torque is cheap, though probably an expensive repair...

Hi. My 1981 Ford Granada 2.8 Auto came home on a tow truck yesterday. The gearbox lost all drive, though by the time the RAC arrived an hour later some drive had been restored. The gearbox oil is a grubby brown colour and the car can just about move for a few yards before drive is lost again. Am I right in thinking that this points to either low gearbox oil level, failure of the torque converter or failure of the gearbox? The car is fitted with the later type box, still 3 speed, but uses the later specification gearbox oil. It has covered 55k miles but only gets used for approx. 1500 miles each year. It is fitted with a vacuum system that the Haynes manual says can fail leading to fluid loss. Sadly the Haynes manual says consult a dealer, but that means spending big pennies which I don't have at the moment. Is there anyway I can test the effectiveness of the torque converter, or should I try to find a second hand box? Also does the torque converter get its supply of oil from the gearbox or is it a sealed unit? I had a quote this morning for £1600 to rebuild the box which is about twice the value of the car!!! As it is quite a rare Minster stretched model it is probably too good to break/scrap. Thoughts, comments, advice please.....

Reply to
georgina Smith
Loading thread data ...

Unlikely to be low fluid level, I'm afraid. There's a pump in the gearbox and if the level drops below its pickup, no gears will engage. There is a grey area where it picks up a mixture of fluid and air, but this would result in gears dropping out etc when cornering long before no drive at all.

If the symptoms are the same in both drive and reverse it's more likely to be a TC failure. If it's ok in reverse, then likely a clutch failure.

The vacuum unit measures inlet manifold pressure and uses this to vary gearchange speeds, etc. If it fails, the gearbox will usually remain in first gear until you exceed the speed permitted in that. A failed one also usually allows gearbox fluid into the engine which burns it producing clouds of white smoke.

If it's a Ford box they tend to suffer from seal failure. This can give much the same results as having no fluid as the hydraulic pressure is lost. Unfortunately pretty well all failures result in needing the box re-built, and the labour charge is far far more than that of the parts.

1600 quid does sound a bit high, though. I had a Rover SD1 three speed box rebuilt and the TC replaced (including fitting) about 3 years ago for under 1000.

The alternative might be a secondhand one - perhaps an enthusiast has converted to manual and has a known good box for sale. The owner's club might be the place to start looking.

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

Shop around, £1600 is a rip-off! I rebuild autoboxes for landrovers/rangerovers and I can supply a fully rebuilt ZF4-speed for them for c.£600, including a new torque convertor and vaarious internal upgrades to prevent certain known faults from re-occurring. Badger.

Reply to
Badger

1600 UKP is silly money. A quick google turned up:

formatting link
who quote 395 UKP (loose, retail) for the C3 autobox used in the Granada

formatting link
Never had dealings with them myself, but they look like they'd be worth contacting.

Reply to
Andrew Robert Breen

cheapest thing with auto is change the oil, if it recovers good, if not it's only a few quid.

It's a small world I saw a mint one of those in the metal (real not photo/TV etc) for the first time in my life just last week in Burton on Trent market place.

-- Peter Hill Spamtrap reply domain as per NNTP-Posting-Host in header Can of worms - what every fisherman wants. Can of worms - what every PC owner gets!

Reply to
Peter Hill

Badger ( snipped-for-privacy@btinternet.com) gurgled happily, sounding much like they were saying :

Interesting... What do you know about 4HP18s, as fitted to Cit XMs...?

My email address works.

Reply to
Adrian

If it was mine and I had no spares kit, I would buy a complete granny in running order and take the box/tc out, sell the remains.

I have got a known good auto box and tc from a 2.8i granada that would be perfect for you, they came out of an A reg that was run out of engine oil till it seized.

How long is the Minster version? I could probably even fit it for you , if it will fit in my garage. I am in Essex.

Mrcheerful

Reply to
mrcheerful

Not a lot, but it's probably a very similar box internally to the 22 and 24, knowing how ZF work. Badger.

Reply to
Badger

Thank you all for your comments and advice. Dave Plowman may be right. The first symptom occurred while negotiating a corner and then got steadily worse so low fluid level is a definate possibility however without further examination why this occurred is unknown.

Mr Cheerful thanks for the great offer. The minster is about a 12" stretch so just fits into my prefab garage. The guy who lived in this house before me could just fit his Bentley Mulsanne in there. Just... Sadly I don't think I will be able to tow the beast to essex, although I live relatively close in Surrey. I will see if topping up the fluid level gives me some drive then get back to you. Cheers for the time being.

Reply to
georgina Smith

If it was caused by a *sudden* extreme fluid leak it should be easy enough to fix, and unlikely to have done any damage to the box.

Reply to
Dave Plowman (News)

It is certainly worth trying - though the description in the original post that the gearbox oil is a "grubby brown colour" suggests that some damage has been done.

Jim

Reply to
Jim Warren

MotorsForum website is not affiliated with any of the manufacturers or service providers discussed here. All logos and trade names are the property of their respective owners.