Puzzling cooling system problem..any ideas?

(This is not about a miata, but I included that NG because the general Mazda NG looks about DOA.)

One of my cars is a '90 Protege...great sturdy little machine and with over 182K miles, it runs great and is so clean under hood you could eat off the valve cover, but I digress....

Anyway, here's the deal, Nearly every time I start it up from a cold start, the temp needle begins to rise normally until it reaches about halfway between C and H and stops there, as it should, BUT then after about a minute or so, the needle begins to rise again, toward H. Almost always, the needle will rise fairly rapidly and get uncomforably close to the top end, then suddenly the needle drops back to halfway between C and H, where it should be. This happens like clockwork, at about exactly the same time after start every time. After it does its thing, I have no more problems whatsoever...until the next start-up from cold.

This car has done this off and on for years. About 10 years ago, it was doing it, so I replaced the thermostat, confident that this was the problem, but it still did the same thing with the new thermostat. It also has gone long periods without doing it. A couple of years ago, I replaced the lower radiatator hose, and it started doing it again...that time the needle actually went up to H and the car ran hot, with steam, the whole bit. After I parked the car and cut the engine. It behaved normally, as the car was not low on coolant, and it isn't now. The problem couldn't be related to dirty, old coolant either, because I flush and change as recommended. The only thing I can figure is that somehow there's trapped air in the system or there is a backwash of coolant near the top of the engine where the sensor is. Any ideas? Thanks.

Reply to
smallg
Loading thread data ...

Air getting into the cooling system and getting trapped is a possibility. If this is occurring, you should get some type of overflow indication. I have had brand new thermostats stick. I don't know where the air entrapment places are on the Protege. On some GM cars in past years, I've resorted to drilling a small hole in the thermostat -- flat part of the plate

-- between the actual thermostat and the outside diameter of the thermostat. This allowed a little bit of coolant to circulate, warming up the thermostat (or cooling it off), and seemed to work better than the little wiggler.

You can use a old pan, accurate thermometer, cold, warm, and hot boiling water to tell how a thermostat is behaving. You may even see it "pop" if it's sticking.

uncomforably

Reply to
Chuck

One often overlooked item in a cooling system is the pressure cap. Test it with a proper pressure tester to make sure it holds the recommended pressure for the system. Not all caps are created equally. Make sure it is the right one.

Reply to
golden oldie

Reply to
Mike Walsh

I don't know because the car is always rolling down the road at that point, but I doubt the problem is related. It just so happens that last week I replaced the fan switch, which switches the radiatior fan on when the coolant reaches

97 degrees Celsius. I realized I had a problem with the fan while idling in Atlanta traffic (of course after thing happened I posted about). The temp needle stared rising and I realized the fan wasn't kicking on. I was relieved to see all I needed was the switch, which had corroded apart at the wiring (didn't want to have to pull and replace the fan). The fan works as it should but the other problem still there....
Reply to
smallg

Did you also change the socket on the harness side of the rotted out switch?

If not, there could be a bad connection there delaying the fan turning on.

Normally to me your symptoms mean an air bubble in the head that doesn't get flushed or moved until the t-stat opens.

Mike

86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's - Gone to the rust pile... Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view! Jan/06
formatting link
(More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
Reply to
Mike Romain

The fan works fine, and kicks on when it is supposed to. I'm sure of it..at least while at idle when I've checked.

I'd bet that you're on the right track here, but I don't know of any easy way to check, or get rid of it. As I said, the problem has come and gone over the years, with different radiators, thermostats, hoses, you name it. It must be a quirk of the design I guess....not a big deal, but annoying. I still drive this car a good bit.

Reply to
smallg

It is common to have these symptoms because of air in the system, but it should not repeat, i.e. when the thermostat finally opens the air is flushed out.

Reply to
Mike Walsh

should not repeat, i.e. when the thermostat finally opens the air is flushed out.

Not always, The air bubble can just be dispersed into little ones or moved so fluid is hitting on the formerly open to the steam sender dropping it back to read liquid temps instead of instead of steam.

This is why some engines require special bleeding procedures.

My old Jeep Cherokee had a closed system that was a real bugger to get the air out of. With air in it, you only got a little inside heat. This stayed the same until the air got bled out. Sometimes I even drive up a bank to have the nose in the air to get it all out the first try.

Mike

86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's - Gone to the rust pile... Canadian Off Road Trips Photos: Non members can still view! Jan/06
formatting link
(More Off Road album links at bottom of the view page)
Reply to
Mike Romain

Leave it to Romain to think of such--but since I read it, I shall remember our hill going down to the stream behind our house.;) Go Mike! And, smallg, why don't you do the same? On a hill and going upwards should put your radiator at the highest, bleedable point. Hope his method works for you--looks like it should. If so, brag to your neighbors that you just applied the 'Canadian-Romainian solution'!::)) sam

Reply to
sdlomi2

MotorsForum website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.