Cherokee Overheating - Replace Engine ?

Eric B did pass the time by typing:

Dunno.

Coolant has to go somewhere.

1) crack in line to overflow bottle . Jeep uses a closed system, overflow goes into the coolant bottle and gets sucked back in as the engine cools. A leak here or a broken bottle will slowly drain coolant. There should be no air in the radiator. It should be fully topped off and the overflow bottle should be filled to just above the low mark when the vehicle is cold.

2) leak in the return hose/supply hose/radiator . Usually easy to spot as a stream of water and lots of wet under the hood

3) leak in the heater core . this creates a swamp like situation inside

4) cracked head gasket . water gets into the engine oil, check the dipstick for white foam. . water gets into the engine and gets burned, check for white smoke when you drive. (very noticeable, much more than the white cloud you get when the engine warms up in the morning)

5) leaky water pump . This can be a slow leak or just a drip. feel around the water pump pulley there is a tiny weep hole. This should be dry.

6) buggered up radiator causing overheat. If the last person put any of that "no leak" or junk-in-a-can into the coolant system the radiator might be plugged.

Well, you definitely had a coolant loss. You know that your engine overheated due to low coolant level. Mechanic B said the water pump and radiator leaked, and replaced them. Long story short, it still apparently has a coolant loss that Mechanic B can't get a handle on. That's the way I read this.

Time to go to Mechanic C. You gave B a lot of money to replace parts, but you need some serious diagnostic ability. You have to find a mechanic that will pinpoint the coolant loss. B's suggestion of replacing the engine sounds like he is throwing his hands up in the air, based on the way you tell the story.

Chrysler isn't inclined to help you out with this. You didn't buy it from them originally, and you apparently didn't inherit the 7/70 warranty from the original owner.

Make an appointment with the local Jeep dealer. Give them the $75 or so they want to diagnose it, and let them tell you what is actually wrong. I know a lot of people have a hard on for the dealers, but let's face it: these guys stare at 4.0 liter engines all day every day, they might just know something about them. Then when they tell you what is wrong, ask them to explain how they came to that conclusion, so that you are clear, i.e. "we measured hydrocarbons in your cooling system, indicating a bad head gasket or failed hard part."

Don't give B any more of your money. He has taken enough of it, and does not deserve your repeat business.

Jerry

Add one even simpler possibility: bad pressure cap letting fluid escape. Hard to see. The 2000 doesn't use the closed cooling system, does it? I thought they got rid of that POS when Chrysler took over back about 90-91.

You guys wonder why I'm so damn scared to take my jeep to a mechanic... These kind of stories burn my @ss. Consumers need to form an alliance to beat this kind of stuff.

Armature speaking: Let me ask, why would the guy do a leak down test for coolant loss if there's no indication that the coolant is going into the oil? Seems to me he'd just need look at the oil for that creamy look if it's loosing that much coolant/water? Leak down is going to show a compromised area between the cylinder and the water jackets, yes? Would compression be affected?

Also, how does one test the head gasket???? I haven't heard of that one.

Billo

Bring to it a Dealer.

Only problem with some stealerships is that they will pass this vehicle off to the "new guy", who many times is not all that experienced with the 4.0 , yes he knows how to change the spark plugs, change the oil and stuff like that. You need to talk to your local service manager and see if the stealer has a dedicated "jeep guy". Stealership I used to go to had one of the best around, he would also lend out his jeep if the situation dictated so he could drive the customers jeep and pin point the problem. Too bad the new service manager didn't realize what he had before he let the gent go.

Snow...

Doug,

Thanks so much for the response. This is one of the frustrating moments in life where wish you knew more about _______.

I'll take a look this weekend. Although this may be a symptm more than "the problem" because the car still overheats when there is plenty of fluid. I'll check the radiator when the car is cold ...wanna' keep the skin i've got.

The radiator , hosess and water pump were just replace. They could be leaking, i'll take a close look. Other than just before the radiator was replaced i haven't seen what you described.

well i'm not sure if you meant the cabin of the car or the engine compartment, but can't say i've experienced this in either place.

The mechanic said he check the head gasket and didn't find a crack. I'm taking everything he said skeptically, so i will look for white foam in the oil. But, the car defenitely does not pour white smoke. Other than the stupid thing overheating, it looks, sounds and runs pretty well.

New water pump, but i'll try to find this weep hole and make sure its dry.

Got suckered into a new radiator, so i hope no sludge was added to the new radiator.

I'm hearing that this isn't a "just throw the car away" type of problem. I'm going to go to a dealer near me (northern jersy) and pay for diagnostics. And hope they can find something.

Thanks again for the help.

-eric

Don't forget to check the clutch on the rad fan....

Mike

86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's

Eric B wrote:

He said he looked at it in the OP.. 'stops as soon as the engine stops'.

-Brian

They probably let him go after finding him at the Jeep Jamboree in a customers vehicle!... "Good news is I found the ticking noise, the bad news is I had to put it on it's side to 'recreate' the noise." LOL

-Brian

I don't know what the 2000 model year coolant tanks look like, but I ran into a slow coolant loss with my `89 Cherokee. It turned out to be a tiny crack in the coolant bottle (mounted high on the firewall, passenger side) that would send out a needle-thin jet of coolant when hot. It never got big enough to form an actual puddle of coolant and I only found it when I accidently passed my hand through the stream, but it was active enough to drain the bottle over a week or two.

