Interesting Pacifica feature

| | Cop cars get whacked on the side of the road while conducting business with | all kinds of flashing lights because the driver didn't see them....why would | this be any more noticeable? | |

Maybe if the cops would just add one more flashing light to the six they already have will do the trick. What the heck, just add six more to the original six (twelve total). Doubling the number of flashing lights just has to work better...right? If that doesn't work (and it won't), add 12 more to those 12 for 24 flashing lights. Just keep on adding more flashing lights on top of more flashing lights. More is better, right? ;-) Sometimes one just has to wonder if people _really_ want all that stimulus around them all the time!!! Well, it will sell blood pressure medicine, I suppose.

Reply to
James C. Reeves
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What about it? It was one of the early motivators behind the idea for a center high mounted brake light. Rigorous studies found no safety benefit to the blinking effect.

DS

Reply to
Daniel Stern Lighting

And it's ridiculous that North America is still allowing flashing red lights on the backs of cars anyway. At least half the cars on the road already use amber turn signals (as they are imports) and it would not be any hardship to the domestic automakers to mandate flashing amber turn signals by 2007. The only place a flashing red light for a turn signal belongs is on the back of a boat trailer.

Ted

Reply to
Ted Mittelstaedt

What's more, the US regulators want the rest of the world to allow red (as if countries like Germany and Australia will agree to go back to

1956) and are preventing the Canadian regulators from mandating amber.

There's no correlation between country of vehicle origin and rear turn signal color. Lots of US-designed vehicles have amber, and lots of imports have red.

Of course it wouldn't.

The rest of the world doesn't allow flashing red lights for turn signals, even on boat trailers.

DS

Reply to
Daniel Stern Lighting

Which claim? That signals flash at a slow rate, that pulsing would be effective, or that it would be particularly effective with flashing LEDs???? No study to cite. Just experience. You see those flashing LED safety beacons cyclists and joggers use? They stand out. Don't know about you, but I'm smart enough to tell the difference between a high frequency flasher and a turn signal. LEDs dfash better than bulbs because there is no "fade", either going on or off.

>
Reply to
clare

Those would be?

Reply to
RWM

I'll not argue the legal part; as for the safe.. well.. the safest thing would be to get brain dead vehicle operators off the road. All the lights/warning indicators in the world won't stop some of them.

I always watch mirrors when I'm slowing down/stopped to turn off the road onto a side street.. at least once this past year it served me well. I watched imbecile operator close distance to me with no indication of slowing down until I knew they weren't going to stop and redlinefirstgeardumptheclutch. Time to get out of Dodge. Way too late it penetrated their brain cloud that there was 3000lbs of vehicle not moving in front of them and they hammered the brakes. They ended up skidding through where I had been stopped.. Once both cars were stopped I got out and had a 'talk' with the imbecile.. seems he was looking for a street and didn't notice I had stopped.

I currently work on a research farm.. Right through the middle of the farm is a 45 mph road. People usually run around 60 mph on it, and don't expect people to turn off the road into driveways. I'm aware that the boss and two supervisors have been rear ended while turning off this road. I don't like being on the road and turning off it unless I'm in my 5 ton service truck. Even then I don't put myself in front of any large vehicles.

There are enough indicators on vehicles for reasonable people to determine what the vehicle is doing. What we need is for people to start paying attention.

Happy New Year everyone..

Regards,

Jim

Reply to
Jim

One thing I'd like to know about this, is how can one be sure that the strobing effect wouldn't cause epileptic seizures? There's just so many factors to consider that I'd be hesitant to install any lighting equipment on my car that doesn't conform to at least one regulatory code (whether NHTSA or ECE) without thoroughly thinking it through.

nate

Reply to
Nate Nagel

I have to disagree with most of you guys on one thing. There will not be any confusion between a flashing brake light and turn signal light in my area of the country. Most of the dumb drivers around here are too lazy to use the latter.

someone

Reply to
Art Begun

Well you're entitled to your opinion, as am I.

Reply to
Ryan Fraser

Good solution....is that before or after somebody plows into the rear of your car and breaks your back?

Reply to
Ryan Fraser

Certainly, but mine's got a great deal more weight behind it in this field than yours has.

