900 turbos gen me up saabisti

You will find info on specifications and performance with complete model history on

Also gives insurance groups, economy and other boring details. You can at least have some idea of what features your new car will have. So you can tell if someone has put different badges on the car to pass it off as something else.

I wouldn't go for a high mileage or old one. Poor economy, high insurance, high road tax, very easy to steal and they go sloppy with higher mileage. If you get a decent one then performance is very good and it will be comfortable but the seats wear quickly.

Go for a Mondeo or a Vectra instead. Alternatively a decent turbo diesel will leave the SAAB standing, be cheaper to run and hold it's value.

The wrong wheels drive it.

Fraser

Which one - the old "real" SAABs or the GM abortions?

The GM abortions aren't that good IMHO...

As standard no, but with a few quid on a steering rack brace and rack mount bushes and some decent shocks, they can be made to at least point vaguely in the direction you point them. As standard, the unbraced rack with soft wobbly bushes that perish with 20 minutes of new delivery mean the car can choose it's own path in life.

The engines are essentially the same as the older 900, but turned sideways, and the gearbox is a much newer GM unit than the older one, and doesn't have the same weak spots, but more torque steer aside from the crappy steering mountings. They do handle (once braced) better than an averagely maintained C900. But they don't have the confident feel still.

A Classic 900

GM900 Classic Saab 900 T16S Good car in 3 or 2 door trim. Inner arches can rust. Ball joints can make you thing the front end is going to fall off. Very weird handling if the aligment is different to what Saab originally stated. The GM 900 uses different alignment figures, but a lot of garages don't know the difference and use the wrong figues, so the car is "Aligned correctly" but handles like a bag of spuds. Gear box is a weak spot. Was designed for 125 BHP, in a full pressure 900 it is running upto 185 as standard. Anymore than 225 and gentle use it is chocolate. 3rd gear is most prone to breaking, because nobody is stupid enough to seriously welly it in 1st or 2nd when tuned.

Early ones had the front handbrake and setup from the 99, a much smaller lighter car. They still work but the handbrake is a git at MOT.

Later cars used the 9000 setup with smaller discs and a different flexi hose system/mounting at the front. With different hoses and a mount made up, you can fit 9000 Aero big discs to a late 900 (pre93-94). Using a volvo intercooler in place of the side mounted standard one is a massive improvement. You can tweak the pots on the APC to give higher max boost, and steeper or gentler boost curve, and play games with various resistors to improve the range futher. They have either bosch or lucas injection/management. There are some chips available, but these are fixed not mapable. As the car is so simple, they are programmed to suit a set larger size of injector, a known quantity different turbo and a suitable different fuel pressure regulator, or to raise or remove the rather aggressive and very harsh rev limit. You pick a chip that suits what you plan for the engine, then build the engine to suit.

There was a project to make a magasquirt a swapin ECU just adding wiring for the Map and temp sensors as part of the adaptor kit, using the factory knock sensor and a wideband or factory Lambda (add if needed as a lot didn't have one as standard).

C900 legendary load capacity.

The later Post 94 GM or NG900 is essentially based on a Cavalier floor pan with Saab engine, cav box, and Saab designed suspension using what it was allowed from the GM parts bin. The transverse engine added a lot of torque steer over the old north/south arrangement as it lost the equal length drive shafts, the chocolate steering rack mounting assists this, and the Macstrut front end takes away a lot of the sensitivity that the double wishbone gave. A lot of people thought the old one harsh after driving the new one, but it was essentially "numbed" down, because the same people complained about a loss of feel too. A steering brace and new bushes solves the woolly feeling. Engine is the same, box is much better and doesn't implode so regularly. But most used a cable clutch rather than hydraulics and was badly routed. Cables are a git. They switched to hydraulics late in the product life. Don't buy the V6. The V6 turbo is run off half the engine, and all the V6 models have a cambelt not a camchain. People buy saabs to run and run, a belt needs remembering the chain lasts loads. They are more powerful as stock and lighter/shorter. They can be made to handle, and they don't look too bad, in stock form they put out slightly more power than the old classic

