95 Jeep Wrangler Shifting problems

Hello gentlemen I'm hoping somebody can give some insight to a problem that started about a month ago...I have a 95 wrangler 4.0 5-speed manual transmission with 105K and all of the sudden the clutch is sticking in gear sometimes (mostly first) amd sometimes I can't get into gear unless I let up on the clutch first, or pump it once, and then it's fine...

the brake fluid level in the small reservoir was a bit low so I topped it off with the right stuff and drove for a few days with no change...

I've done a few tests myself and I really don't think it's the clutch itself, it's not slipping at all or grinding...I've been lurking around here and it seem either the master or ugh slave cylinder are the big culprits? Any way to figure which it might be, from what I've described?

Also somebody mentioned to me that I might have a broken spring in the pressure plate?

Thanks in advance!

Reply to
solasound
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More likely your first diagnosis, a leak and or slave/master cylinder going bad. Not sure how to tell master vs. slave, but I have seen it to be the slave most of the time.

Reply to
JimG

Reply to
L.W.( ßill ) Hughes III

Letting up on the clutch in neutral is also double clutching which can let a low fluid or water contaminated tranny shift. That implies the syncros aren't spinning up.

I would be checking the fluid first anyway just to make sure it is topped up and doesn't look like a milkshake. They get water in them easy if you go too deep off road, the tranny has no vent hose only a button.

After that, you get into pressure plate issues or even loose trannys or hydraulics....

Mike

86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's

snipped-for-privacy@comcast.net wrote:

Reply to
Mike Romain

Without reading another word, you have troubles withthe Clutch Master Cylinder.

The clutch and the brakes use similar systems, lets' talk about brakes because youhave probably experienced this before. If you are waiting at a light with your foot on the brake pedal, you might notice your foot slowly sinks towards the carpet. This means the Brake Master Cylinder is failing. The MC has a couple of chambers, and has a piston and a variety of internal seals. Over time, these seals begin to fail, and you notice this as your foot sinking at the stop sign or traffic light. The recovery mode is to pump the brake pedal.

Now the clutch. The clutch uses a hydraulic system that is very similar, perhaps identical, to that which is used for the brakes. The difference is that you hold your foot on the floor when youuse the clutch, but there is a HUGE spring inside the clutch that is pushing back at you. When the MC fails in the clutch, your experience is that the car may begin to creep if you hold the clutch depressed for a very ling traffic light and the transmission is in gear. What you do notice is that if you hold the clutch depressed in N while waiting for the green light, you will not be able to select 1 when the light turns green. This is because the trans is already moving and the gears will not mesh. The recover mode is to pump the clutch pedal a few times.

The seals inside the MC (either the brakes or the clutch) can fail in such a way that the operating pressure is lost, but no fluid leaks to the outside. There is a slave culinder in the clutch, roughly equivelent to the brake cylinders (or pistons in the instance of disc brakes). When the slave cylinders leak, they leak to the outside and the leaking is eventually visible, and frequently catastrophic. When the MC fails, it needs attention, but I can not recall any instance of catastrophic failure where the clutch or brakes fail completely without warning. That is the good news. The bad news is, you can't ignore repairs. Well, you can ignore repairs, but I would appreciate it if you stay in front of me if that happens.

Reply to
Jeff Strickland

Mike! He has described a classic Clutch Master Cylinder failure, hasn't he? In which case, the fluid might not be low.

Reply to
Jeff Strickland

He could be.

Someone else just had a similar issue and the tranny was loose from the engine.....

Checking fluids first is easy and free too.....

Mike

86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's

Jeff Strickland wrote:

Reply to
Mike Romain

brakes

similar,

difference is

transmission

depressed in N

eventually

Thanks guys for all your information!

Hey Jeff! When you said this:

Now the clutch. The clutch uses a hydraulic system that is very similar, perhaps identical, to that which is used for the brakes. The difference is that you hold your foot on the floor when youuse the clutch, but there is a HUGE spring inside the clutch that is pushing back at you. When the MC fails in the clutch, your experience is that the car may begin to creep if you hold the clutch depressed for a very ling traffic light and the transmission is in gear. What you do notice is that if you hold the clutch depressed in N while waiting for the green light, you will not be able to select 1 when the light turns green. This is because the trans is already moving and the gears will not mesh. The recover mode is to pump the clutch pedal a few times.

That is definitely what is happening, and also, like before when you mentioned the brake slowly moving closer to the floor when your foot is on it, this also happens with the clutch, it sinks and then if you pump it the pressure comes back...so I guess I know what to do! thanks again! Angelo

Reply to
solasound

Bingo.

To be completely safe and sure of your diagnosis (or mine if you prefer to pin it on me), you should go ahead and check that the trans fluid is full. I suspect it is, but even if it isn't, it generally contributes to grinding between gears more than prohibitting selecting 1st.

Pumping the pedals and having that bring them back into service means the MC is toast.

Reply to
Jeff Strickland

difference

depressed

Thanks again mate!

Reply to
solasound

Second that, Jeff. Just changed mine out for that very reason. After swapping the mc out I looked at the insides and it was full of 'mud' from deteriorating rubber somewhere so I swapped the slave as well. This one was tricky: pump it up and it held for several minutes - maybe an hour. Next time, it would bleed down so fast I had to time it to get it in first. The piston was fine - it was the mud getting into the valve at the end that lets in more fluid when you pump it up. Once pumped, I rarely saw any bleed off while the clutch was in, so it didn't act like a common mc failure.

If the brake fluid in the system is cruddy, you probably found the problem and cause.

Advice: if you change the mc, change the slave as well (it's the external > Mike! He has described a classic Clutch Master Cylinder failure, hasn't he?

Reply to
Will Honea

Got to chuckle at this. As I said earlier, mine was not bleeding down while pressure was on so much as when off it or if I pressed slowly. I was doing a bunch of pumping - until the !@#$%^ offset arrm that the XJ/MJ uses on the clutch pedal broke off. Now THAT is what I classify as catastrophic - good thing I had a strong battery and was only 10 miles or so from the barn.

Reply to
Will Honea

Like other have said it is probably your master cyln. I lost mine 2 days ago and the part just arrived.... This is the second one that has failed on me over the years and the symptom are hard shifting / spongy pedal and fluid dripping down the fire wall inside the vehicle.

Reply to
Jeepster

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