DS

Reply to
Daniel Stern Lighting

| >Cite the source of the studies that prove that claim please. | Which claim? That signals flash at a slow rate, that pulsing would be | effective, or that it would be particularly effective with flashing | LEDs????

The later (obviously).

| No study to cite. Just experience. You see those flashing LED safety | beacons cyclists and joggers use? They stand out.

No doubt, but then they don't have any other lighting systems like a car already does. Apples and oranges.

| Don't know about you, but I'm smart enough to tell the difference | between a high frequency flasher and a turn signal.

You may want to factor in the medical conditions that exist among the general populations OR the meds some people take that can cause light sensitivity among other things. For example (and there are dozens), strobe lighting can cause epileptic seizures among some people. Others on certan medications can become transed (or transfixed) by strobes. Neither situation would be a good thing to happen to a driver...safety negative for sure. The fact that a high number of standing police vehicles outfitted with all sorts of blinking and strobing lights are rammed every year is some indication that this may not be an answer. They are rammed in greater frequency than a regular car with normal flashers changing a tire are. Also, if you've ever driven in bumper-to-bumper rush hour traffic where brake lights are almost constantly on, unnecessary "strobing" brake lights on all of the 30-50 cars you can see in front of you would certainly not do one's end-of-the-day headache any good!

Your personal observation nonwithstanding, the real world is much more complex with many dynamics that need to be factored in (that you don't personally see). Your personal perceptions can be very different than that of an average population. IF strobe brake lights are ever considered by the authorities, let us hope that the appropriate studies are done to know for sure exactly what the pros and cons of such a device would be BEFORE a decision is made.

| LEDs dfash better | than bulbs because there is no "fade", either going on or off. | >

|

I agree that LED arrays are more appropriate signaling devices for that reason (quicker illumination response) as well as longevity reasons (fewer burnouts).

Reply to
James C. Reeves

A wise approach. Too bad everyone doesn't follow that very good advice. Even if the codes are somewhat crappy, they at least allow common protocol of signaling messages that most everyone on the road understands.

Reply to
James C. Reeves

...you mean from the epileptic seizure the driver behind you had that was caused by your strobing brake light?

Strobe lighting causes epileptic seizures to occur among a fairly high number of people in the population. Others on certan meds can become transed (or transfixed) by strobes. Neither situation would be a good thing to happen to a driver behind you and could certaintly contribute to the scenario you mention.

Reply to
James C. Reeves

So are you suggesting different standards for different areas?

Reply to
James C. Reeves

Have any real studies been done in this area, or is everything based on opinion and speculation?

Matt

Reply to
Matthew S. Whiting

There've been studies. I'll see about collecting some of them at the TRB Visibility Committee meeting in DC next week.

DS

Reply to
Daniel Stern Lighting

EXCELLENT IDEA!!! Here's my suggestion:

1) Steady red: Brake lights 2) Blinking amber: Turn signals 3) Steady Green: Accellerator pressed down in vehicle 4) Blinking Green: Accellerator floored in vehicle 5) Steady Purple: Cell phone or loud stereo in use in vehicle 6) Blinking Purple: Open beer container in vehicle 7) Steady Blue: Unrestrained children in vehicle 8) Blinking Blue: seatbelts not fastened in vehicle 9) Steady Orange: Under 18 year old driver behind wheel 10) Blinking Orange: Under 18 year old driver + girlfriend engaged in sexual relations in vehicle

Ted

Reply to
Ted Mittelstaedt

This thread really angered the lamp gods. MAN, I had no idea y'all cared so much.

I actually though the second question was more interesting. We have 3 big rear seat LHS's, and my Mother in law has a BMW 740iL, which is the same size and has a similar stretched rear seat compared to the basic 740. So it's not a unique idea. It's just designed for grown-up use. Of course, I paid $5000 and she paid $50,000. You can't say they don't depreciate, that's for sure, but I thought the old LHS was universally regarded as handsome, powerful, and popular. We got our first one while shopping for a NEW intrepid/concorde, wound up buying the old used LHS for $7500. Then my wife had concluded that since they don't make anything similar to replace it, we'd get enough to last a while. When consumers make decisions like that it might mean they missed an opportunity. I might get attached to any old car but my wife doesn't.

Reply to
Joe

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