Autozone engines

No and no, respectively.

No, and yes, only if you put the engine on the bed of your pickup and drive 100,000 miles.

Is there a reason as to why they are no good?

Hi, Stryped, do you need a Chev product by chance? If so, GM has a good line of replacement AND high performance engines--crate engines have proven to be quite a strong as well as reasonably-priced product. Be sure and avoid their re-manufactured ones, as they sell those too--not nearly so reliable. Just a chance this is what you are looking to buy. Other mfg's may have a similar line. HTH, s

Chrysler certainly does, although I have no experience with them.

nate

The same reason parts store "remanufactured" alternators, starters, distributors, carburetors A/C compressors and suchlike are no good: Abusively cleaned, then indifferently thrown together in a slapdash, hurry-up fashion using lowest-bid replacement parts.

Parts-store engines are usually ultra-low-budget rebuilds. Cheap parts, quick-and-dirty machine work, etc. Not much time and effort taken to ensure high quality.

What brands of remanufactured parts are reliable? I thought that Bosch and car maker's brands would be good, but I've recently read something bad about Bosch, an years ago someone who claimed to have worked at a Motorcraft factory said that their A/C compressors were sandblasted and the thead holes not protected or retapped. In my own experience, a remanufactured AC Delco alternator had a bearing seize up in a few weeks (originally I thought I was lucky because Pep Boys was out of its own brand and substituted this one for the same price and warranty). Because of all this, when my starter motor went out, I bought a no-name brand new one (supposedly by Rotating Electric) rather than a rebuilt Motorcraft or NAPA.

I once talked a friend out of buying a $650 rebuilt engine, so he instead paid about $1500 for a Spartan, which worked out well for him. Did he just get lucky, or is that a good company (18 mo/18K warranty, and they claimed to run their engines before selling them)?

None.

"Bosch Remanufactured" = farmed out to the low-bid factory where unskilled workers tear apart cores, abusively clean them with overharsh abrasives -- destroying machined tolerances and protective surface finishes in the process, throw the mismatched parts of numerous different and marginally compatible originals back together using poor-quality Chinese consumables (brushes, bearings, diodes, etc.), spray 'em with clear coat that lasts all of 3 months, and throw 'em in "BOSCH" boxes together with a 3-color Certificate of Lifetime Warranty.

Hint: The "BOSCH" boxes are right next to the "ACDelco" boxes are right next to the "MOTORCRAFT" boxes are right next to the "MOPAR" boxes are right next to the "AUTOLITE" boxes are right next to the "CHAMPION" boxes are right next to the "Original Equipment reManufactured" boxes (not kidding about any of these, even the last ones).

A new alternative has been showing up in the last two or three years to the relatively costly, labor-intensive "remanufacturing" process described above. It works like this:

-Low bidder orders copycat starters, alternators etc. from China

-Boxes them as above

-Marketeer describes as "100% NEW!".

A graphic example of this can be seen in this genuine, official White House photograph:

This depicts President Bush's visit to USA Industries in Bay Shore, NY, in March of 2004. He went there to trumpet his tax cuts' benefit to good old-fashioned American businesses like USA Industries.

Only one problem: See all those starter/alternator boxes stacked up behind the smiling politicos, flanking the great big American flag?

The only thing American about them is the labor involved in removing them from shipping containers and putting them in those boxes. USA Industries does not manufacture or remanufacture anything -- they collect starter and alternator cores, sell 'em for scrap metal, and import Chinese copycat parts for insertion into flag-festooned "USA INDUSTRIES" boxes and distribution to your friendly local auto parts store.

DS

Not even NAPA's? :(

I read that Pep Boys buys its rebuilt engines from a company that specializes in getting tax breaks and subsidies for locating its facilities in run down areas. Apparently the quality is really bad.

Which part of "none" is hard to grasp?

Depends on which lines. A-1 Cardone makes some decent stuff. Their rebuilt ECM's are good along with the water pumps among other things. There are also local shops that rebuild starters and alternators that do good work and turn out reliable stuff and, unlike the Internet, if they run their mouth's about something they know nothing about they go out of business fast. There are even machine shops that rebuild engines. Look in the yellow pages, make friends and ask. It's not hard...

Dan, you are living in the past. Most alternators now are so precisely made that the quality of reman units is essentially equal to new. Our defect rate on reman was 3 to 1 over new 20 years ago. Today they are essentially the same. The only variance is due to the fact that people are quicker to assume a reman unit is defective, than that they misdiagnosed the problem. With a new one, they assume it has to be good, since it's new, so they keep looking for the REAL problem. The above is less so with starters, as the technology hasn't changed. But the fact remains that regional rebuilders with a parts washer and a spray can have gone the way of the dodo bird. Rebuilders today put out quality stuff, or they go out of business.