900 and they are programable from a handset holding a map that can then be tweaked. And as they are well known for tuning, they can be "mapped" to suit a "staged" kit of parts of the shelf.

will sort out the wandering front.http://smallr.com/1tg is the stage3 "inabox" tuning kit, exaust, filter and ECU remapped to suit.You can go further but for that you need Maptun.Shows some Maptun tuned GM 900's. Unfortunatly some of the owners revues are in Swedish. I would look for an SE over an S (better standard, less option spec) and a "good" GM will be cheaper to buy and run than a "Good" classic, but won't be as nice to drive unless you do stuff to it.

A decent general saab site with god linkage off of it.

official Saab Videos gathered by an enthusiast.http://www.saabvideos.com/videos.html

This might do you.

bit flexier than the 2/3 doors but looks well looked after. The rocker gaskers sometimes leak and need replacing properly. as does=20 the oil cooler (hoses split and the cooler can get whacked with a=20 stone). Might be worth checking out, but you won't get much better body=20 condition and MOT time to sort out any niggles. And you will get your=20 cash back if you don't bugger about with it while sorting the niggles.=20 second gear is more of a worry, but as long as it doesn't jump out and=20 is just weakened synchros, it might go on for years.

--=20 Carl Robson Audio stream:

Playing at home:Muse-Map of the Problematiqu=E9

The proper ones (ie, C900) rust a bit and were overpriced when I went looking for one. You'd get a decent 16V MK2 Golf for £1000. £1000 spent on a SAAB (unless you find a seller who isn't convinced it's a classic and worth a fortune) will get you something a bit sheddy.

There's a nice one on my street that I'm tempted by though...

This might do you.

Have been watching that one myself Carl! Good mech write up too...I've come across most of these issues over the last 8 yrs and 5 old saabs!

If I may add some more info. I've seen a lot of bodykitted lpt c900s sold as 'Turbo S'. Most obvious differences are the boost gauge:

and intercooler (or lack of) but these are often retrofitted to lpt cars. The harder thing to retrofit is the APC (Automatic Performance Control) which although pretty primative today, it's very advanced for a 1983 release. APC is purely analogue, it controls boost and knock pretty effectively (and with an electicians screwdriver, boost curve/peak can be adjusted to taste) The actual mechanics of the engine (comp. ratio and such) are identical, c900's orginally had Garrett T3, I think the intro of the LPT in 1990(?) was the first time they had Mitsubishi turbos (The mitsu unit fitted to FPT has larger flow). Value is *very* dependant on model, the ones which hold value are fullyloaded(leather, AC, bodykit) VGCondition LPTs, limited editions, flat front TurboS and 'last of line' FPT ('91 to '93). The '91 FPT is a particularly useful model as engine performane had been enhanced to cope with a Cat being added but the Cat can legally be removed. One thing to look for is the Red APC (the box it's in is actually red), which apart from being fitted to limited editions like the Ruby, was an optional extra 10bhp (see the red box in right hand wing in this pic: ) After this you'll tell us it's a NewGen 900 you're after!

cheers

Ken

My flat front T16S B plate was =A3300 and never needed much. It was a lot= =20 more solid than the T16S Convertible J plate I paid =A32500 for.=20 Mechanically the vert was better, but structurally it needed a fair bit=20 of work, if I had a second car I would have got it done. Lost about =A3800= =20 selling it after 6 months, but I couldn't have hired a car for that=20 long, so I didn't lose really.

The B plate looked rough but was structurally solid. The J plate looked pretty and clean but was a real mess in some=20 structural aread (A pillars had rotted on both sides where visible but=20 solid in the inner wings). Needed a windscreen and a new roof and work=20 to the electric window mechanism which is unique to the convertable. The B plate was Bosch with a T3 The J plate vert was Lucas with a Mitsu. I got a lot better economy from the Lucas/Mitsu equiped car and it was=20 just as quick, but smoother. But it had a completly rebuilt engine.

And yes, I would have another if I wanted something huge, but comfy and=20 fast. Maybe even consider a 9000 FPT Anniversary if I could find a black=20 one without light coloured leather.

