from all reports I have seen, once you understand idrive, it becomes simple and a habit that is easy. Only newbies to idrive have the complaint.
I could be wrong, but every new gadget has value, once you "get it".
I have an e34 540 and an e46 330xi, neither have any complicated features, but I bet you that with some practice and an open mind, you will change your attitude.
If you can figure out a PC, then it can't be that hard!
I would be more than happy to spend a day learning if I was going to drive home a new M5!
You've pretty much summed up why I went to great effort to locate a 2003 E39 after the production facility closed down in preparation for the E60. While the E60 represents certain advances over its predecessor, the many sacrifices (cheesy interior, why-drive, etc) make it a one step forward, two back IMO.
There are those who love their E60's, but they don't seem to have the passion for their cars the E39 inspired.
Ah, but here's the rub Charlie (bad pun intended)...
How often do you replace your PCs?
They are usually technically obsolete a few moments after you buy them (if not before). We suffer along for a year or two alright, and within
4 years they become useless boat anchors and completely unbearable.
Now, how often would you like to have to replace replace your car?
Point in case: Your E34 is a perfectly serviceable car right now, though it's at least 12 years old. There is something to be said about the longevity of the standard electrical switch design.
OH, the humanity! Lousy cupholders! How could one possibly survive without the very best of cupholders? After all, you paid ALL THAT MONEY!
Including the FIRST TIME? Like when you test drove it?
Interesting. Cruise control is *necessary*?
Yeah; wouldn't want to put anything important like directional signals or light controls on that side!
OH ... MY ...GOD! I haven't a heated wheel! How is it even possible for me to drive my car?
More 'necessaries' my car doesn't have. I might as well walk or buy a donkey cart.
STOP! Please! You're breaking my heart! How could one *possibly* not have *instant access* to the third-highest fan setting? Those knaves at BMW should be shot!
I am sure that it is!
I feel your pain. My car doesn't listen to me, either ...
I have only the gold ones - and even one of them is starting to act up again. May be root canal time.
Not only does my car not listen to me, it refuses to talk to me. Maybe BMW will buy it back. After all, it's only 18 years old and it's only averaged a measly 10,000 miles/year.
But you could have it burned to the ground in the middle of the night and she'd never know ...
My E30 doesn't have any cupholders at all. I feel so deprived!
Touche... I for one NEVER test drive a car before I buy it (like an idiot). I put almost 100 miles on the car I have now just to put it through the paces so I could get an idea of what suspension wear and tear the car had on it. Listening for thumps, looking for vibrations, etc. Wouldn't have asked to do that with a new car but the previous owner of mine was more than willing to let me check it out thoroughly.
Luxury item that it standard on almost anything these days.
Let's see, almost every car I've ever owned has had the lights and the turn siglans on the left side of the wheel. Have had one or two with the wipers over there too. Being RIGHT handed, this has never caused me any grief.
I'll bet your pussy hurts too because the heated seats go through I-Drive...
Nah, screw the donkey cart. I'll keep my E30. I know it's not as old as your E28 but it doesn't seem to have all the problems of a new car either...
I'll bet 30 minutes of reading the f&@%#$! manual would enlighten him a great deal on how to do this stuff...
Play CD's so you don't have to deal with the distractions of commercials :)
When the reference sensor went out on my car, I begged it to get me home. Not only did it not listen and help me out, it offered me no help in figuring out the problem.
No gold teeth, but my phone has blue tooth. Headset paired to it works very well even in the car. I'm very happy with it.
Navigation is mostly for people who can't read maps (and spoiled brats). I also don't think that BMW's navigation system is so inferior to what's available on the market that the continue to put it in thier cars. Something tells me you're not smart enough to use that system either. Do you access it through I-Drive?
I'll do better then that suggestion, post pictures of the car and wife together. Maybe I'll take both of them off your hands...
Ah, the counter arguments. All pretty good really. The E28/E30 were definitely aimed more at the purest in terms of lean and mean DRIVING machines. Some amplification on the E60.
It resolved several issues with the E39. More rear seat room (the E39 was barely more accomodating than the 3-series in that respect), a larger trunk (E39 smallest in its class ... pack efficiently I say), a bit quieter on the road. But that's about it.
BMW navigation sucks compared to the competition. It's not nearly as user friendly as the Japanese units used by Toyota/Lexus and Honda/Acura. Just as true for the seven series. Nav can be pretty neat when you're in a strange town, made a wrong turn, and there's no place to stop for directions.
Cupholders suck too. Not a big deal for me (I kid my service manager about them), but there are enough folks out there that equate commute with coffee to create a pretty significant aftermarket for BMW cupholders ... some quite expensive.
Interior storage is not a strong point. I think this has been forever true. Seems my E12 was lacking there too.
I-drive evidently appeals to a minority of the ownership. The rest are utterly frustrated and have expanded their four-letter-word vocabulary.
Active steering is weird. The M-5 forgoes it. Nuff said.
