "Mike" and as immune to facts
that don't fit with his preconceived worldview.
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
It certainly has. This business of getting on usenet and slamming Fram
filters for no good reason has been going on for way way too long. There
is no reliable data or evidence to support these slams but the
perpetrators think they can gang up and bully everybody else into
agreeing with them.
I don't have an opinionated world view. Your the one promoting
opinionated superstitious beliefs. My personal belief is that the
difference between one filter brand and another doesn't amount to hill
of beans as far as the overall effects it has on an engine. Anybody can
use any filter that is designed for the application and change it before
it is saturated with dirt and the chance of having a problem are
practically nil. You can apply the same logic to the filter in a vacuum
There is no evidence that there is any greater risk when using one
brand as compared to another. The way things are nowadays the average
engine will outlast the rest of the car if you just follow the
recommended maintenance schedule.
That's what makes you so incredibly stupid. There have been MANY tests
of oil filters. The Fram crap legend comes from people tearing them
apart and finding them to be crap compared to other makes a few dozen
And your other comment about tests being "meaningless" unless compared
to the mfg "recommended filter" is doubly stupid simply because Mopar.
Autolite, Delco, etc, etc do not make filters, they buy them, and they
buy them from different makers constantly.
Yes, so does that mean they are really crap or just that dozens of
people have all come to the same erroneous conclusions? I mean, none of
these people have any expertise in the manufacture and design of filters
or lubricating systems. And of course when someone questions whether one
can tell anything about how well a filter works by looking at it, some
of these dozens of people get insulted that there judgment has been
called into doubt and so they make up a story that they think proves
they weren't wrong.
Yes. How clever of you to notice that.
Here's the comment I made:
"The test will only be meaningful and valid
if you go to the dealer and get the manufacturers
That remark was intended to be doubly stupid. This is because the
"test" itself to which I was referring was already doubly (or more)
stupid. The car in question was a Subaru and if the guy performing the
test had taken my advice and gone to the Subaru dealer for a filter,
then the filter he put on the car would have been manufactured by Fram
and the results of his test would have been no different than if the
"test" was done with any other brand.
I started this thread because a while ago I posted a post in the Soob
group about my '89 losing oil pressure. Now, the oil pressure wasn't
fantastic when I bought it, but it got worse, *FAST*! Then someone made a
remark about Fram oil filters. Now, I use Quaker State, Castrol and
Valvoline (Mostly QS and Castrol) in my engines; never the bargain
basement or Wal*Mart stuff. I get the oil at AutoZone,and they often have
a deal including a Fram filter, so I get them.
I'll be replacing the Fram on the Soob with a Wix this weekend, and we'll
see what happens...
It's just funny, on three different cars, after installing a Fram filter
the oil pressure suffered an immediate drop!
Is it a good filter? I hope so. I usually use the Extra Gaurd, and the
last 'special' was a Tough Gaurd, but still the pressure dropped...
Me and the car manufacturers and many knowledable mechanics haven't seen
it as a problem.
I have seen where a fram filter used on an old engine that previously
used another brand filter did plug up pretty damn fast. And when I
removed the Fram filter, it felt heavy like it was full of lead. That
happened in just an hour of engine operation. So yes I do get why some
people are having problems. But in my opinion the filter is not really
The point you can't seem to grasp is that the common denominator here
is not the Fram filter, but the application it is used on - an old
engine. The car manufacturers have not found a problem with Fram filters
on their late model engines.
Do you know for a fact that the tube on the slant six filter housing
was the correct length for the filter you installed? Do you know if
someone had removed or replaced that part and if replaced was it
original equipment? The answer to those questions is obviously no, but
yet you're superstitious belief is that the filter is to blame and not
your misapplication of the filter.
BTW I just looked up that part up and it is described as OIL FILTER
STANDPIPE/VALVE. That sounds to me like the engine came with a check
valve in the filter outlet tube. But that valve isn't going to help
prevent the symptoms you described if the tube (standpipe) is the wrong
length for the filter.
This old article from Popular Mechanics contains a short description of
You tell me what difference it makes - I don't have the engine. If I had
the engine I could probably tell you where the problem is.
Yeah well maybe if a filter that removes more dirt from the oil had been
used all along there would never be a problem. But you and your
superstitions are free to do whatever you want.
The guy in the article said he had the same problem with all filters,
so that standpipe might be the answer.
I drove a '74 Dart with that 225 for years and never had an issue.
Lot's of voodoo here.
A knowledge of oil flow through a particular engine where Frams
supposedly cause problems would be useful.
I suspect most of the complaints about Fram have nothing to do with
drainback, but with resistance to flow.
Maybe air pocketing and how the particular system handles that.
Just a guess, though. But nothing an oil pressure gage couldn't
determine pretty quick with the right method.
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