Buying an E34 5 Series

AFAIK R134a systems came in around '92-93. The earlier R12 systems can be regassed. It's use is not illegal, only it's manufacture. Reclaimed R12 can still be used, that's if you can find it. There are also alternative gasses that can be used without modifcations and are a direct replacement for R12. 'Sleeker GT Phwoar' (you'll find him mainly in the 'uk.rec.driving' n/g) has recently regassed his Celica fitted with an R12 system. AFAIK it's still working. :-)

Personally though, I would go for a later car with a R134a a/c system. I also think that later cars, '93 onwards I believe, with the wider radiator grilles, look nicer, and not so dated. Also they have airbags, at least for the driver. Those two or three years younger have passenger airbags as well. Also of course it'll have the VANOS engine, as that came in at about the same time. Mike.

Paging Sleeker Carl!

He's the guy you want to ask about doing this - he did to his Celica GT4 recently. He hangs around in uk.rec.cars.modifications, and you should find posts-a-plenty on the matter on google.

Yes. Think they used re-claimed stuff. It might well be no longer made, though.

Dunno. My SD1 is 84. But IIRC, there is a substitute for R12 anyway, although it may not work quite as well.

"Mike G" wrote in news:42eb7a95$0$39649$ snipped-for-privacy@authen.white.readfreenews.net:

This was a 94 car (albeit an early 94 L reg), but I can't tell which grille it is (it's the burgundy one in autotrader with 80k miles). The worry with the aircon is that it may need expensive work, like Dave said. The owner said that his dealer told him it was to do with the gas, but they quoted him an astronomical price (£1500) to sort it!

A '94 'L' would certainly have a R134a system.

Had a look at cars available in your area on Autotrader. Have you dismissed all these?

Theres what sounds like a nice '97 5 series E39, 125 miles from you. A

523iSE (actually still a 2.5 engine) Manual, climate control. 150k, m/way miles according to the owner. If I was in the market for a manual, I'd go for this one, despite it not having cruise. :-) £2950

Another. Dealer though. E39 528i SE auto. Climate and leather. 32 miles away. £2995.

Or, if you don't mind travelling. How about the '95 auto 525i at £2100 ono. Private sale. Has cruise, a/c, leather etc. 142 miles away. Mike.

To use, yes. Only it's manufacture is illegal, but AFAIK old fridges and freezers used R12, so reclaimed R12 can still be used. Mike.

"Mike G" wrote in news:42eb856f$0$16210$ snipped-for-privacy@authen.white.readfreenews.net:

Probably needs expensive repair work then.

Hmmmm....is that the new double Vanos engine, then? The figures suggest that it should be a bit slower than the old 525 (20bhp less power, a bit less torque and a bit more weight), yet the performance appears to be very similar. Is is worth stretching to an E39, though? They seem to have a few reliability issues that the E34s don't (quite a list on honestjohn). No mention of SH again...

Was put off of these because of the Nikasil thingy, but coming round to them again after one or two encouraging views. No SH again though and worryingly cheap for a dealer.

Probably worth a call. What put me off that one was it having no mention of the service history. I can't see anybody forgetting to mention a FSH in their ad, although they may neglect to mention an incomplete SH.

Thanks for the suggestions. Tempted by the early E39s but what about the reliability? I thought E34s were the best bulit BMW ever - that's what persuaded me to go a bit older in the first place.

I'm very surprised that he hadn't approached an independent air-conditioning specialist for a quote. I'd suggest treading with care.

I think the double VANOS was only fitted on the M52TU engine in the 528's.

Although it's nice to have when you come to sell. I wouldn't rely too much on a service history. My experience with dealers is such that I don't use them any more, except for spares etc. In general their stds are too low for my liking. All the 'Which' surveys confirm that main dealer, and larger garage servicing leave much to be desired. According to Which, small independants tended to miss less and charge less for a better service.

Unless a car has been serviced well, (and how do you know that? ) what real value is it. Better IMO to buy on condition. Take someone along who really knows cars and what to look for, if you're unsure of checking a prospective purchase yourself.

The recent service, oils, plugs and micro filter change on my car was carried out by a mobile tune and service type guy I've known for years. The rest I did myself. It did have a full SH when I baught it, but in his opinion, and mine, the plugs and the microfilter had almost certainly not been changed at it's last dealer service when they should have been. The plugs were quite burnt, and we reckoned the microfilter had years of dirt in it. Surprised air could even get throgh it.

I hadn't looked at Honest Johns findings. By the sound of it though, you're right. A later E34, does look like a better s/h buy than an early E39.

While you're looking, have a look at those in your local dealers and have a drive. Any E34 will give you a taste of what you might expect in the way of build quality, handling etc.You never know, it might be put you off buying one. :-) Mike.

[...big is best...]

My fairly hard driven 740i returned ~22mpg overall, ~26mpg on long M-way journeys on cruise @ 85ish...

...and about 17mpg hooning about the highlands.

You should get a little (~2mpg??) better with the lighter E34.

[...autoboxes...]

Been there, done that. :)

The most embarrassing is when your clutch foot finds the jumbo brake pedal...

[...engine life...]

The M60 will run for ever if you look after it, 500k examples are not rare.

Apart from two extra plugs servicing costs are not going to vary much across the range, optional 17" rims will add more to your costs.

Which reminds me; *AVOID* metric/TRX wheels, the tyres are rare and scary expensive, often costing more than a set of 16"/17" alloys and tyres.

[...]

Pity you don't like Tourings, that looks a real bargain.

Don't dismiss dealer cars, they're not always more expensive and you have lots more Sale of Goods Act rights.