But that will have to wait. Life in the old Octavia yet.

--=20 Carl Robson Audio stream:

Playing at home:Muse-Knights of Cydonia

Didn't you have your FlatFront over 5 yrs ago, prices for proper early T16S have changed a little through sheer rarity as much as anything (How many c900 do you see on the roads these days?)

Yeh, got better mpg from my '93 LPT than my current passat 1.8T sport

Prices for convertables are daft for a car with more scuttle shake than a rubber band!

Actually, I see one or two a month driving and a few more parked.

Would be about 2-3 years ago that I sold it. Owned it about 18months. I generally get bored with cars very quickly. The Octavia has lasted because why boringly dependable and able to drive, it is so reliable, I just wash it, check the fluids and tyres and get it serviced when it asks. And I've only done about 200 miles in the last 3 months, 100 of them last week when I went to see my mother in Hospital (the cancer is back and this time very agressive from visibly removed to 4 pound weight in 4 weeks, after the clean removal last time they hope they might get it, but the healing took too long. The wound kept opening and getting infected and then suddenly boom, it is back and angry and this time it looks like it might get her. They reckon they can schrink it with radiation maybe, but might need to keep cutting it out once a month if that don't work). Sorry got side tracked there.

It was still a great drive, and fantstic to drop the roof on an Autumn=20 or spring night when it was pitch black but still warm and go for a=20 night time drive.

Worth owning just for that.

--=20 Carl Robson Audio stream:

Playing at home:Muse-Knights of Cydonia

This might do you.

Hey, I want that one!! Should be having a bid tomorrow :-) It's nearer me than Rob too...

Mike P

I went to see my mother in Hospital (the cancer is

Shit! You've *really* got to be strong haven't you!

What a great track that is!

Yes. She is on constant self administered morphine on a button, plus extra doses from the nurse should she need it, after they have checked she hasn't had too much. That takes her appetite away, so she is only eating properly about once a day. It also makes her skin crawl (common side effect I've been told). She isn't as down about it as I expected. But she is resigned that this one will get her. When we were over there, she said to the missus, "I hope you haven't got me anything expensive for Xmas, you might need to take it back". She told my stepdad that she doesn't think she will be arround for Xmas.

All this shit started nearly 2 years ago, They told her it was a trapped nerve, with outpatient, physio and GP visits they still couldn't do anything and it got to the point where she can't walk. Then in the early summer her leg, and arse cheek swelled to a stupid size and then they decided it might be more serious than a trapped nerve.

They didn't even look for anything else until the day she was admitted all swelled and in agony. There is going to be a medical negligence case started as soon as a final outcome is known one way or another.

They took her to Oswestry to the Robert Jones orthopeadic hospital because while they aren't cancer specialists they could remove the tumour with least damage as it was soft tissue, not bone or organ based. The plan was remove the tumour, let the wounds heal, then irradiate it at Christies. But it just wouldn't heal.

I went to see her at Oswestry first time. With being out of work, I was going to leave visiting while she was at home, and let my brothers do that as they live closer (she said it was a good idea), then I was going to visit while she was in Christies as it was closer for me to get to and further for the rest of the family. As it is, she is back at the Rob Jones again, and I had another 100 mile round trip to take her some Choccies and make sure he ate them.

It is. A very good track.

Ouch, you have my sympathy. My brother lost his fight with myeloma last year, he'd beaten the statistics and was constantly referred to as the only patient who put on weight, grew more hair and looked disgustingly healthy while on chemotherapy.

Best wishes to your mother, a tumour of the sort she has can be really distressing since it's an affront to one's dignity.

But you don't need me to tell you that. Words are never adequate at times like these.

Sorry to hear about that mate. Hope all goes well for you and your family.

Fraser

Cheers. She is ready to go I think. She's not finished living, just ready for dying. Which is a bit shit. She is only around mid to late 50's.

They said last time that it was so high even if they removed the leg, they wouldn't be able to give her a false one because there would be nothing to attach to.

This time it is spreading up rather than down.