Any tips on Triumph GT6 head removal?

Hi all Have had problems with overheating on my '73 GT6. Done all the usual - new hoses - flushed block and rad, new rad, Kenlowe, new stat hoses but still overheating. Oil is clean - no soap - but RAC man last night says bubbles coming up in rad filler really say head gasket is gone. I tend to agree as also got oil all over rear of engine - so bad that has streaked out of wheel arch down side of car.

Stopped before I cooked it and is still running fine - but gets *very* hot quickly.

Anyway have ordered gasket set today and I'm preparing to get dirty!

I'm only armed with a haynes manual and have heard horror stories about these heads - ie they're a bugger to get off.

So - before I start I thought I'd ask the group for any tips to make life easier - avoid sheared studs, lots of swearing and unneccessary breakages!

Would really appreciate any advice or tips. Is a late GT6 Mk III.

Thanks in advance folks Best regards Tony

Also - as is cast iron will I need to get skimmed - or will a thorough clean be ok and maybe flat off with very fine paper eg 2000 grit?

Reply to
Anthony Caira
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I've only removed one of these, from a spare engine I have knocking about. Two of the studs sheared off. One left just enough protruding for me to weld a bar onto it and unscrew it. Then I unscrewed the entire head around what was left of the other stud, which loosened after a couple of turns. Obviously it wasn't in a car at the time or there wouldn't have been room. Not being very encouraging am I? My spare engine had been unused for a few years, whereas if you've cooked yours a bit, it may not be as solid. Take your time over it and good luck!

Reply to
Willy Eckerslyke

An oil leak at the rear of the engine is virtually standard on these engines & their 4 cylinder little brothers. Its part of the reason many Triumph chassis have stayed in good order i.e. the oil helps protect the chassis by coating it while driving.

I've not had to remove the head on mine yet so no advice other than try the TSSC messageboard.

Reply to
Doug

In message , Anthony Caira writes

I always unscrew the head studs first. The usual trick of locking two nuts together seems to do the trick.

BTW, the late GT6 engines used the recessed block that needs a different head gasket (with a lip that fits in the recess around each bore).

Reply to
Chris Morriss

Yes, either a damaged rocker cover or the blanking bolt and washer into the heads oil-way at the back.

Reply to
...Jerry...

No special tricks with these heads. Strip everything off the head and keep it labelled and clean - these are heavy lumps of cast iron so be careful when lifting it. Take all the nuts off and try and get the studs out too - if the head won't come off use a copper hammer or just put the plugs in and spin the engine over on the starter, should pop it off. A good investment is a new set of cylinder head nuts.Use a small amount of blue hylomar around the rear oil seal (where they all leak) - I always do and have never had one leak afterwards. Examine your head for cracking in the combustion chambers - also a good time to check with a straight edge that it's flat. Skimming is OK as long as you know what's been taken off and you don't raise the CR too much. Finally try and get a good quality proper copper gasket. Smear your gasket with a light coat of LM grease and torque down as per manual. The flat block ran to engine number KE10000 then they went to the recessed block - the head gaskets are not interchangeable! You want part number 217291 for a recessed block - £13.00 on its' own but get the decoke set for £20.00 as it includes all the other gaskets you'll need and a few you won't :-) Bits available from

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Reply to
J

Thanks folks

Top tips all around!

I especially like the tip below about turning the engine over with the plugs in - this worked for me on an all alloy 1960 Alfa Giulietta I used to have...and I'd forgotten about this tip!

It is the recessed block in mine and I have indeed just today ordered the set from good old canleyclassics. Carl in the workshop was very helpful in helping me identify the block and head numbers and type - I'd highly recommend these people.

I was amazed to find my car still has its original engine - and that its not too bad at 88,000 miles for a 31` year old car (I have all Mot's and mileage checks out now - was worried may have been an engine change at some point).

Seem pretty solid old blocks and I'm hoping she's ok.

One thing - it's been suggested taking the studs out. I think inevitably these will loosen or one or more will come out instead of the nuts. What torque setting should I use on the studs to block? Same as the nuts? My manual is vague on this and only gives MKII settings - is MK III different?

Aaaand finally...my 9 year old stepdaughter and I are having a discussion on the GT. We want to name 'it' but can't decide if its a boy or a girl!! Its yellow so maybe a a more girly colour - but definitely sounds like a boy with its sports exhuast waking our neighbours up!

So - for a bit of fun - are Gt's male or female (spits for that matter - I have a '75 1500 in red with no name!) and any suggestions for a polite name for a '73 6 in yellow!!??? Best wishes Tony

Reply to
Anthony Caira

Karl is an occasional GT6 racer - builds his own race engines and know a thing or two about GT6s too :-)

Torque studs same as nuts, if there's a difference between Mk2 and 3 it's gotta be marginal - it's all very similar if not interchangeable.

I've always thought of GT6s as male, Spitfires as female. What yellow is the GT? Saffron, Mimosa or Jasmine? Jasmine is very girly - the wife's Herald is Jasmine and shock horror the car is called... Jasmine!

