Latest dope on R12 to R134 conversions - experience?

I did it three years ago with a Castrol kit I got at a local store.

Runs perfect, no problems.

Should work fine. We used to go through all that bull. Lately though we just change the Rec. Drier & add R134a. They said for years that the oils where not compatible. And back then that was true. This doesn't apply to the newer oils that are avail. today. Keep in mind R134a or equiv. will never cool aswell as R12 in an R12 system. Also be careful about using any of the aftermarket gases as some are actually propane. BOOM!!

I changed my Jetta over to R-134 and changed out nothing in the system - it was so damn cold it would run you out of there, and I never had a failure while I had the car (5 years)

Yes it will be cold but it will never be as cold as r12 in an R12 system.

The only reason a system would need a change over to R134A is if something failed (ie: a leak). Anytime an A/C system is exposed to outside air for anything more than 30mins or so you MUST replace the Receiver Dryer. Also there has to be other parts replaced to fix the concern otherwise it was filled illegally.

filled illegally? I dispute that. there is no license required to by r134a- they have it at the parts store.

i repeat, I replaced NO components on my car and it worked perfectly for as long as I had it, and it would "snow" out the vents it got so cold- I had to turn the temp up on the lowest fan setting cause I was getting goose bumps in the SUMMER.

That's funny. "It would snow out the vents". Considering the evap. would freeze up at 0C & stop working. LOL. If your in the states I would believe it as there are not many laws governing the purchase of refrigerants. Don't seem to care about the environment. Most techs. aren't even licensed.

There may be no license. required to purchase the refrigerant but I know for a fact that it is still illegal under EPA guidelines to fill a leaking refrigerant system with ANY kind of refrigerant. Also many of the aftermarket R134A replacements that you can purchase from local parts stores are not actually R134A, many of them are actually propane as to get around laws regarding these chemicals. Propane makes a great refrigerant but if you get into an accident BOOM.

Perhaps you have your R's mixed up, Propane (and a variety of other flamable and non-flamable gasses) were sold as R12 replacements, NOT as R134a replacements. R134a can be purchased without a license in the US.

No I don't have my R's mixed up. I am a licensed Technician to work with refrigerants. There are a couple of companies marketing them as R134x which is still propane. As I also said I understand that R134a can be purchased without a lic. in the US. It however can't be used in a car with a known leak. If it is & you are caught the person could be subject to a large fine.

who said my car was leaking? not me brother.

it was definatley snowing or something- some kind of precipitation was definatley coming out the vents of the car, perhaps I dont know the technician term for it. coldest damn a/c I have ever had.

-Ken

Hi, I started this thread with the question and here are some updates:

I have license for R12 if I want to buy it but I first changed over a 1990 Mercury Topaz of a senior citizen from R12 to R134. The kit cost 32 dollars and has leak sealant and O ring conditioner and uses ester oil.

The air on it was excellent and cold. OK perhaps not quite as cold as full charge of R12 but cold enough that you had to turn the air down after a couple of minutes in 90 degree temperatures.

I then did my GolfGL88 that was 10 times faster as I had to take some parts off in the Mercury to get to the low pressure port. The Golf gobbled up 2 cans in minutes and I was surprised how fast. I put in a few ounces of a third can.

The first thing I noticed with the Golf was that the pressure was higher running around 280 to 300 psi and I was getting a bit paranoid or burst in an older system. It did not get higher than 300 psi. I looked this up on Google and found on remark that made sense that AT IDLE the pressure of R134 is higher because the fan is not as effective as cooling the liquid refrigerant as cooling R12 but going down the road the condenser brings down the pressure. Also stated in VERY long bumper to bumper traffic it might be straining the system if at a stop for a very long time with R134 in an R12 system and may pay to turn the system on and off.

The Golf is VERY cold with the R134. What all did I do? Just like the manufacturer said. I used a vacuum pump (they don't tell you this when you buy the self retrofit kit on the box but tell you on the website) to remove ALL the R12 that was left in the system (yeah I know it should have been captured but get real a ton of people may let out a small amount of R12 on a system needing charge - I don't condone it)

I held a vacuum for about 20 minutes. I simple used one of those (I think 20 buck on Harbor Freight) device that you hook your compressor to and without moving parts it pulls a vacuum. It works good I even used it with a house system (pump). After I pulled a vacuum with both cars I changed to the R134 port and connected and let the R134 in.

Nothing else was done BUT there is a lot of misinformation out there, depending on opinion. Even though the manufacturer's website says all you need is to pull a vacuum. R12 and R134 mixing is suppose to create some form of acid, auto parts workers will tell you all kinds of different things if you try to get some input. The store I bought the R134 kis, Advanced Auto, told me I had to change the receiver dryer and remove the oil from the compressor, THEN told me it had to have PAG oil put in. This is the

Just pulled a vacuum. Put the R134 exactly as per manufacturer's instruction on their website and it was uneventful. I am VERY satisfied with it. One note: on their FAQ on their website in a sentence it talks about a 29 inch vacuum as "water" isn't that 29 inches of mercury?

Would not hesitate to do it again. VERY easy and the next time I need to top it up, not 30 dollars for a 12oz can of R12. More like 8 or 9 dollars a can. Here is the FAQ page from the manufacturer for retrofitting for the product I used that cost 32 bucks with everything. (except the ability to pull a vacuum for someone else without a vacuum pump)

Harry