BMW M3 or Porsche 911 Carrera Coupe

My car isn't quite as nice as a Corvette, but if you're in California, and would like to attend a Green Day, or other race day, I'd be willing to put my 96 Viper up against your Porsche on either Laguna Seca or Infineon raceway. Interested? It would be fun. Of course I bought mine used for less than 1/2 the price of your car..... so if I lose, I'll just use that as an excuse.

But I suspect I might not lose. Just a suspicion.

: - )

Didn't someone start a magazine called Benz-O? I have a Benz, but I just call it "daily transportation".

: - )

I hope that doesn't happen. I bought my 99 C5 Corvette convertible for $48,000 at the time. I knew it wasn't built as well as any of my prior 911s (although it was built a LOT better than my present 96 Dodge Viper Grinmobile) The price was what made the decision for me to buy the car. I didn't want to spend the money for a Porsche, Ferrari, etc.

Now I'm getting older, and starting to think about things like retirement. If I bought a Porsche it would be a late model 993, at used prices (and because I prefer air cooled). But a buddy of mine just ordered one of the last of the C5s (built last week). He got $8000 off of MSRP, which will put his purchase price for a brand new coupe (removable top) at under $40,000. He's got lots of kids, and is remodeling his home. At this price, it's justifiable against even a mid-range sedan, and he can have a 6 speed blast on the cheap. No way he (or I) could justify spending over $75,000 for effectively the same daily thrills. $35,000 in savings is a lot of remodeling, or a wedding for a kid.

Corvette has its market pegged correctly. It is middle America, dreaming of getting out of the family sedan into something sexy, fun, and impractical, without it costing an arm and a leg.

My vote is that Corvette continues making accessible sports cars at prices that the average fireman, cop, teacher, factory worker, software writer, can dream about. None of these people is going to buy a Ferrari, Porsche or new Viper. $75,000 and up, if for people with no other responsibilities, or people who have been lucky enough to earn far above median incomes in the U.S. Otherwise, it is very difficult to justify spending those types of dollars on cars.

I do, but I'm a few cards short of a full deck..... : - )

Ironic, from a top poster.

I was surprised how long this stayed on topic.

Thanks - precisely what I meant...

Deep

Yep, I heard something similar. I would think Chevrolet could afford to make the car a loss leader in order to burnish its image. Price the car to break even and sink the lost profit on each car into improving the quality of materials and build, and make your money on the other 1.5+ million vehicles annually. Porsche makes 50K vehicles a year and needs to turn a profit on each one, but Chevrolet could build a better Corvette and make their money on all their other stuff.

A friend (with a supercharged, Dinan modified M3) said he heard/read a review on the C6 that was lukewarm. Don't remember him saying where/when and I didn't ask since Corvettes aren't something I really care about.

I'm reserving judgement until I see one in person, but I remember Road & Track or maybe Motor Trend running drawings of what their spies had told them was the C6, and that car reminded me strongly of the Nissan 350Z. Supposedly Chevrolet did test marketing with current and previous Corvette owners and they howled mightily about the proposed shape. Next thing I saw was an obviously new Corvette in a Chevy commercial that looked like a Viper nose slapped on a C5 body (and the new Viper nose reminded me of a Lexus SC 300/400). I'm wondering if Chevrolet abandoned a more radical redesign of the body late in the game and had to come up with something in a hurry to make the car's introduction date.......

I would think Chevrolet could afford to treat the Corvette as a loss leader and plow the profits into better materials and build quality. Price the car to break even and make your money on the other 1.5+ million vehicles annually. Porsche makes 50K vehicles a year and needs to turn a profit on each one, but Chevrolet can make their money on their other stuff, if they chose to do so.

A friend with a Dinan modified and supercharged M3 was saying he heard an early review of the C6 that was lukewarm. I'm reserving judgement until I see one in person. Motor Trend or maybe R&T ran a drawing of the rumored C6 a year or so ago, and that car reminded me strongly of the Nissan 350Z. Then an obviously new Corvette shows up in a Chevy TV commercial recently, looking like a Viper nose grafted on a C5 body. Chevrolet reportedly test marketed the new shape with current and previous Corvette owners and they hated it. I wonder if Chevrolet had to come up with a new body on short notice to make the car's introduction date. Back in 1983 (I think) Chevrolet was having so much trouble with the design/build quality on the Corvette they never introduced an '83. The model line skipped from 1982 to 1984.

