Jeep brand to become "less rugged" according to chrysler

Anyone who's seen the Liberty already knows this. At least they are saying they're keeping "serious" off-road vehicles in the lineup.

"Jeep advertising will tout five areas of off-road vehicle performance tested by an independent third party and designated Trail Rated. The areas of performance are: traction, articulation (climbing), ground clearance, maneuverability and water fording."

Articulation is defined as climbing ability? Pshaw. The Trail Rating thing means nothing to people who don't care, and it will mean nothing especially if they put the badge on the Liberty. Notice the first two words of the passage.

• * * Matt Macchiarolo
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I think I'm gonna be sick!!!

Greg

Yeah, I have an XJ and I don't know what I will get after it is done. I only have 130K miles on it, but at some point I may need another car. I guess I will have to find a D-90 or something. The only problem with those is they are all automatics in the US.

Oh well. Curt

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Profitability always has to enter into any business and DC has to stay profitable in order to stay in business.

I see a lot of remarks about the Liberty not being a "real" Jeep. None of the real Jeeps I rode in while in the Army had air conditioning but I noticed that a Rubicon I looked at did have A/C so does that mean the Rubicon is not a "real" Jeep? I don't think so, it just acknowledges the reality of the marketplace and there is not much room in the market for any vehicle that does not offer A/C.

I am the proud owner of a 2004 Liberty Sport and am very happy that Jeep decided to build a vehicle that fits my needs. I agree it is not a "rock crawler", but I don't want a "rock crawler". Those of you who are still young wait until you get to be 58 and have a bad back, those "rock crawlers" will be a lot less appealing to you then.

I enjoy seeing the really tough Jeeps when we go to Moab. We drive many of the less demanding trails (did I mention that my wife has arthritis in her neck and can't stand the beating a "real" Jeep would give her) and thoroughly enjoy ourselves.

For the past few years I drove a Nissan 4 X 4 King Cab pickup so we could go off road. When we decided to get something new we looked at the X-Terra first and it just didn't seem to be a very impressive vehicle.

Then we looked at the Liberty and knew it was exactly what we wanted.

I hope Jeep continues to build the Rubicon and it's successors for many years to come but I hope they also continue the Liberty and Grand Cherokee. You young folk will need them someday when you too get too old and sore to drive the Rubicons.

Bill Tolle "I used to make fun of old folks but now I are one :-)"

Bill, meet Bill... LOL

Now, now, the Libby can be a serious off road machine...all you have to do is cut everything off at the frame and then replace the lower 1/2 of the vehicle. LOL.

Take it easy, old timer. :-) If you know my posting history you will see that I am in complete agreement with you. Of course DC has to stay competitive so they have to introduce a more road-comfortable vehicle. I'm actually glad you take your Liberty off-road, while not as capable as a Wrangler due mainly to its IFS it is probably more capable than many believe. Most of the disdain held against the Liberty is that it replaced the XJ Cherokee which is generally agreed to have more off-road capability than the Liberty.

My point was twofold...(1) that the "trail rated" advertising program DC is coming up with is just a marketing gimmick if it infers the Liberty is equal to a Wrangler in overall trail worthiness, and (2) they confirmed that "serious" off-road vehicles will remain in the lineup, presumably the TJ and the forthcoming Scrambler, though rumor has it that IFS is destined for the Grand Cherokee.

• * * Matt Macchiarolo
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As the owner of a KJ, I'll be the first one to admit that a "Libby" will not go everywhere a Wrangler will. However, since I can only afford one vehicle, and most of my "off road" will be "rough" forest trails, I'll do OK. I'm old enough to want some comfort going to/from work (particulary when it gets to 10 degrees in February (grin).

Bruce

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They do - its called the Gelandewagen and costs 72,500K. Thank god they make Jeeps as I can't afford one. Sadly I can't afford a Viper either.

Dave Milne, Scotland '99 TJ 4.0 Sahara

: > Take it easy, old timer. :-) If you know my posting history you will see that I : > am in complete agreement with you. Of course DC has to stay competitive so they : > have to introduce a more road-comfortable vehicle. I'm actually glad you take : > your Liberty off-road, while not as capable as a Wrangler due mainly to its IFS : > it is probably more capable than many believe. Most of the disdain held against : > the Liberty is that it replaced the XJ Cherokee which is generally agreed to : > have more off-road capability than the Liberty. : >

: > My point was twofold...(1) that the "trail rated" advertising program DC is : > coming up with is just a marketing gimmick if it infers the Liberty is equal to : > a Wrangler in overall trail worthiness, and (2) they confirmed that "serious" : > off-road vehicles will remain in the lineup, presumably the TJ and the : > forthcoming Scrambler, though rumor has it that IFS is destined for the Grand : > Cherokee. : > * * * : > Matt Macchiarolo : >

: > : >

unfair, but very funny :-)

That and the fact that the Liberty is smaller than the Cherokee. While going camping up north, we had the choice of three vehicles: My 10 year old XJ, a one year old KJ, or a Ford Ranger. Guess which one we took...

Hopefully I'll be able to find another good used XJ when mine finally dies, or be able to afford a WJ. The KJ (and TJ) simply do not fit my needs.

Interesting is this quote from that article:

"For example, one of four Jeep owners drives off-road compared with one in

10 SUV owners, said Jeff Bell, Jeep marketing vice president, at a press event in Detroit last week."

I personally believe that is one in four Wrangler owners. I really don't think the above statement applies to Liberties or Grand Cherokees.

Tom

Oh, NOW you chime in. Where were you last week when I was being picked on by all the TJ enthusiasts? ;-)

John still holds several thousand shares of AMC stock, he has an agenda ...

I think it applies to ALL Jeep owners. Wrangler, et al, drivers are probably a higher rate than that. There are Grand drivers that take their vehicles offroading, but I agree that most Grand drivers have a monetary disincentive to go offroad. Grands offroad very well, they simply cost too much to justify the fun vs. the abuse.