The interior layout is weird. The door pulls are the antithesis of ergonomics. And whatever happened to driver-centric displays and controls?
It's ugly (the looks haven't grown on me anyway). OTOH, if you follow the car show circuit, EVERYBODY is copying the BangleButt look.
If you read car magazines (I've been doing that for over 40 years), BMW's usually get rave reviews. There have been exceptions. The E28 528e missed the mark. More often, they're rated best in class .... the standard by which others are compared. The E39 was praised during its entire production cycle (even consumer reports thought it "the best car they ever tested"). The E60 has not been so well received.
BMW will likely never revert to the simplicity of its earlier cars (I remember the 2002tii with great fondness). Hopefully they will find that ground which reflects marketing reality while still appealing to their traditional customers. The E60 didn't achieve that illusive goal. The E90 is at least a step in the right direction.
"Sam Smith" wrote in message news:e1l5ri$bjj$1$ snipped-for-privacy@news.demon.co.uk...
Well, I don't have the M6, but do have an '06 M5 that has the same engine, transmission and overall setup as the M6. Here's my impressions so far:
At first, the i-Drive system drove me crazy, but in time it became second nature. I am not sure it's really necessary for it to control and access everything, but some unique features of the M5 and M6 are a natural for i-Drive. You don't have to use it, BTW to control basic functions of the car.
Why two horsepower settings? Why three suspension settings? Why six throttle response settings and six shift speed settings? Again, at first it seems ridiculous .... I think there's a matrix of over 200 different combinations of programmable setups for the car.
But, after a while getting used to it, I began to understand the philosophy of the design. BMWs are supposed to be fun to drive. The wide range of performance programs in the M5 make it even more so. You basically have several different cars, with different performance characteristics all in one vehicle. In the 400 hp, comfort suspension mode and level S2 selected, the car performs and handles like a fast family sedan. The SMG transmission can even shift itself like an automatic. But, using the i-Drive, you can pre-program a whole set of selectable performance options that can be instantly engaged by simply pushing the "M" button on the steering wheel. In an instant, the sedate, 5 passenger family sedan changes into another vehicle altogether, know to us that own them as the "Beast". Depending on what you programmed, the engine suddenly develops 100 more horsepower, the suspension changes to that of a race car and the throttle response becomes instant. Shifts in the manual shift mode are lightening fast, especially up around 7000 rpm. (redline for the engine is 8,250 RPM). You can change the Dynamic Stability Control from standard (limits wheel spin and engine throttle if you start to lose traction) to an intermediate mode called "MSC" (or something like that) that allows a bit of drift, wheel spin and higher lateral G forces without backing off the engine or applying braking to stop wheel spin, but will save your ass if things get out of control.
Then, you can select S6 mode --- the highest level of raw performance. I've only tried it once, and will not likely do it again unless I am on an empty track and with a bit more experience. In this mode, the M5 is very fast, the shifts are almost violent and it is easy to get into a powered drift, even in 3rd or 4th gear. I tried a full bore acceleration once and was at
130 mph as I shifted from 4th to 5th gear then backed off ... with two more gears to go.
So, that's how I've adapted to the M5. It took some time. Usually I adapt to a new car (as do most people, I suspect) within a day or two of driving. It took me about 3 weeks just to feel comfortable with the 7 speed SMG transmission. Now, after four months of ownership, I still am still enjoying trying all the different driving personalities of this car. They may be ugly, but man, they are a blast to drive!
With all due respect, it just ain't so. You can control most everything normally, without using the i-Drive, including turning up the radio with an old fashioned, dash mounted knob.
You had me in your corner all the way up to there. I regard a nav system in much the same way as a sunroof: I didn't need it, didn't want it, wouldn't pay extra for it, but somehow got a car with it and - it's one of the coolest things in the world!
With the sunroof thing, it was my '86 Audi 4KQ. None of 'em (that I know of) came *without* a sunroof, so I got one. I used to have it open a lot. Now, with a series of E28s behind me, I like 'em even more (They're *bigger* on the BMW.).
My wife's '02 Jaguar X-Type has sucked me into two more things. First there's the glass panel roof. After seeing hers, I wanted one in the E28, but hardly any were made that way. Fortunately, ratty old Saabs headed to the junkyard are now yielding a perfect fit glass panel for an E28 at a bargain price!
The other thing is the nav system. A nice English-accented lady (who speaks about a dozen languages!) offers directions and instantly (well, within 30 seconds) reroutes you when you either screw up or ignore her. Best of all, she never gets pissed off, tells you to go to hell, and refuses to give more directions! I think I'm in love ... At any rate, a good nav system could even make a damn Chevy Suburban kinda' fun. I wouldn't pay the extra $1500 for it, but on the used car market, you hardly even notice it in the price.