OT, if you're looking for a fun drive (that doesn't go anywhere) try De Luz Road out of Fallbrook. It goes about 9 or 10 miles and the pavement ends at the Welburn Gourd Farm (which is good if you're into gourds, I guess). Then you get to run it again in the other direction to get back to civilization.....

Tyler, If you had to invest for a decade to afford one of these two great cars, you have to work even harder to keep your dream car running. You may want to check with you local tax department if you need to pay 5 percent property tax every year on the car. It's not so much that you can afford to buy it, it's more that you can afford to keep it.

For the performance, go to buy a WRX. Good luck.

The 911 996 is NOT that much more own... Oil changes are maybe a little more expensive, but the reliablity of a Porsche is realllllly good...

Also I was very surprised at the cost of insurance on the 996. It isnt all that much more expensive than a 'normal' car... Say my Audi... And M3's insurance is very high, at least in my area. I guess based on statistics M3 drivers are worse.. or maybe they get stolen more.

Maybe its worth checking if you are looking at both cars, but I am pretty sure the 996 will cost less to insure than an M3. I live in MA, USA.

Also, I must say - I have had my 996 for about 8 to 10 weeks. I love this car. Its by far the absolute best car I have ever had... Sure, I cant haul home sheet rock - but just for driving.. I love it.

Cheers,

Adam

HAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHHAHA......

I wouldn't drive 500 miles for that and in any case at 46 I'm not into the duel business, particularly when I've invested almost 150K in my hardware. I've a lot of respect for the Viper, it uses a truck engine but it is faster than normally aspirated Porsche 911 in the le-mans category. Don't put it against a TT though, the 911 tt is another animal and many tt out there are a way more powerful than what a viper engine can generate. A standard 911tt does 0-60 in 3.9s and has a maximum speed of 305 Km/h. A standard 911 tt kick your viper butt, it is mathematics not sci-fi. Of a modified tt you can see only the exhaust pipes when the 600hp kick in. btw what are you doing in this newsgroup? Porsche envy?

You're showing your ignorance. Other than both being V10's and having the same cylinder spacing, the Magnum truck engine and Viper's V10 have less in common than, say, the engines in the Boxster and 911.

Look at the headers - he's actually posting from the BMW group.

Floyd

General car enthusiast. I've owned 3 Porsche 911s, and have driver's seat time in both the Turbo and the Boxster S.

I've owned most marques over the years in cars and motorcycles, and tend to follow newsgroups across a number of both.

Nothing I've been near is faster than my prior Suzuki GSXR 1000 K3 ( 0 - 60 in 2.8 seconds) but I find that track expertise has more to do with the pilot than the machinery.

If you're not racing, why exactly did you put $150,000 into a car bred for racing? What can you possibly do on the streets that a Subaru WRX Sti can't do just as well?

And don't forget that the "truck engine" was engineered by a true Italian race engine developer, and has a fair amount of additional power capabilities.

Enjoy your Porsche. Wonderful marque.

It was a slam. I doubt someone sophisticated enough to put $150,000 into a Porsche 911 tt didn't know better. Who cares? Great cars all the way around. We're lucky to have them. I keep my Porsche hat and buttons. Never know when I'll want my 4th 911. : - )

But I do subscribe to the Porsche newsgroup as well, and quite a few others as well. I absolutely love cars, and in over 30 years of car ownership have been blessed to own quite a number of them. Porsches, BMWs, Corvettes, Vipers, etc. included. Gives me a fair amount of comparison background.

Sorry, no Ebonics spoken here. No wonder you can't pronounce Porsche.

Sam-

The paragraph above brings up a point - it seems to me that most 'Vette owners are repeat buyers, and so they have to cater to an ageing demographic for the newer models. Take the younger buyer's tendency to European or Japanese performance cars and I see the Corvette eventually dying off with the Boomer demographic. Sooner or later, GM is going to have to bring up their game if they want to keep the model. (Ford is in similar straits with the Mustang, imo). You're right, they did skip the Corvette for the '83 model year. As my .sig might indicate, I've got a bit of interest in cars from that year. Emanuel

And 0-60 times matter to who? On the street, just the kids that want to street race.