How large is the bargaining power of "cash buying"?

Hey, at least they're being honest. That's better than swindling some naive buyer for rustproofing or an extended warranty.

heh... thats on top of "scotchgard", "permaplate" and "the gold kit"

wheres "around here"? what models are excluded?

yup. just by letting my money sit in an emigrant savings account, im making $75/mo for doing NOTHING.

nah... the best way is arab style-

take a s*it and wipe your ass with your hand. THEN shake their hand.

WTF?

they give $4500 for a tradein, then sell it for $7995.

how is that NOT making money? they make money coming and going.

"additional dealer markup" Had to stop in a VW dealership years ago and the nice stealer had a VW convertible with that caption on the new car price sticker. My friend saw it first - we had stopped for a few pops and were feeling a little tipsy - he started howling with laughter - I looked at it and said out loud WTF - they asked us to leave.

Yeah I really love all the ways dealerships try to rip you off.

Have always bought with cash - it makes the transaction simpler and gives the stealer less of a chance to do his thing.

But, why I saw the ad in paper saying that cash or trade a couple K $ off? It seems to me that cash may indeed have lower price on a car.

I sort of disagree Travis - although you are right about them getting a kickback from the financing, the advantage of having cash is that you can bargain on the basis of "I'll buy it right now" - dealers like a sure thing, and hate to see someone walk out the door without a firm committment.

David

Travis Jordan wrote:

You need to remember, from the dealer's perspective, ALL sales are effectively cash. they get paid on the very first day, just as they would get paid when you write the obscenely large check, or drop the bundle of $100s on the table.

I see no value to a cash transaction. Indeed, I was recently party to a cash transaction on a Used Car, and the cash actually was problematic for the dealer to deal with. It ONLY served to represent our sincere interest in the car, and that had negotiating power to a small degree. But, you should only play the Cash Card AFTER you come to a price that you and the dealer agree with. Your bundle of bucks might shave another 500 or 1000 bucks because of the immediacy of the deal, and your willingness to walk away - taking your bundle with you. Negotiate yoru best deal without disclosing the terms, then lower the price when you present your terms. I don't see any more than a couple hundred, a thousand at the most, coming off the price because of cash. Remember, the dealer is paid before you get home, either way - cash or credit.

Depends on the demand of the vehicle. As I recently learned, after waiting for weeks for a Civic Hybrid, once you've waiting, you're in there to purchase, then they try to pitch you for accessories and warranty, they know you aren't leaving without the car and they don't care if you do because as soon as you walk out the next person will be happy to purchase it no questions asked.

I wasn't happy about the $1,995 six year warranty and $795 auto dimming mirrors or $189 tire locking nuts or $320 splash guards (all three of which come pre-installed and cannot be removed). All this after a $6,500 "market adjustment".

I actually walked out and said I'm not interested in purchasing the car. I want to purchase it to save money, not counter-balance savings with the greed of the dealer. They called me back in as I was opening my car door to bring me back my license that I had forgot they had and they discussed a $500 discount. Not good enough. I walked out.

Now, I am about ready to purchase a Civic Hybrid via Costco auto program where the final price of the vehicle, with the accessories I want and warrantee, to get the keys, is less than $26,000 with Navigation. Once it arrives I make payment (I'm paying cash and they know it because I am sick of their crap so I just told it like it was) and I drive the car. I can only hope it goes that smoothly but my past experience working with Fleet managers is that things usually go smoothly.

Whatever your bargaining chip happens to be, it usually won't easily exist for a vehicle that is in "demand".

Thanks, Shawn

Sorry, mistake, $26,900.

Thanks, Shawn

An additional wrinkle is that:

a. Sometimes there are incentives that can be taken only if you forego the subsidized financing offered by the manufacturer's finance company.

b. Sometimes there are incentives that can be taken only if you use the manufacturer's finance company.

While that may not directly affect bargaining power at the dealer, it may affect the actual price you end up with.

The arabs use the left hand to wipe their ass The arabs use the right hand to eat Thieves get their right hand cut off That forces them to eat with the hand they use to wipe their ass

That reminds me of a joke

You ask someone which hand they use to wipe their ass When the reply comes and you get asked back which one you use you say that you prefer paper

I just bought a Civic new this weekend with "cash". The salesguy had told me a certain price and I asked if there was any better he could do on the numbers. He said no, that it's the rock bottom price already, can't go any lower, they installed wheel locks and mud guards which will bring the price up more, etc etc. I said "that's too bad because I was going to give you a check for it right now, no big deal... honey, let's keep looking." All of sudden, for the price that absolutely couldn't move, he was able to miraculously drop it another grand.

