Civis Si sedan

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BTW, saw this on the dealer's floor yesterday, a coppery red color, I guess Habanero Red, and it looks seriously hot! They had every option on it it could carry, then a market adjustment of $5k, for a total of
about $28k. Didn't see a nitro button, tho ...
http://automobiles.honda.com/models/exterior_colors.asp?ModelName=Civic+Si+Sedan
Do these engines really hold up if you rev them past 6k on a regular basis, cuz that's where the power is, right?
Sigh. Just nowhere to drive such things anymore in Los Angeles. TMC.
J.
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JXStern wrote:

http://automobiles.honda.com/models/exterior_colors.asp?ModelName=Civic+Si+Sedan
yes. if anything, they run better - you burn all the crud out.

dunno about that dude... last couple of times i've been on the ventura freeway late at night, it's been a regular "fast & furious" race track.
if you're serious about a "fun" vehicle, go for older stuff - obdI or even obd0. [obdII and later computers store your usage history, which could be a problem. if you know what i mean.] do the math. $28k for a new civic vs. $5k for an older civic. [less if you go for the 88-91's.] that leaves you $23k for upgrades. if you stick to mechanicals that actually work [rather than rice crap] you'd have a hard time spending it all and the vehicle will go like a freakin' rocket. like this one: http://www.theoldone.com/articles/Larryscivic/Larrys_Civic.htm
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jim beam wrote:

Dunno about that. Quite a build-up, but had to be costly.
There's at least $25k worth of photo documentation on that puppy...
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Wear the rings out too. I'm in that situation right now. Constant 4K rpm usage has toasted the rings, which is why my oil consumption is so high (1600mi/qt at 278,000 miles).
Don't care how well an engine is made, high piston speeds quickly erode rings.

Well sure, late at night. Just don't try the 405 at 4:00pm on a weekday...
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"TeGGeR����������������������" wrote:

"quickly"??? dude, drive a ford for a couple of years, then get back to loving your "quickly eroded" b-series. ;)

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Not your 91 Integra? Say it ain't so!
You ever solve that problem that led you to replace the fuel injectors, etc.?
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T'is! Same car! Got a smog check next spring, too. Original cat. Will I pass? Stay tuned!

Nope. Same vibration. It gets lots worse in cold weather, almost disappears in hot weather. I've replaced both lower mounts. The front one was a piece of cake, the rear one was a good two hours labor, and required the engine to be lifted up three inches.
I have a new theory...
The RIGHT upper mount is twisted to the rear.The LEFT upper mount is twisted to the front. The right upper mount contacts the frame on hard acceleration.
I suspect the engine/transaxle assembly is torqued clockwise (when viewed from above) on account of the differential being on the right, thus pulling the works to the rear on that side and distorting the mounts. My mechanic still thinks it's not the mounts, but otherwise has no idea what's going on. Cars with mileages over 200K are fairly rare (and over 250K almost non-existent), so most mechanics are in uncharted territory when troubleshooting them.
The upper mounts are much beefier than the lower ones, so I suspect they carry most of the load. It will cost me about $300Cdn to replace both uppers, so I'm going to live with the annoyance for a while longer.
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for brevity, snipped good info
Do continue to keep the newsgroup informed. Your 91 Integra is the benchmark for my 91 Civic! IOW, I want to know when I need to start getting serious about buying another car.
Like I brag all the time to friends, though, I am not giving up a car that continues to give me 40 mpg even in winter. 'Course my fix for the rust around the wheel wells is getting to be an eyesore, and I might cave to vanity in a couple of years.
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An older car is a hobby. Can be *lots* of work.
It can also get expensive (but not nearly as expensive as a new car!)

I get 30mpg. No more.

Rust. I do believe that's the defining factor here.
My previous car, a 1982 Toyota Corolla, delineated its own life-limits in rust. Had it not got crusty, I'd probably still have it. As it was, I refused to pour more money into the beast, not knowing how long the body would hold out.
When is the right time to buy a different car? When you lose confidence in your current one. It's purely a personal and emotional decision.
Mine has no rust. Years of elbow grease (and wonderfully messy eastern- Canadian anti-rust treatments) have seen to that. Lack of rust makes it a bit difficult to decide whether or not to sell or scrap an old, worn car.
I just priced some engine work. A very reputable place near me can rebuild my original engine for $2800Cdn. A good used motor is $900. A brand-new short-block from Honda is $4000. I have no intention of getting rid of my car, so in a few years I'll have to do something one way or another.
I took some pics just now (yes that's snow you see). Car hasn't been washed in at least two months, so it's pretty dirty. See here: http://www.tegger.com/hondafaq/misc/teg_nov-06 /
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It's kept me out of trouble. :-)

You bet!

