97 civic rough/no idle, just changed timing belt, 72 trouble code

snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote in news:1189402352.188080.6440@

How far out were they when you started? If they were WAY out, then your belt is still on there incorrectly.

"Red mark"? Is this the middle one of the group of three? Or is it the one that's all by itself?

I missed something before...

The timing should be at the middle mark of the three at **IDLE** with the Service Check connector shorted.

At 2500rpm it will be WAY off from ANY of the marks! You've done something seriously wrong here.

Did you have a factory service manual before doing all the work?

you need to check it again after the belt has been tensioned - the symptoms say you're out.

timing belt is set wrong. the cam gear is not just "up", but two marks must align with the head surface.

be logical - it worked before the belt change, it doesn't work after. cam timing is the most likely error.

no kidding. shouldn't have to touch the ignition timing if the belt is set right.

ok, it was disassembled and put back together from the service manual step by step. (misunderstood where crank TDC was, stupid mistake)

I double checked the timing was correct when the belt was put on, that is that the cam marks lined up with the block and the crank pulley's white TDC mark was lined up with the V notch and the point(it was dead on) Then followed the tension procedure and after everything was tightened the marks were checked again, this time they were near perfect(the cam was perfect, the crank TDC mark was ~1mm from the point(IE well within 2deg)

Now that it has been reassembled the timing is dead on that middle (red) mark @ ~750-800rpm. This is a canadian model D16y7 so the idle should be 750+-

Still runs lousy, no power, idles rough then dies. If you put it in gear or anything it just wants to die on you. has almost no power till ~3-4k rpm and even after that it's far less than normal...

any ideas?

i still say cam timing's off. it's easy to set the cam and the crank so they align, but have the belt one tooth out simply by having the belt slack. you need to assemble, tension, then re-check the mechanical timing /afterwards/. carefully rotate the motor three times, then slowly bring the crank timing point up to tdc keeping the belt under tension. only then can you be 100% certain that cam timing is correct.

and to emphasize, ignition timing is a different matter entirely to cam timing - ignition can look perfect with the cam 19 degrees out. the gotcha check for this is the position of the distributor - it should be roughly in the middle of the rotation slots. if the cam is out, it'll be towards one end.

finally, use the right book - some are crap. helminc.com is the source for factory honda service manuals - easily the best investment you'll ever make in your honda if you do your own maintenance.

followed step by step from the honda service manual, well then tomorrow I'll rotate the crank pulley to TDC, take the valve cover off and check the marks on the camgear just to triple check the mechanical timing.

Any ideas what it might be if it's not the timing? vacuum leak?

snipped-for-privacy@gmail.com wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@o80g2000hse.googlegroups.com:

Bent valve.

i agree with tegger - bent valve. you said that you adjusted the valves to factory spec - were any significantly loose before you did that? unless abused, honda valve lash rarely drifts that much.