How could lug nuts break on a car?

My brother came home last night, claiming he can't drive his car anymore because two of the lug nuts broke and two are missing (all on the same tire). How could this happen? I've never heard of them breaking before, and two falling off? Is it most likely due to something he did and just isn't fessing up to it?

Reply to
brebers
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"brebers" wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@v46g2000cwv.googlegroups.com:

They break because somebody was jumping on the lug wrench to tighten them.

Reply to
TeGGeR®

Normally this happens when they are overtightened, although it's more likely that the lugs themselves break off. Some guy cranks down on all the lugs as hard as possible, then six months later notices that a bunch of them have sheared right off.

--scott

Reply to
Scott Dorsey

lug nuts seize, rust binds them to the stud, the use of air wrenches can "twist" them off, a very common happening.

missing lug nuts?? could have worked loose, off. or even stolen.

Reply to
fiveiron

Actually, some one left them too loose. Can't say if it was your brother or maybe some thief that was interrupted during an attempt to steel the wheels. Who knows

Reply to
Kevin

When you replace the studs and lug nuts make sure you put a small amount of anti-seize compound on the threads to keep this from happening again. Many times the nuts will rust to the stud, and then when a tire shop or whatever goes to remove them with air tools the stud shears off. If it doesn't shear off, then when they go and hammer the lugs back on it basically welds the nut to the stud, and it will break off sooner or later but no later than the next time you try to take it off to change a flat......

Been down that road before myself, not a big or expensive deal to fix. Most auto parts places will have what you need on the shelf to get the car repaired.

Chris

Reply to
halatos2000

Anti-seize should not be used on wheel studs, only use a small amount of light oil.

Reply to
William J. Ford

is an anti-seize application recommended for lug nuts?

Reply to
fiveiron

How does he know they broke...were there pieces on the ground? If he didn't see any pieces of lug nut then one of two things happened:

  1. They were not tightened properly and literally fell off the wheel.
  2. Somebody was trying to steal a wheel. Difficult to do if the car isn't jacked up though, so my vote would be for number 1.
Reply to
John S.

That's the best way to snap off the new ones that I know of... You are not supposed to lube lug nuts, the studs can stretch and snap.

Mike

86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail >
Reply to
Mike Romain

The last time that happened to us the garage forgot to tighten up the wheel after fixing a flat. The nuts worked loose and several fell off, then the last two couldn't take it anymore and snapped.

Mike

86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail >
Reply to
Mike Romain

Mike Romain wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@sympatico.ca:

Dang it Mike we have been through this before. Anti sieze is not a lube per say. We have used it for 20 years now with NO ill effects on wheel studs, nuts, or tightening procedures. Ford recomened it 20 years ago and I have not seen a reason not to use it since. We use it on every type of wheel from garden carts to Simi tractor and trailers. Not one lost nut or other problem from using it in all that time. If you have problems it is not from the anti sieze unless your using it completly wrong. (IE slathering it on maby??) I realize some winny engineers say otherwise, but 20 years of industry wide experence says they are wrong. KB

Reply to
Kevin Bottorff

been there, had that.

overtightened... snap... or undertightened... and when the wheel starts to wobble, it'll snap the stud off. aluminum wheels sometimes need to be retorqued... or if it's an old 60's Dodge they used left hand thread... and someone snapped them trying to steal the wheels.

Usually about $1 per stud to replace if you do it at home. Fairly cheap if you pay a mechanic. You can still drive - slowly - to the garage, just make sure the remaining nuts are tight.

Reply to
ray

And as I probably said before, I live in the rust belt and worked in garages for a lot of years and we were 'always' taught to 'never' use any lube on lug nuts.

Anti-seize is considered lubrication when it comes to torque specs! There is a wet and a dry torque. There 'is' a reason for this.

It isn't just made up by 'winny' engineers....