One thing I regret is that I will likely not roll the dice on a used car, which means the new Honda or Toyota (one or the other, most likely) I buy inevitably will have all the latest electronic controls. I hope it's not overwhelming. I /like/ being able to take off the distributor; check the timing; set valve lash; etc. Of course, there may be maintenance items equivalent to this, but requiring a lot less backbreaking labor. I wonder how the bushings last on these newer Hondas.
Being frugal, perhaps the low end Hondas and Toyota will still have plenty of DIY mechanical/electrical stuff.

Right, from your photos, you got me there!

I'd sure like to see more reports here of folks swapping engines. Not to beef up the car but just to keep using a perfectly good body. I think it imprudent for my Honda, but we'll see.

Take 'er to 300k (miles)!
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Part of my reasons for keeping the old '91 is the horrendous complexity of new cars.
In some ways they're easier to take care of: Timing chains instead of belts; no distributors; and in the case of Toyotas, cam lobes that ride directly on the valve tops and require no attention for a decade provided you change your oil.
In some ways they're scary: Dual 4-wire oxygen sensors; catalytic converters operating at the peak of their capabilities; airbags everywhere (which require to be inspected and replaced every ten years)...

Don't count on it. There isn't much you can do with any of the new rides. I know. We have a '99 Tercel, as low end as you can get. Beyond very basic maintenance, there isn't a lot you can do.

She'll make it no prob. I'm suspecting I'll need a replacement cat though. See earlier emissions results: http://www.tegger.com/hondafaq/misc/91_integra_emissions.html The last two have varied wildly at idle, which, according to my contacts, suggests a failing cat. I had originally thought it had to do with test equipment variability, but it looks more like it has to do with reduced cat efficiency.
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TeGGeR wrote:

think very carefully about this one. i've done some failure analysis in the past, and the very tiniest amount of grit left over from cylinder honing can seriously affect ring wear and consequently oil consumption. [and cylinder head work - you had that done recently didn't you?] if you cut the engine up and put it under the microscope, you can see it. you have to be scrupulously clean to minimize this grit and go to great lengths to remove it. hardly anyone bothers. a shop may be reputable, but bear in mind, once rebuilt, most people don't keep the car long enough to see long term testing of their work.
if it were my car, and i had the luxury of time on my side, i'd seriously consider the good used engine. only if the machine shop were truly anal would i consider the rebuilt motor as an option for a car i considered a "keeper".

for a vehicle driven in those conditions, that's mighty purty!
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TeGGeR wrote:

did you get anywhere with the ignition leads? mine have been running great since i switched to coiled core leads. i have both these: http://ngk.com/more_info.asp?AAIA 68286&pid331 http://magnecor.com/magnecor1/files/electrosports-80.pdf
i generally think oem quality is great, but there's no doubt that in this instance, my sub-3k mile oem plug leads were acting up, especially in colder damper weather. both these are better quality than oem.

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jim beam wrote:

oops, that's 30k, not 3k!

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Replaced with new OEM. No change.
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On Sun, 19 Nov 2006 22:48:32 +0000 (UTC), "TeGGeR"

When I had an Alfa, standard freeway driving was 4,000 RPM. Technically it was the model for early Honda engines, aluminum block and head, but with iron liners. Well, not entirely the model, as the Alfa drank oil on spec, loose piston rings. Couldn't get that past later smog rules.
Is yours an aluminum block with no liners, like current Hondas, even the S2000? Those are the ones I wonder about.
J.
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JXStern wrote:

the only vehicles to try using all alloy blocks were porsche with their 928 v8's. didn't work very well.
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I believe the Chevrolet Vega engines were not sleeved, only nitrided somehow. A friend had overheated a Vega when a hose failed and it wouldn't run after that; the coolant level pumped when he cranked the engine. We saw why when we pulled the head - the cylinders were cast as mesas in the block and sat in a pool of coolant (assuming there was enough coolant). When the coolant level dropped the cylinders softened at the top and no longer pushed against the head gasket. A replacement engine from a wrecking yard got him going again. I think that puts the Vega engine in the "didn't work very well" category.
MIke
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Not nitrided, but dotted with silicon nodules.
Those nodules didn't nodulate quite as well as GM had expected, so the Vega's all-aluminum marvel went into the dustbin of history, as somebody famous once put it.

Which is why it was eventually replaced by the '62 Nova's "Iron Duke" cast-iron 4.
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On Thu, 23 Nov 2006 00:25:40 +0000 (UTC), "TeGGeR"

I believe Rover had fielded aluminum-block engines a few years earlier - and had also failed. Don't know if they had liners, I guess not. Not sure how long Alfa was shipping aluminum blocks with iron liners, starting around 1958, I think.
J.
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