Heh :)

If it was closer to Edinburgh I'd be trying to flog it to my Mum so I could borrow it...

A

Mike Dodd wrote in news:42eb9e6a$0$13706$ snipped-for-privacy@news-text.dial.pipex.com:

He said he didn't think it worth it as he only does 3000 miles a year in it and isn't a fan of A/C anyway. Don't know whether he was telling the truth or not, but personally I think it's a godsend and refuse to compromise on a car without it. I've dismissed that one any way. It was quite a distance away and I'm not travelling so far to look at one unless I think there's a very good chance I'll want to buy it. This one didn't quite make it into that category.

The prospect of buying a car with AC fitted, but not used, and not gassed for any length of time should ring alarm bells - apparently the seals could fail and the compressor could be goosed (someone here will give a more accurate description, I'm sure), so even if it was only a case of needing regassing, some time ago, having left it in that state would, I understand, cause significant damage to the AC (or at least if the AC was then tried).

A good idea, I think, to have walked away from that one.

Alistair J Murray wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@florin.fluffy:

Ouch!

Hmmm...I think the 3.0 V8 is probably the biggest I should consider. Any bigger and I think it'll spend most of it's time sat on the drive while I save up for more petrol :-) Especially with the recent oil price hike! £5 per gallon seem laughable a few years ago but it's coming....

LOL....then you bang your head on the windscreen!

As long as not damaged by supermarket petrol, eh? Apparently, one should look for a smooth idle and do a compression test. I don't have a tester but I can imagine that it would be quite a long job on a M60! Eight coil packs and plugs to remove, then connect the guage and turn over eight times! The owner would have to be patient & co-operative to allow you to do this!

Yes, I've heard of these. Did any of the later E34s have these?

Ah, yes - that's the best way of having a car. Much cheaper than owning it :-)

Mike Dodd wrote in news:42ebba31$0$6483$ snipped-for-privacy@news-text.dial.pipex.com:

Yes. Sometimes they will gas up fine, but I don't intend buying one without it working. Unless the owner agrees to having it gassed as a condition of the sale. In which case, he or she would have to be confident that no other work was required.

Or to not have walked to it in the first place :-) I'm glad now, too. But it was quite tempting....

You don't buy a big V8 to do economy runs. :)

My current B10 drinks only Optimax. =8/

Remember: you can always ware an extra jersey instead of switching the heating on, children thrive on gruel, shiny bog paper is cheap...

;)

That's the one...

[...engine life...]

I doubt if there are any damaged motors still out there since dodgy high sulphur petrol is well in the past. You are in one of the worse affected areas tho'.

IIRC it's a 30min job.

I would just walk away from anything with a lumpy idle unless the owner would do the comp test.

[...]

Not sure, early ones sometimes did, most have been replaced.

I would have bought a Touring if one had shown up, but ALPINA Tourings are rare and I use the extra 60bhp every day and only miss the extra loadspace once or twice a year...

...having a 540iT in the family would be handy. :)

A

Alistair J Murray wrote in news:7a1tr2-hf5.ln1 @florin.fluffy:

This is true. However, I must consider the point that if I get too big an engine, I won't be doing many runs at all, economy or otherwise, due to lack of funding ;-) Besides, I wouldn't think of the 525 as a slow car; certainly quicker than my current car (Primera GT).

I ain't that tight.....well, not quite ;-) Just being realistic, that's all. If I had the money to spend on tanker after tanker of fuel, I wouldn't be fussing over my car purchasing budget.

Moving on, what does everyone think of this:

I initially overlooked this because it's so damned clean, I assumed it had been tarted up by a dodgy dealer. However, looking at the seller's ID (it's his first auction), it looks like he's a valeter. I've been told not to ignore dealers, so what do you think?

I've posted a question about the aircon i.e. why say "will soon need regassing" - does it work or not? Have also asked some specific questions about it's exterior and mechanical condition.

Might try to arrange a viewing, although it's getting near the end of the auction. Worth a bid?

[...]

Nice, but not special...

A few wee worries:

He thinks he has a V6 - how well does he know the car?

There seems to be a bit of beltline trim missing in the big wheel photo between the door and wheel - not in keeping with the apparent condition.

Grey interior - not my taste...

I'd want to see it in the flesh.

Service history is good though.

Got a reply?

I'd not bid "real" money without seeing it, might stick a £1700 autobid in blind on the offchance... :)

A

"Mike G" wrote in news:42ebaa14$0$63881$ snipped-for-privacy@authen.white.readfreenews.net:

Totally agree...it's just that if the condition looks good, it's nice to have the SH there to support the theory that it's been well kept. But SH or not, if I looked at a car and found that the oil was totally black (diesels excluded) and the coolant brown and/or sludgy, service history wouldn't mean a toss to me...I'd be off like a shot!

Yes, I've read about the microfilter change procedure. Looks quite fiddly, I'm not at all suprised it gets missed out. When and if I get one, the first job will be to get a new filter from eurocarparts and fit it.

Alistair J Murray wrote in news:1c6tr2-9i7.ln1 @florin.fluffy:

Hadn't noticed that one. However, I thought there was a V6 until a few days ago when I started taking a real interest in them.

condition.

Did notice that. Not a big deal to replace though? I've posted a question to the seller about it's exterior condition.

I think I'd prefer it over leather. Leather tends to wear on well used cars. My Primera has leather trim and there's bald spots on the seat, wheel and gearknob at only 51,000 miles.

Not yet, only posted this evening. Certainly won't bid much without getting to know.

Will see what I can arrange. Might stick a low bid in like you say. Got to be worth something if in good order mechanically. If not then there's an argument to reject it on grounds of false description.

Thanks for your comments