Hi all,
I am looking at getting my girlfriend a used 90-91 or 92-96 Toyota Camry (either sedan or wagon).
I have heard that the 97-01 models tend to have an engine sludge problem - is this the case on previous models?
Also, any common mechanical problems with 90-91 or 92-96 Camrys I should be aware of? (I live in the southeast, so I am not really concerned with appearances.)
Thanks for any advice!
Just make sure the vehicle has had oil and filter changes every 3,000 miles and there should be no issue.
If the vehicle that you are looking at does not have complete service records, I would move on. Someone else's neglect will end up being your headache.
Having records is NOT conclusive proof of TIMELY oil services. For instance, based on the absence of paperwork would you pass up a sharp Camry whose routine maintenance had been performed by the owner himself? Likely the Do-It-Yourself'r is not going to keep receipts for oil and filters he used and may only record the mileages he did these services. SO.... the point I'm getting at is you NEED to LOOK inside the oil filler cap area for yourself and check for varnish. Take a flashlight with you, look close, and deep. If not satisfied, arrange to have the valve cover pulled.
Philip,
Good point! From the Do-It-Yourself'r I have met, they still have logs of oil changes. These people not only record the milage they have performed the service on, they also note what oil they bought as well as the filter. I am sure these people are probably more detail oriented then others but they still take the time to make the necessary notes not to satisfy the potential buyer, but to keep track of what services were performed and when they were performed.
No.
Those reports pertained only to the later years in the following "Generation" of Camrys.
I always found it interesting that one rarely heard of sludge complaints until the introduction of API SJ oils on. These oils have reduced ZDDP compared to previous designations. The SJ standard in particular was inferior and was rapidly replaced by SL. ZDDP is not only an anti wear additive, but it also helps reduce oxidation and nitration issues.
Interesting. Why not? Do you suppose these owners maintain their vehicles better than those current Camry owners? IF this is an owner neglect situation, why are only certain models included? No one has PROPERLY answered this question.
Why is it that the later model, LOW MILEAGE Toyota V6 and 4-cyl vehicles are seeing such a prevalence of engine oil sludge? Obviously, this is NOT a maintenance issue.
Charlene Blake snipped-for-privacy@erols.com
Obviously, you haven't networked with Toyota owners who do change their oil every 3,000 miles (which is much better than recommended in the owner's manual) but who still got sludge. Most of these owners got the sludge after the 60,000 miles mark, according to the reports. It is not true that changing the oil every three thousand miles in the sludge-prone vehicles will prevent the sludge formation. Not only that, if you buy a used Toyota, even if the previous owner did change the oil every 3,000 miles, you may be left holding the bag when it comes to engine replacement. Despite the fact that Toyota has said you need only one oil change receipt per year as proof of maintenance, owners report dealerships requiring ALL the receipts. Nice way to disqualify someone from the Customer Support Program for Engine Oil Gelation, isn't it?
If you do purchase the vehicle, call the Toyota Engine Oil Gelation hotline and ask for a copy of the letter that was supposedly (not all owners got one) sent out to all 3.3 million affected Toyota owners. See my post in this discussion for details.
Charlene Blake snipped-for-privacy@erols.com
Has Toyota notified you about its "Customer Support Program" for "Engine Oil Gelation?"
Who: Owners of 1997-2002 Toyota and Lexus vehicles with 3.0L IMZ V-6 engines and all 1997-2001 Toyota vehicles with the now discontinued 2.2L four cylinder engines. Nine models are included.
What: Engine oil sludge accumulation in the oil pan, valve covers, and/or cylinder heads with possible symptoms such as blue smoke on cold start up and oil consumption. Toyota maintains this "oil gelation" is caused by the owner's improper maintenance of the vehicle! The owners disagree.
When: Former, current, and repeat repairs for sludge-related damage are covered for a period of 8 years from date of first sale or lease with unlimited mileage. This coverage includes all reasonable incidental expenses. If questions, consult with affected owners in the groups listed below.
Where: Effective April 3, 2002. Contact the Toyota hotline at
1-888-802-9436. You'll be asked to show a reasonable effort (not all oil change receipts are required) to regularly maintain your vehicle. Toyota considers this a generous offer especially since the owner is at fault! Proceed cautiously.What if you have received no letter? OR, you want more information?
1) First, notify Toyota via certified letter with return receipt requested and give your case details. Let it know you have NOT received your letter. Ask it when you will get your letter, too. 2) Notify the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration atWhat if you want to do MORE in the way of consumer action? OR, you don't qualify for CSP?
6) Join other owners in the "Toyota Sludge Yahoo Group" atVisit the "Complaint Station for Toyota" at
Charlene Blake snipped-for-privacy@erols.com
In news: snipped-for-privacy@posting.google.com, Charlene Blake being of bellicose mind posted:
It is obvious is that you never have. You're just making up stuff as usual. Did you EVER put up a website with PROOF of appropriate oil services of ANY of your synchophants?
See the pattern?
One of the risks of responding to Charlene "Box of Rocks" Blake is that you run the risk of becoming frustrated with her religious dedication to foolishness.
1999 ES300 V6....oil and filter changes (documented) every 5,000 miles since new. The car now has over 75,000 miles on it.
When the valve cover was taken off, it was very clean inside.
Why is that Charlene???
--- Curtis Newton snipped-for-privacy@remove-me.akaMail.com
ICQ: 4899169
Hmmm... some European manufacturers recommend 10K miles between changes. I wonder what the inside of a Toyota motor would look like with that sort of maintenance interval ?
"Jimmy" skrev i meddelandet news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com...
Ford recommends 12.5 K miles interval in Europe. No problem with the proper oil. Only difference is viscosity, 5W30 in Europe and 5W20 in the US. I suspect a Toyota engine is no worse than a Ford engine. Almost nobody changes oil at 300 miles here, 600 miles or more is common. But, the lowest cost oil is never used either, except maybe by youngsters in old junk cars. /per
That was my point. Toyota, and some of the posters here, are pointing the finger at people who didn't change their oil on time as the cause of the sludge - yet we have other motors going many, many miles more between changes without damage. Apparently this Toyota engine is a little bit different that the other motors around the world.
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Do a LOT more investigation before you draw such a conclusion. Sulfur levels in gasolines around the world vary a LOT. This additive contributes to oil contamination. Motor oils themselves vary a LOT around the world. Synthetic blends are the norm for GM branded oils in Europe but not in America. Our API gradations set minimum standards whereas the European ACEA system is much more specific about application and whether or not the oil is suitable for what "We" would consider "long drain" intervals. It should occur to observant persons that something is woefully deficient in the grading process when a $0.79 mineral oil qualifies for the same API SL rating as Mobil1 0w-40.
"Philip®" skrev i meddelandet news:k7eOb.14508$ snipped-for-privacy@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
An article about this matter:
Pulleeze. Do some research yourself. European manufacturers typically recommend the same long change intervals for their cars sold in the USA using the same oils we use here. No sludge, full warranty coverage from the manufacturer, even with 10K changes.
Nexxxxt ?
"Jimmy" skrev i meddelandet news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com...
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