Most people use a cross bar tire wrench that has no torque settings. Maybe I am just too big, but I can snap off a dry lug, let alone a lubed up one... Same for head bolts. Some are supposed to be lubed, some aren't. I have seen lots of snapped off well greased ones....

Mike

Reply to
Mike Romain

Mike Romain wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@sympatico.ca:

I also live in the rust belt and since 1980 was told to use anti sieze and have, and every place I have worked at has used it and it has NEVER been a problem. I don`t know the caliber of the places you have worked but I have always worked at top shops, and experience and the experts have always proven this out. You try to remove a simi trailer lug that has been on the road for a year with out anti sieze and it is not a fruitfull experence. With it it is a breeze. I have never had a problem with overtightening any bolts but it could just be experience and feel is different. Also most people do not use a hand lug to tighten wheels unless it is a flat. Do it yourselfers may but they are a small minoriy compaired to the population as a whole. As I said I have done thousands over the years and never had a single problem, or heard of one, that wasn`t caused by another error. It is indesdensible in a rust belt shop. KB

Reply to
Kevin Bottorff

So you are saying that 'You' are personally responsible for some of the tires that keep falling off the Semi Tractor Trailers?????!!!!

People are getting killed that way sir!

I guess I 'really' don't need to say any more about the dangers of anti-seize on lug nuts in this thread do I?

Wow.

I will always post the counter and correct way do do lugs when some other person says to use a lubricant or anti-seize just for this reason.

Mike

86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view! Jan/06
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(More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
Reply to
Mike Romain

Mike Romain wrote in news: snipped-for-privacy@sympatico.ca:

if you can`t admit your wrong its your problem not mine. I stated that out of thousands of lugs done with anti sieze, NONE have had a problem. That includes all the simi trailer ones, all trackable by the way, have not had one come loose or off when torqued to spec. The ones you see comming off are bud wheels or improply torqued other ones. So save your I am better than you even though the facts prove other wise, for some one that believes you have super intelect far above your experence. When the factory, the makers of anti sieze, and shop owners, (get it, liable persons) all agree it is a good idea, for some reason I am not going to put much stock in your OPINION KB

Reply to
Kevin Bottorff

Almost hate to put my dog in this fight, but for what it's worth, in my 40 years of wrenching I have always advocated using anti seize (not lubricant) on lug bolts along with proper tightening. It sure has made life easier and never caused a problem for me. Can't say I ever did a double blind scientific study though, so I might be wrong. I have read manufacturer recomendations that advise against it, but then they also recomend only changing your oil every 7,500 miles.

Please, no flames! Just my opinion.

Reply to
Kevin

It seems that there is more pros than cons for the use of an anti-seize agent on lug nuts.

I had thought of the use oil on the studs, but knew it was a no no, anti-seize I had never thought of, but would not be afraid to use it - in a moderate sense.

Here is a google search on the subject.

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I think I will get a jug of it to just keep on hand, and to use on my corn flakes.:--)

Reply to
fiveiron

Do you mean the lug NUTS broke, or the lug nuts fell off, or the lug BOLTS (actually, on almost all cars, studs, but never mind that) got sheared off?

Lug nuts fall off because somebody dodn't torque them and they gradually unscrew themselves. BTDT and had that done to me. If you're really lucky, all five can go, at which point one corner of the car gets all low and loud and sparky a la "America's Wildest Police Chases."

The various means by which the lug bolt could shear off include massive overtorque (e.g., the "get the stand on the handle until it squeaks" school of torque estimation) or simply trying to bust something really tight using the L shaped lug wrench thoughtfully provided by most car makers. Between its shape and the wretched body position involved in changing a tire, it's a marvelous tool for applying axial bending moment as well as torque to the lug bolt, especially for the inexperienced. They're not really made to bend -- they snap before too awfully much of such mistreatment.

Never saw anybody actually break a lug nut, though I suppose enough torque (or a hidden flaw) could do the trick.

--Joe

Reply to
Ad absurdum per aspera

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