We sell PROMaster (

) Engines, and also Roadmaster.Both sell to OE dealers for warranty. They meet all the specs, and are arguably as good as the engine that came out of the car. There are rebuilders of very high quality. Don't confuse them with the local sweatshop. As for what Zone sells, I have no idea who builds their motors. If it's one of the above, which I doubt, I'd have no problem using it. Given a choice of all possible, 1st choice would be a facotry (new) crate engine, 2nd choice would be a PROformance reman.

Rex B

Horseshit.

...because the "new" ones are Chinese knockoffs, not genuine parts. No mystery there.

That may be your opinion, but I'm pretty sure you haven't got stats to back it up.

Wrong again. Compare a 1975 Dodge starter to a 2005 Dodge starter and tell me it's the same. Oh, yeah, the '05 reduction gears are planetary helicals rather than offset spurs as in '75, and the '05 motor's a small permanent-magnet unit rather than the '75's large series/shunt wound unit, and the whole '05 assembly weighs 7 pounds instead of 18 pounds as in the '75, and the '05 has a machined nose bearing support in the bellhousing rather than a starter nosecone as in '75, but the "technology hasn't changed"...right?

I'm not sure whom you're arguing with, but it certainly isn't me. I've never advocated in favor of spray-can rebuilds.

Naw, they put out Chinese shit (either complete "new" shitty Chinese copycats or indifferently thrown-together items "remanufactured" with shitty Chinese replacement parts), with fancy "LIFETIME WARRANTY!" certificates, on terms that make the MBA buyers all giggly and weak-kneed, and by the time there's a noticeable problem pattern, they've changed their name and gone to new boxes so they can sell themselves to the MBAs again.

I know you spend your days behind the parts counter, Rex, and certainly you get to see a lot of what goes on in that sector from where you sit. But, I spend my days at the supply end of the chain, and a great deal of what you're assuming happens upstream of you simply isn't so.

That must be what you stepped in because the simple truth is that there are some very decent lines of rebuilt parts.

You have inspected all the suppliers and verified this? Seems you have no idea what is still made in America today or the actual quality of some of the Chinese parts.

Neither do you. Offer anyone at random a choice of something new or rebuilt and see what they choose.

It still uses a DC motor to turn a gear to spin a flywheel to start an engine. While the starter has been refined and improved the basic technology is the same.

You have lost all sense of reality and repeat the same tired nonsense. Not only do Rebuilders go out of business for selling junk, the people that install the stuff are not far behind them.

In today's economy, it is often cheaper to source new components than to reclaim and test cores. Those reman's have a much higher percentage of new componentry than even 10 years ago Often the only thing re-used on a starter is the case and the commutator end-plate.

In some cases, yes. But we get the same stats on Delphi new starters and alternators. Our sales in our reman line is about $1 million/year, so we have a pretty good statistical base.

Our 'better-quality' reman line (the same one that your local GM dealer sells under the 'Delco' label) is pressuring us to also carry his new product line, imported from China. The problem is, both our regular reman electrical line, and this 'better' line have such a low defective rate that we would have a hard time justifying a line of new product at a higher price.

True, but it was a subjective observation based on years of selling parts.

That's more of gradual improvements in engineering rather than changes in the core technology. My point is you can't "rebuild" a GM alternator with a nutdriver and an impact wrench like you could in the 1960s. Starters have evolved to a lesser extent. That is probably changing now, but we in the aftermarket won't see it for a year or two.

You seem to be lumping all suppliers of reman parts into the same category, alongside pond scum. There is plenty of junk out there, but a parts store that intends to stay in business cannot continue to sell anything but quality for very long. I can tell you that when a store sees his defect rate rise on a product line, he is on the phone to us demanding good answers or a different product line. The stores that don't care about their customers go for those pond-scum lines so they can offer the lowest price, and shrug off the inevitable quality problems.

Our primary reman line comes out of shiny new plants just over the boarder in Mexico. I haven't seen them, but others in our company have toured them and have been very impressed with the cleanliness and attention to quality. When we have reliability or fitment issues, we get fast, intelligent answers. And both our full-time buyers are non-degreed and came up through the ranks as counter people.

Actually I haven't sold a part behind a counter in about 10 years. Most of my job now is marketing, but I get involved with a lot of other things in this organization. I think I get a pretty good overview, and I visit stores regularly - ours and our competitors - to keep up with trends and identify needs.

RB

Ah. That explains it.