Walk into a few dealers without your checkbook to make sure you can't buy. Because if you are looking for a car, and you run into the wrong/right salesmen, he's going to bag you like a buck during the rut. Go to 2 or 3 dealers, find what you want, and then work them all down to their good numbers. Think of it as a fun game instead of a stressful task The ultimate leverage on your side is that 1) You can pay cash and they know you are a definite sale (no credit problems to crop up after they've put 2 hours of work into you), and 2) You don't care whether you buy it today or 2 months from now. (Have that attitude even if you want the car yesterday) Walk in with some patience. Don't be afraid to work these guys over. I worked in mortgage sales for a while and car guys are exactly like loan salesmen. A small profit sale is better than no sale. And for salesmen that have a zero on the board, marking a 1 up there even if it's minimal profit sure looks better than a goose egg, which can get you fired easily.

Also, we shopped at month's end, 2 days before end of month. And, I heard rainy days are better because there are less people shopping, but haven't verified that.

And one last thing, I bring along my wife (I affectionately call her the Terminator. She's the heavy. Good cop, bad cop) and I chum it up with the salesguy, but when he starts writing numbers on the sales sheets, I whisper to him, "Look, I know you guys are straight, but F around with the numbers (like adding BS miscellaneous charges), and my wife will go f'ing ballistic on you and trust me you don't want that." )

Doug

PS. You'll find their lowest price after "walking off" the lot a few times without buying. When they know you are leaving they throw the best numbers at you.

Right. Which has nothing to do with the bargaining power of cash.

That wasn't about the cash. It was because you were willing to get up and walk away. The same thing would have happened whether or not you'd been prepared to write a check that day. One of the most powerful tools a buyer has is the ability to walk. Unfortunately, many don't use it.

I like to tell the salesperson that I haven't decided whether or where I'm financing. I make it clear that I'm open to whatever special rates they might have, but that it won't be part of the price negotiation. And after that point I refuse to talk about it, especially to answer the question "what kind of payment do you want," which you should never, ever, ever answer.

if you go thru costco, sams, AAA, you can get their BEST numbers right off the bat. no hassle, no haggle.

i dont know many people that can write a check for $20,000... and have it clear :)

i could, if i had to.

see, thats my thing... ive got a really nice 1998 civic CX hatch im happy with. so i dont give a flying fig if i buy today or in september. im just going to be shopping the new 2dr/4dr hatches...

honda fit toyota yaris scion xA scion xB

so im going to go get the prices, get the tradein, and sell my car private party for more. a 3dr yaris with all the features to bring it up to scion xA level makes it cost more than an xA, which is wacky.

i do like that its got the same VVti engine, and is the lightest in the bunch. 500 lbs less than my civic cx. all the same go-fast parts should fit, etc.

the honda fit doesnt have nearly as much aftermarket support.

eliminate all the variables.... sell your tradein yourself. have as much cash as possible, line up your own financing beforehand. THEN go get the lowest prices on the cars you want.

or just go through costco/sams/AAA. same deal, no BS.

some people (most) dont want to "hurt the guys feelings"

its war, and theyre in it to screw ya.

Going through Costco I got $26,900 including 2006 Civic Hybrid w/NAVI, Tax, License, Registration, Destination Fee, Splash Guards, Wheel Locks, Auto Dimming Mirror and Floor Mats. The price was non-negotiable. I laid down the $500 deposit to pick it up next month when it arrives. This price was actually about $1,800 better than I could find in So. California that will allow me to "wait" since I'm not ready to purchase on the lot. Those that I can pick from a lot are first-come-first-served and I would need a 3 hour drive to get their and may or may not still be available.

Then, I get a cal from another dealer in San Diego (3 hours drive from here) and I said if he can't beat the Costco price by $1000 I'm not interested. He calls me back. I got the exact same features as listed above for $26,023 to get the keys and received a certificate in the mail the next day indicating the final price as agreed and the features included. I haven't canceled the Costco deal yet, I'll wait and see how smooth things go but $900 is a lot to save, especially in this market.

So the bottom line is: AAA, Sams, Costco can get you great deals but don't stop looking for a better deal.

Thanks, Shawn