From a reasonalble point of view, one could come to the comclusion that, compared to cars like the BMW 545i or the BMW 535d, a BMW M5 is completely useless. The performance of both "ordinary" 5-series is way better than you can use on a public road with law enforcement. I think, both BMW M5 and M6 are cars which offer their owners the illusion of getting true race technology in a sedan body. IMHO it is no coincidence that both the 2005 BMW Formula 1 race engine and the BMW M5 engine share the main characteristics: 10 cylinders, high- reving, naturally aspirated engine. If you want to win a race with a cntemporary F1 race car, setup is everything. Today, most of the setup of a race car is done by a laptop linked to the car systems. BMW offers you a race technology car with integrated setup. I think, this is not a bad idea to market a car which is otherwise not very useful in public traffic. To me both M5 and M6 are rolling gameboys for big kids.
Obviously BMW was not interested to give the car the maximum of performance, otherwise they simply would have used a turbocharger or a bigger engine. For comparison: a Mercedes CLS 65 AMG with 5 speed torque converter auto gearbox simply outperforms a M5 at 0-60;- )
I've never driven (or seen for that matter) the CLS65, however edmunds.com has a road test on one.
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If that link is too long, try:
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According to the article, the CLS65 with the twin turbo V12 has a 0-60 time of 4.5 seconds, exactly the same that BMW claims for the '06 M5. The M5 has been faster than that in several other published road tests, the best being
4.1 seconds by, I believe, Road and Track.
You didn't have to say that. We know. No-one on this group has ever driven a CLS65 and I doubt any have seen one in the flesh. The same is probably even true in the aa.mercedes group.
One day.....
I got the first page, but after that it just kept trying to sell me money.
BMW and MB always claim 0-100km/h figures and are always slightly conservative with them. Any 0-60mp/h figures given out by their offices in the states are likely to be calculated.
BMW claim 4.7 seconds for the new M5, exactly the same as MB claim for the CLS55 AMG. MB claim 4.5 seconds for the CLS65 and you just need to look at the figures to see why. Although the CLS65 is 100Kg heavier, it has 612hp compared to the BMW's 507, and 738lb/ft torque compared to BM's 384.
The M5 just isn't going to keep up with that particular MB in a straight line, no matter how high they manage to push the power band up (and it is already very high). A look at
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supports this. There are 3 2006 M5 speeds/times posted to the 1/8 mile which seem to hover just under the 8.2 seconds (ignore the 5.345, an obvious error, it was
8.037).
There are, unsurprisingly, no times yet registered for the CLS65 (or even the CLS63) but two times registered for the CLS55 compare favourably to the M5. Of course, the drivers who did these times aren't professionals and the only way we will be able to compare is when one professional driver tests both cars. I don't think this has been done yet.
Of course, as awesome as AMG's tuned 65 is (and I love AMG and Brabus tuned Mercedes), it doesn't /drive/ like a Bemmer.
I've noticed the lack of torque. It's definitely a learning process to adjust to the car's characteristics, especially the SMG. For the first week or so my left foot was jumping around looking for a clutch everytime I came up to a stop light or sign. Being more accustom to big old, low revving American V8s, this car is quite an experience. But, I am getting there. It may not have much low end torque, but when I finally got the nerve to get the RPMs up, it becomes quite impressive. Everything seems to come together at about 6,000 RPM and the car just leaps forward.
I agree with you statement here, don't feel the need for it and sure wouldn't go out of my way to pay for it. If I found the right car and it had it already, I would not walk away from the car over it.
Really? I wonder if there's any out there that would fit an E30. Wouldn't mind a moon roof just to be different.
One of our compnay trucks (a freightliner) has a nevigation system in it and I've driven it a few times and the navigation system is neat but I can see how some of the idiots I work with have gotten in trouble with it. When driving a 70 ft vehicle, common sense has to interpret the direction given by the nav system...
According to german car mag auto motor sport the BMW M5 needs 4.7 seconds for 0-60 mph acceleration (to be precse: 0-100 kph) in quick launch mode, while the Mercedes needs 4.5 seconds.
My point is that it becomes more and more hard to make a real super performance sedan, when your ordinary sedans also perform super. Back in the early 80's the first BMW M5 was a blast: a 5'series with a M1 racing engine! The car had 286 hp and 360 nm torque, very impresssive in a time when the top model of the 5-series had 100 hp less. Today an ordinary 540i has more than 300 hp and 390 nm torque, the top-of- the line Diesel 535d with twin-turbocharger has 272 hp and hefty 580 nm torque. 0-60 acceleration of both cars is about the same as the acceleration of the first M5 (around 6.5 seconds). To me it does not make sense just to add a vast quantity of hp to such a car. Besides that BMW added a vast amount of gadgets. If someone just wants to drive a fast BMW sedan, he can also buy a BMW 550i, 5.5 seconds from
0-60 should do in most of all driving situations;-)
I agree with you, and if a 1980s vintage M5 in like new condition were available, I probably would be very happy to own and drive it. The '06 M5 is a first for me, although we've owned several other BMWs in the past, and it's still a pleasure to drive, gadgets and all.
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