Dear "Snow",

I work for a Jeep DEALERSHIP, in sales. Your referring to any Jeep dealer as a "stealership" is not funny or cute, it's offensive.

What purpose is served by your slamming auto dealerships and building upon unfair, negative stereotypes? Are you the typical "ten percenter" who thinks that factory trained technicians should work for 6 bucks an hour while the car store operates on a non-profit basis? Sure sounds like it.

Word of advice: park under the shadetree and do the work yourself.

Best regards, Dave Rose Cactus Cowboy Big Wonderful Wyoming '49 Willys Pickup (parts truck) '62 Willys Pickup 4WD 226 '98 XJ Sport O|||||||O

Bill, you're a madman... how could you knowingly subject your engine to an oil filter that wasn't "Trail Rated"?

-Brian

You should pay attention to the 'Stealership' mechanic that posts here boasting about how he gets paid for 80 hours while only working 40...

There is too much truth in that word, sorry man.

Mike

86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's

cactuscowboy wrote:

cactuscowboy did pass the time by typing:

Then you would love the way I refer to salesfolk as salescritters. :) (That includes sales for multi million dollar communications systems) "Having a line in the budget is like opening a tuna can in front of 1000 cats." But in all honesty, if your in sales and not trying to be the first person that customer talks to, your not going to be there very long.

..anyhoo..

My definition of "stealership" comes from the outright overpricing of parts and labor. How can one dealership sell parts with over 200% markup while at the same time another dealership sells the same part at 10% markup. Even some of the dealership mechanics I've dealt with have suggested doing the job myself just because the rate they would have to charge is insane. Those are the folks I send others to, because they have proven themselves to be honest.

Actually, there are quite a few dealerships out there who seem to prey on unwitting motorists by doing unnecessary repairs. Sometimes it might just be an honest mistake, but other times it's outright incompetence or fraud.

Most of the folks here do exactly that, some even dig out the snow to work. I prefer a nice well lit garage.

... My suggestion is to take it in stride and understand that this group has readers from all over the world. Your dealership might not be a "stealership", but many too many folks have come here with nightmare stories of how they were ripped off. This is also a place where folk come for suggestions of where to go for service and where to avoid. ...

If a mechanic works 40 hours and gets paid for 80 hours, he deserves it and has worked hard to earn it. A highly skilled mechanic, *if he stays busy* can make an above average to excellent income. There's nothing wrong with flat rate pay for service work on vehicles. It's been the industry standard for many years. It's a difficult and demanding job. For every 'gravy' brake job our technicians do, there are other jobs they don't get paid for, e.g. a very minor problem is corrected and the customer is not even charged..... but the return is huge in customer loyalty and goodwill.

In sales, I work for straight commission. Sounds easy and profitable, huh? If it were, everyone would be doing it.

The car business is great. Where else can an individual work harder and smarter and get paid more for their efforts? Maybe some of you who are slamming car stores as "stealerships" are stuck in routine jobs paying a straight salary or hourly wage? Jealousy speaking perhaps?

As for higher prices for OEM oil filters and such at the local dealership, well there's always NAPA and Carquest down the street. In fact, at our dealership, some of the parts we use are bought down the street, so we can pass savings on to our customers. If we weren't competitive, we'd go out of business.

I'm damn proud to be working for Fremont Motors, the largest dealer network in the state of Wyoming. We didn't get to be the largest by ripping off people. Besides providing good, high paying jobs to me and my coworkers, Fremont gives generously to the local community, supporting youth groups, service clubs, sponsoring the county fair, etc.....

Making broad sweeping generalizations and condemning car stores as "stealerships" based soley on the price of an oil filter or one bad experience is unfair. Sorry if this is coming off as a rant, but I'm sick and tired of the negative stereotypes.

cactuscowboy did pass the time by typing:

And there is the key, customer loyalty. The old adage is "One happy customer might tell 2-3 others, but one unsatisfied customer will tell hundreds." On Usenet it's just a factor of thousands greater. I've had work done at the local dealership even if it was cheaper to do it myself. It's a matter of how much my time costs and having the tools.

Once a mechanic (and myself) spent about two hours trying to figure out why the ABS kept failing on the 93 ZJ. Long story short, it was a bad connector. The dealership wasn't going to charge me for all the effort but that would have taken away the mechanics pay. I paid the full hourly rate and the diagnostics fee. (plus gave the mechanic a $50 for his time). Fowler in Norman OK, no longer does Jeep, but I sent quite a few people down there because of that experience.

Heh. Sales is one of the most demanding occupations but as you say, one of the most lucrative providing you work harder and smarter.

Actually, oil changes are competitive at most dealers. It's the other work that gets pricy.

Glad to hear you like your job. I wish you well.

Who ever said Usenet was fair? :)

As are a lot of others here. Understand that Usenet is full of opinions the same way a feedlot is full of.....