If you thought the reason was totally because of the attitudes of you and Bill Hughes and the fact that you two can usually be found arguing or criticizing instead of helping, you'd be correct.
-- Jerry Bransford To email, remove 'me' from my email address KC6TAY, PP-ASEL See the Geezer Jeep at
Funny you see it that way Jerry, but I guess I can kind of see why someone would have that point of view. In the years I've been on this NG (despite the afore mentioned bickering) you, Bill, Nathan, Mike R., have always been the first to offer help to people. Maybe you take these guys too seriously?
- OK, Nathan, that was a little over-the-top.
- Bill, all those CJs were just practice to make the TJ.
- Jerry, stick around.
JMHO
Jerry Bransford wrote:
Tom, you owe me a new monitor, mine's now got apple cider srayed all over...
TJ = Top-of-the-food-chain Jeep! ;-)
wrong answer, and im not going to argue with you on it. everyone here at your latest "grand exit" already knows and it isnt worth rehashing at the expense of the group.
bah! substantiate or rescend. once upon a time you provided as much help as bill hughes but that time has long since past. regardless of our differences, bill hughes is one of the few OJ's (original jeepers......the people that built the jeep heritage that we all enjoy) and i have nothing but respect for his opinion, even when hes telling my i dont have a real jeep (i dont base my masculinity on what others think of my jeep, so i dont get upset if someone criticizes it).
as for my contributions to this group and jeepers in general, they speak for themselves and will stand on their own merit.
.....fine.
dear chris, im sorry if my differing opinion hurt your feelings. im sorry if i have trouble with criticisms against the principles that make a swb jeep a swb jeep. im sorry that you cannot understand the different levels of jeep purism and just shake off the opinions that differ from yours, realizing that on the trail none of that matters anyway. im sorry you base your actions on the beliefs of others. im sorry you cant take my (and others according to your response) statements with a grain of salt. im sorry you dont seem to see the bigger picture (that on the trail nothing like this matters). in fact, if ANYBODY can tell me ANYTHING else that i can apologize for just let me know and ill do that right here in front of everybody because the LAST thing i want to do is hurt anybodys feelings.
Approximately 9/27/03 11:42, Nathan W. Collier uttered for posterity:
Well, since nobody else seems willing to take the blame, perhaps we could have you publicly flogged for the Oakland Raider offense which I fully expect to get pulverized by San Diego tomorrow.
And of course you caused the recession...so fix it.
lol.....without a doubt......im sorry for that too! :-)
me too. td
Nathan,
I agree with you, Jeeps don't need any further creature comforts (this from a fellow Rubi owner who enjoys AC). What I don't see however, is how power windows (or AC, CD players, headlight shape or coil springs for that matter) cause a SWB vehicle to be anything other than a SWB vehicle. td
they dont. its the trend towards creature comfort that is killing jeep. one option at a time the change is happening.
first they announce that the yj would be sold in addition to the cj line, then they kill the cj. then they announce that the xj would be sold in addition to the kj, then they killed the xj (the ultimate pure utilitarian suv). the solid axle is gone from the wj in '05, that much is already known. eventually it will be gone from the swb, but thats just opinion so maybe that doesnt count. theyre already talking at camp jeep about fixing the front windshields so that they dont fold down. there is no more rubicon trail challenge because the entire line up can no longer cross without stacking it as flat as a back country road.
its not the power windows alone.....its the combined trend of options.
Are you saying the CJ-6 and CJ-8 are not "real jeeps"? Get a grip, Bill! You're "real jeep" crap is getting real old...
Approximately 9/27/03 15:33, Nathan W. Collier uttered for posterity:
And too bad they can't simply split the models into the P-wagons such as the Liberty, Grand Cherokee, Grand Wagoneer, etc. and then move the other series into the hardcore direction with a good short wheel base high clearance model, and perhaps a heavy duty wagon and truck version of that. Put the independent suspension and ride height controls on this P-wagon series for mostly highway but occasional rough trail use....
Personally got no problem with leaving air conditioning on the hard core models... probably from starting jeeping in the western deserts where it can keep your brains from baking. But these should be hose washable interiors, no cheapass fall-apart axles, extended wheel travel, etc. And a bit of towing capacity on any bigger hardcore units would be nice... say like a civilian version of the old 3/4 military jeep that could go pretty much anywhere albeit a bit slowly.
Hmm, mine had AC and power windows....still does but it' s not mine anymore :-(
Collier"
i never said my opinions were based in reason or even rational thought. its purely sentimental....its _my_ "jeep thing".
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