California smog tests

If put the magic goo in my engine. The goo will scrub and remove the yucky icky leftover burnt sludge left in my engine. Sounds like a degreaser. If it causes the sludge not to stick to the metal, will the oil (that I want there) continue to stick to the metal?

I would not call the treatment a "scam." If there is different treatment then it is the State's effort to pressure you out of that vehicle. A Public Policy for cleaner air.

Hey. I don't sell the stuff. I used it, and it worked for me. Do what you want.

Anyone who doesn't understand stuck piston rings knows little about internal combustion engines. The piston crown and top ring are the hottest parts of the engine. Oil is behind the rings, and eventually does become baked into the ring grooves. When the rings can't move freely in the ring grooves, they don't seal the cylinder as they should. I've operated very large diesel engines that have piston ring rotation detectors so we're notified if the piston ring sticks.

Ken

Yeah yeah, Ken. You used the stuff but ... did it work for you or was it your engine survived the abuse?

Ken is partly correct in his description of the top two ring land areas. Where Ken's knowledge falls short is assertion that carbon accumulation "behind the rings" is said to be detrimental. In fact, carbon in this area is not detrimental because the ring's inner most surface does not contact the piston! ONLY the sides of the rings contact the piston. And once again, Ken (and MANY OTHERS) never disassembled their engines to make and assessment, then reassemble and run the engine with auto-rx, with a subsequent disassembly to determine if the product is effective.

Piston ring rotation detectors. Tell us about these, Ken. I've got an open mind ... really!

A scam is purpetrated upon us by unscrupulous businesses, you have run head long into a State requirement. By defniniton, this isn't a scam. It might not be a good thing from your perspective, but it's not a scam.

The State requires everybody to get a smog test, and they collect data on which cars (engines) pass and which are prone to failing. You, apparently, have a model that is prone to failing, and got singled out for special treatment. If the goal of the State is to clean its air, then it isn't a scam to work towards that goal. (It may or may not work very well, but that's another argument separate from a scam.)

I live in San Diego County, which borders on Baja California, and, as far as I know, there are no smog regulations, automotive or industrial, on the other side of the border. This would be all well and good if the prevailing breezes always blew out of the North. However, when they blow out of the South, we're blessed with "their" pollution. We are also blessed with their cars when they drive up here to work or visit.

I realize that's the way it is, but it still bugs me to be sitting behind an old beater car that's belching smoke and nothing can be done about it.

It bugs me even more when this happens just after I've had to pay for an emissions test to ensure my pickup meets California standards... :>))

Not to be one-sided about it, when the weather conditions are just right (wrong?), prevailing winds will blow the smog out of the L.A. Basin, then down the coast where the on shore winds blow it into San Diego County. But the other 363 days of the year, it's just fine... :>))

I also live in your area, and I feel your pain.

I live in North County, so a lot of the junker cars don't get this far, but still. . . :>))

Philip, Don't close your mind. If the accumulation of carbon in the ring groove becomes excessive, the rings do stick. Stuck rings don't seal as they should. All I know is what I've observed, and I am a trained observer. I've worked 35 years as an engineer on ocean going ships. I've operated and maintained steam turbine and diesel engined ships up to 120,000 hp steam and 57,500 hp diesels. I've pulled pistons, scraped the ring grooves clean, and renewed the rings. I've been trained at two diesel engine factories, Sulzer in Winterthur, Switzerland, and MaK in Kiel, Germany. No, I didn't tear down my car engine, but I do know when machinery is running better or worse. The cost of running these ships is in middle five-digits per day. The schedule is set to the hour for weeks in advance, and we must be on time to meet other ships in port to relay cargo. We must sail on time to meet our schedule and to vacate the berth for the next ship. In my job as Chief Engineer, I am responsible to determine if the engine is ready to run or needs repair. Most of that determination is from my observation of instruments, sounds, vibrations, and temperatures. If I have to delay the ship for repair, or if order repairs when I think they are needed, I have to be right in my observations and conclusions or thousands of dollars are wasted.

Sulzer low speed diesel engines, presently available up to 108,920 hp (straight 14 cylinder two-stroke, 2300 tons, 33' tall, 102 rpm), have the piston ring rotation and wear detector in each top ring. The outer surface of the ring has a V shaped groove machined into the surface, and the V is helical...starts close to the top of the ring near the gap and spirals around the ring down near the bottom. This V is filled with a bronze insert. A detector built into the liner detects when the top edge of the ring passes on the upstroke, when the top edge of the bronze insert passes, when the bottom edge of the insert passes, and when the bottom edge of the ring passes. By measuring the time from the top edge of the ring to the top edge of the insert, comparing to the previous stroke, and adjusting for rpm, the detector know if the ring is rotating. By measuring the time for the width of the V-shaped insert to pass, adjusted for rpm, the detector can determine the wear of the ring (as it wears more, a narrow part of the V remains).

Ken

Let me interrupt to point out that you are not differentiating carbon accumulation at the bottom of the ring groove where the compression rings do not contact the piston from accumulations on the 'sides' of the ring groove where the compression rings do make constant contact.

You do not have the ability to see thru cast iron, aluminum or steel ... or are you making that claim?

snip

Let's get pragmatic, Ken. Cars do not burn garbage/waste oil that solidifies at room temperature and therefore has to be preheated just to flow out of the fuel tanks to the injectors as ships do. Furthermore, it is the tiny minority of road vehicle owners who permit their engine oil to foul so badly as to sludge an engine. So the likelihood of stuck compression rings, not to mention the tiny tiny minority who would tear down an engine twice (before and after inspection) keeps purveyors of miraculous additives in business. And giving a money back guarantee if not satisfied only improves their survival. Finally, despite your qualifications, you are not immune to getting suckered. :^)

I've got a good idea, either start a new thread, or do the adult thing and agree to disagree. This one-up-manship junk posting is getting tiresome to me, and probably most other readers. Actually, I flatter you, there probably aren't any other readers than the two of you.

In case you're wondering, no, I haven't been reading the screeds, just noticing the continuing preening and so's-yer-old-man language.

Time to give your ego's a rest and get back to tilting at windmills...

But you keep coming back to read the next installment. You can't help yourself. LOL

Naw, don't read them, however, I do skim one now and then. When it becomes childish, which usually doesn't take very long, I love to step in and point it out. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.

Oh well, boys will be boys... :>))

See... SEE! You're back AGAIN. Well, we've heard yet again from Mr. Mom Tom.