Reply to
J

In message , Anthony Caira writes

88,000 miles for a 2-litre Triumph is nothing. Provided that the crankshaft thrust washers are still in place and doing their job it should manage twice that. (You do know about the thrust washer problems I guess?)
Reply to
Chris Morriss

Tony, I have no specific knowledge about the GT6 however I've changed more heads than I care to remember, mostly on Austin cars or more recently Ford V6's. My advice would be: Think about the obvious hazards and guard against them, ie fire shock etc. DISCONNECT and REMOVE the battery BEFORE doing anything else - it's surprising how many times the spanners end up across the termminals!!

You'll have few problems if you thoroughly prepare, (provided you have some rudimentary knowledge of the basic engineering principles.) So, read the manual (and any other advice from fellow owners etc.) Work methodically. Keep work clean and don't rush. It is important to give any likely problem bolts a dose of WD40 or similar 24-48hrs before starting.

Keep to the proper sequence for removing the head bolts/studs (See the manual - this is another very important point.) I always just get about a half turn start on each one before undoing them further - and progresisvely.

Be very careful with the manifold - loosen gradually as with the head, particularly if it is cast iron (I am not familiar with the GT6 maniforld - either way just be sensible how you treat it as it is likely to be fragile if it is of cast iron.)

Try NOT to force anything, particulary things like manifold - thermostat housing etc. If the components won't come away after releasing the bolts, try patience and WD40 etc. giving a good soak rather than resorting to the big hammer. Try going away for a cup of tea and resuming later...... that one often works for me after I've struggled for ages and exhausted my more colourful vocabulary!

If you need to thump anything - make sure the bit you are hitting is harder than the bit you are hitting with!! ie. try a stout piece of wood. A lead or copper hammer maybe - however, you should NEVER need to hit anything directly with a steel hammer.

When you get to the head itself you may indeed find it will stick - either to the block - the studs/bolts etc. Again soaking with penetrating oil, paraffin etc. may help, but NEVER - NEVER try levering it up/off with a screw driver or other lever. NEVER try to force anything between the two mating surfaces to separate them.

To answer your query re. the cast iron head - you may well find it will be OK and NOT need skimming. (The heads of some engines are prone to warping but they tend to be aluminium/alloys; the cast iron ones are the most sturdy -again I don't know about the Triumph engine)

If after soaking and coaxing you still have trouble with separating the head from the block - try this. Put the plugs back in. DISCONNECT the distributor lead from the coil. Connect the battery and turn the enine over on the starter motor. The compression of the engine should pop it loose.

This is not an exhaustive list of what needs to be thought about - and it is written with the assumption you have a basuic knowledge and tools. In any event the very best of luck. It will all be worth it when you get it running again. Hope this is of some help. Regards Gee.

Reply to
T.Gee

Tony, I'm sorry - I'm not too used to these computer News things yet - I didn't realise that you'd had plenty of advice from fellow Triumph owners (I'd not "opened" the reply bits) I rattled out a reply to your query a few minutes ago which is probably of little use - please excuse the oversight. Regards Gee

Reply to
T.Gee

The leak occurs at the back lefthand corner of the headgasket. This is where the main oil feed to the rockers is located and it is the only place where gasket sealant of any kind should be applied to the headgasket. A light smear of Blue Hylomar here, on both head and block sides of the gasket, will prevent leakage. Cheers, Bill.

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Reply to
Bill Davies

Yep thanks Bill - I'm aware of that - probably from one of your own posts on the TSSC messageboard mind ;-)

I've a very very minor leak from that spot on my SPit but nothing to merit replacing the gasket (At least so far....)

Reply to
Doug

Careful machining of crank and block, along with custom made trust washers will sort this problem for good, as part of the machining the block is drilled and taped to accept c/s set screws that are then used to hold the custom trust washers.

Reply to
...Jerry...

.. which probably costs as much as a decent s/h engine?

BTW, your post reminded me, a while back I found the website of an American chap who had researched a new type of material for these thrust washers for the TR6, which I'd guess are the same. It made a good read. I'll have a look in the morning.

Reply to
Willy Eckerslyke

How much is a known good SH engine though, and good SH engines are not going to be around long, AIUI the GT6 engine is not the same as those for TR or

2000 series.
Reply to
...Jerry...

Willy Eckerslyke realised it was Tue, 29 Jun 2004 18:46:40 +0100 and decided it was time to write:

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Reply to
Yippee

In message , ...Jerry... writes

I believe the Mk2 engines were the same for the 2000 and the Vitesse/GT6. The mountings were different, but all blocks have the cast mounting that are needed to fit the engines in a Vitesse/GT6.

Reply to
Chris Morriss

Well the all the Triumph 6 pot engines (2000, 2500 GT6, TR5, TR6 and Vitesse) are all very similar and can be swapped around pretty easily - there are detail differences but unless you're talking very early 2000 block (without correct engine mounting castings) then you're not going to have THAT much trouble swapping any of those lumps into a GT6. There are plenty around but it's getting hard to find a good one for decent money - there's not much that you can't get for them and the engineering involved is all simple stuff.

Reply to
J

Strange, I'm sure I read in 'Triumph Tune' catalogue a few years back that the 2000 engine has the wrong sump layout and swapping sumps was not a straight forward job due to oil pick-up pipes etc.

I'll try and dig the artitcal out and check

Reply to
...Jerry...

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