Just pulled the turbo and exhaust manifold. Went real smooth. But I could hardly believe the turbo was only supported by the manifold. I was thinking there must have been a bracket supporting the turbo -- attached to the block? that someone removed and forgot to replace. If this is the factory design to just have it hanging from the bottom of the manifold and not have it supported any where else someone ought to be brought up on criminal charges. That turbo weighs a ton! No wonder these ex. mans. crack the way they do.
-greg
ps: a certain regular poster has got me thinking of upgrading to a 14b or 16g turbo and a '95 manifold. Will my 'buggered' engine support
'buggered' ? Assusming you mean that it really needs a rebuild (head job, rings bearings and seals), then the answer is in two parts a) not for long, and when it breaks, b) other stuff will need replacing, maybe lots of other stuff.
Bite the buller now, pull the engine and do the job right the first time.
"ps: a certain regular poster has got me thinking of upgrading to a 14b or 16g turbo and a '95 manifold. Will my 'buggered' engine support
14lbs. of boost without swapping out many parts?"
the question is your worn out bearings. on a motor in decent condition ,300hp all day long..... you have the 6 bolt crank and "big" rods, which is the desired set up. when i picked up my new short block last week, one of the techs showed me some dyno info (they have bothe engine and chassis dynos in house.) it was from an eclipse with a stock bottom end and it was making 450whp with a forced performance "red" turbo. it won't last long but is a huge testament as to what the 6 bolt bottom end will deal with. a big issue with your car is fuel. because your car was 'buggered" for the automatic transmission, your injectors are only 375cc/min. instead of the
450cc/min. that are standard: you will run out of fuel as you hit 100% duty cycle with your injectors. you need to monitor O2 sensor voltage, better yet knock to keep a close eye on what's going on. knock will kill you faster than a thrown rod.
My younger brother's car with an AGP Lvl. 3 on it has been running low 11s, and has around 120K on the clock. Before that, the car has seen a FP Red, a Frank V, and a 20G. This is the mileage on the block, not the car (which is well past that mileage) and the motor has seen nothing less than a 20G and 24 psi since it was rebuilt with new stock pistons and rings (about 7 years ago).
Jeff Hill put 518 down on a stock-internal 6-bolt as well. His didn't last as long (machinist problems) but the 6-bolt motors will hold quite a bit of power for quite a bit of time if you keep the tuning within the correct levels (knock, timing, A/F ratios, etc.).
What does he and you think of the L3 (L3R?)? How is the driveability for street use? The newer 56-trims (PTE61, FP3065) look so sweet, but those are some Big turbos. I can't decide if they'd be overkill compared to a 50-trim.
One person with a L3R said he hated it with the 7cm, but he put a Garrett .63 on and loved it.
I'm a little confused about your last reply. If I connect the 'bigger' 1g manifold to my existing TDO4 ( I know, it makes you want to puke ) do I need to port the manifold outlet?
gasket match and port to the 6cm gasket. hurl the ring. i've always used the gasket.
I was under the impression that the outlet of bigger 1g manifold is larger than what I have now?
yes it is bigger but still small....the 7cm gasket is 60mm.
So if I connect it to the turbine housing of my 13g does it match up minus the 'ring' and just grind down the step on my turbine housing? good question. i don't won't mess with the little turbo. good question for josh (dsmdealer1)
When I replaced my original manifold I remember being told by a couple of people that I could bolt the bigger 1g man to my turbo but to discard the ring and DON' T use a gasket!
i use the gasket, perhaps there is something i'm missing but to run without a gasket would require lapped surfaces.
The turbine housing on the TDO5 has a bigger inlet and outlets, right? So is it realistic for me to use the 'big' 1g man w/ the smaller turbine housing and expect a gain even w/out grinding that step?
correct but the porting is free if you have a die grinder. an el' cheapo grinder is $29.95 and $20.00 for a carbide burr. the mod is worth $50.00 port your O2 housing to actually fit your downpipe too...
I have a 2.5" downpipe -- big improvement -- and a 2.5" high flow cat -- also noticeable gain. I just read that the 'ring' was used to make the assembly process easier at Normal, Il but I thought it was necessary for a leak-proof connection? What you think?
hurl the ring, use the gasket.
The other part of your reply is regarding the 14 lb boost. Did you mean this IS within the SAFE range for the TDO4 or were you talking
safe boost for the 14B on an otherwise stock car is 15psi. that's a stock 5 speed w/ 450cc/min injectors. i haven't owned an automatic since 1980 so i can't comment on on your upper limit with anything more than a guess. YOU need to monitor it. i get the impression that you're still using the stock boost gauge. (?) don't! it is a worthless piece of shit: the numbers it gives are an extrapolation and not really based on fact. you will blow your motor if you trust in this thing.
I went to the vfaq page you listed and found out that I would need new oil and water lines for the upgrade and I was only planning on replacing the oil feed line IF I can get my turbo rebuilt at a reasonable price.
again , i do not mess with the auto car but i was under the notion that all of the misu turbos had the same water and oil connections....the 14B and 16G are totally compatable.
does 14lbs. really REQUIRE bigger injectors and up-graded fuel pump?
not on the 5 speed car.....remember when i told you your car was buggered and you got mad ? :)
One last thing, when I was running the turbo with vacuum hose disconnected from wastegate actuator was I probably getting more than the 12 lbs that the stock gauge said? this gauge is not to be trusted under any circumstances where real data is required. it tells you that some kind of boost is being produced and that's it. get something from autometer....cheap and effective.
read what josh said earlier about the bigger turbos and spool up and let me repeat that you're shooting yourself in the foot with the auto trans.........get some seat time in the awd/ 5 speed and don't look back.
The turbo has been great, but once again, it's like car-audio. You can buy the best stuff on the maket, but if the installation/tuning is off, it's not gonna work worth spit.
The car pulls HARD through the midrange, to the point of it getting squirrely through 2nd and 3rd gear at the track on C16 if you're not running really low air pressure and decent tires.
I'm currently installing a PTE 60-trim on a customer's GVR4 as well. If you're interested in comparing the two, drop me an e-mail, and I'll let you know my impressions when I get to doing the swap later this week.
I think that both turbos will perform similarly, and that tuning variations will truly make more of a difference than the turbos themselves--but, this is just an assumption until I get to play with the PTE later this week.
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