There is a rumour going about that if you get caught on a motoring offence (speeding, traffic lights etc.) where the evidence is taken by a camera that, when you are sent a form asking for details of the driver all you have to do is to confirm that you were driving but not sign it as they then cannot use your statement as evidence.
Is this right?
Not any more. I think google will soon show you that loophole was closed a while back.
Simon Atkinson spoke:
True - however a janitor friend of mine informs me that, within the polis, is a rumour that they have so mane NIPS to deal with, that if you simply ignore *everything* they will eventually give up and stop hassling you.
If you follow this advice and it proves incorrect, you may sue me up to the monetary value I paid for it.
I had to deal with one of these cases in court yesterday.
The exact current position is as follows:
They cannot charge you with speeding as , as you stated, the evidence is not admissible.
BUT
They can, and will charge you under S 172 of the Road Traffic Act as "person keeping vehicle failing to supply particulars of the driver as requested by the Chief Police Officer"
The notice that is sent does require you to complete the *whole* of the relevant section which includes your signature.
This was recently covered by a High Court ruling in the case of Francis v DPP (March 2004)
The case who we had yesterday was in high dudgeon with our verdict and announced that he would appeal. With such recent case law he is bound to fail (his circumstances were exactly the same as in Francis v DPP) and so all he will get is an additional bill for costs in the County Court.
The norm on the speeding charge would be a fixed penalty ticket for around £60 and 3 points on the licence
The norm for not responding to the ticket and it having to go to court would mean 3 points and a fine in the region of £135 plus costs (£45)
The norm for a S172 charge is again 3 points on the licence and a fine in the region of £320 plus costs (£75 + as they have to get in a witness from the Ticket Office)
You pays your money and you takes your chance - but its still 3 points on your licence whichever way you go!
In message , Rope writes
Excellent real world info as usual.
Shame about the top-posting though ;)
--=20
jeremy ['75 RD250A ] | ['02 Fazer 600 in blue]=20 ____________________________________________ jeremy dot ovenden at hazelweb dot co dot uk
I'm expecting a bill for the advice through the door at any moment :-)
That's what I was nicked for. I got a MS90 on my licence with 3 points, a 100 quid fine and 40 quid costs. All because I didn't receive an NIP within a reasonable time[1] and refused to accept their word that they sent it, even though the ticket office had no proof they had.
The system and the recourse to appeal suck mightily.
[1] It took them 6 months to get one to me.
are you new?
In message , JP writes
What would be the situation if my wife was driving?? In normal circumstances AIUI a person cannot be made to give evidence against their spouse. Would this apply in this situation?
You're talking about competence and compellability of witnesses here. In all cases - both criminal and civil - you may be called to give evidence in a case involving your spouse (for the prosecution OR the defence) but you cannot be forced to give evidence in all cases (compellability). You are compellable in all civil cases and only a small number of criminal cases. Road Traffic Act offences are not compellable.
However - if you refuse to fill in the ticket on teh grounds that you are being forced to give evidence against your spouse then you would leave yourself open to a prosecution under Sec 172 for failing to provide full details and I cannot see The Court accepting compellability as a defence in these circumstances.
One of you would get 'done' - so who has the least points on their licence??
:-)
Graeme
Unfortunately not given by myself (as in JP - lover of all things green etc etc) but by another one!!
JP
Bloody hell, if that's the case I think its still legal to either kill newspaper reporters in seaside towns or threaten William Hartnell.
Crikey! We can't have two posters called JP giving legal advice.
Who?
It could get awkward and confusing!
Heard news / gossip that there were plans to drop the point system???
Take it we're going to get sometime a little more bazaar in its place or is the nanny state going to lose the run of itself!!!
Blue skies
FIGHT TO THE DEATH!
It could get as funny as f*ck. Especially if the advice is contradictory.
all this speeding thing doesnt mean a thing to me.
i must be the only series 2a driver that has a speed trap detector fitted.
i won a origin b2 in january and i think its brilliant, on unfamilliar roads its a godsend. it does exactly what it says on the tin,
it displays the speed your doing no matter what tyres youve got on, as its gps based.
and beeps and flashes like f**k when youre approaching any speed trap anywhere.
andy
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Which it's almost bound to be.
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