OT: Road Rage / UK firearms policy

"Exit" schreef in bericht news:0ukhb.92251$ snipped-for-privacy@news-lhr.blueyonder.co.uk

Ah, bullshit. Nobody *really* needs anything at all. You'd be surprised on just how little humans can survive.

At the end of the day, nobody *really* needs a LandRover do they? With one of these LandRovers, if hit a group of pedestrians or cyclists, there will also be a great number of casualties. Ban all LandRovers then?

I don't _need_ any of my landies - or other toys. I have them because I _want_ them.

I'd agree, that in the highly unlikely event that I should ever _want_ to own a firearm, I should, provided I take due care and be it within the proper constraints of the Law of the country within which I reside, be allowed to have one.

This is all getting a little too far off topic. The thing that started me thinking about all of this was the news report of the Road Rage incident. I find that a tad more scary than the usual incompetence of media insipred kneejerk reactionary legislature by poll vaulting politicians with brains the size of a gnats willy...

Anyway, if I did ever want a gun, it would be akin to my Landies no doubt. Old, heavy, in need of care and certainly not something to go into town with at rush hour... or one of these:

(I may take that into town during rush hour, come to think of it) :-)

Martyn

"Mother" schreef in bericht news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com

Correct.

Now THAT is firepower! Does the UK govt. hand out permits for these? ;-)

You're starting to sound like the NRA now - 'guns don't kill people, SUV's do!'

Handguns are designed to shoot people. That is their only function. If you want to play target practice games with one and live in a country that has elected a govt. that allows it then fine. I live in a country that doesn't allow it and I doubt changing that law will even figure in the upcoming general election as most people want as much gun control as possible here.

More predictable than usual from you I'm afraid. If Land Rovers were designed with the sole purpose of killing people Id agree with you, but they're not so I don't.

Mother"

(snip)

(snip) I would be interested to know where you got these figures - my impression, based admittedly on the media, is that we have had a small but significant increase in the number of cases of gun homicide (as distinct from accdents) since the increased restrictions on firearms. Certainly the number of homicides using handguns has increased markedly, and the number of illegal handguns has greatly increased. (Some claims allege that they are now bewing imported with impunity by the container load) In some city areas they seem to be regarded as fashion accessories by schoolchildren. On the other hand, one effect of the restrictions was that a few weeks ago after finding a wild pig in the Southwest paddock I had to return two kilometres to the house, unlock two separate storages to get a rifle and ammunition, and drive back to the paddock in the hope that the pig was still there. Surprisingly, he was, but the gun laws required a four kilometre round trip and wasted about three quarters of an hour of my time. As far as the international comparisions of homicide rates go, I would think that the U.S. homicide rate exceeds that of any comparable country (about ten to one) by more than can be explained by gun availability - the proliferation of guns and the homicide rate are probably different symptoms of the same cultural difference. JD

There are lots of terrain-capable vehicles around, that are designed in a much more collision-friendly way as far as pedestrians are concerned. LandRovers don't have that design feature.

Every casualty that can be avoided... etc. etc.

If that means denying a great number of good meaning people their hobbies, so be it.

...Your way of thinking, Julian...

On or around Thu, 09 Oct 2003 17:58:56 GMT, "aghasee" enlightened us thusly:

not been reading this thread closely, the arguments various have been done to death... but noticed this bit.

what if, instead of shooting people, he'd gone berserk with a car, or even a landrover, and run 'em over? Ditto for the nutter at hungerford some years previously... If some nutter had gone berserk, driven down the high street at speed and killed 14 people, would we then have a frothing hysterical campaign to ban cars? I think not.

Twas Thu, 09 Oct 2003 17:22:23 GMT when "Exit" put finger to keyboard producing:

To "busta cap in tha motha" is just not the way of an english gentleman, just not cricket.

-- Regards. Mark.(AKA, Mr.Nice.) ___________________________________________________________ "To know the character of a man, give him anonymity" - Mr.Nice.

mrniceATmrnice.me.uk

The figures are from the Australian Bureau of Statistics:

Typically reactionary gun owners response. If they start designing Land Rovers with the sole purpose of killing people you point will stand - until then it does not.

Hey! Don't give Luckwill any more ideas! :0

"Exit" schreef in bericht news:dMyhb.106728$ snipped-for-privacy@news-lhr.blueyonder.co.uk

I do not (fully) agree... I do not agree at all actually :-) As far as my HP9mm (or any military gun) is concerned, you could have part of a point here, this gun has military origins, has been designed to handle well, to be very reliable in poor working and maintenance conditions, is very high-powered... etc. etc. OTOH, the only reason I have it, and have been allowed by my govt. to have it, is olympic shooting.

But, my *Hammerli 208 cal .22LR has been designed and built with only one thing in mind: olympic target shooting. A disadvantage of this Swiss precision instrument exists in the fact that, when not used properly, it can kill people. Excactly as somebody can kill with LandRovers, or cars in general for that matter, when not used according to their design purpose. Or knives, or axes, or baseball-bats, or... you name it, whatever.

*This gun was bought 2nd hand from a -to me unknown- British owner, who had to part with it due to the handgun-ban, incidently.

Pros

How about this for a sig? ;-) "Them was dark days after WW2 - it was only aluminium because we could get it war surplus and so we had to fit a war surplus engine as well." (Rover)

Actually you'll find that ALL gun crimes are committed by criminals - by definition!

snipped-for-privacy@cssd.org.uk

In fact Hamilton had an 'off ticket' hand gun.

snipped-for-privacy@cssd.org.uk

A hand-gun wouldn't be my first choice were I of a bent to kill lots of people. Why are you so obsessed with guns anyhoo? snipped-for-privacy@cssd.org.uk

It is often claimed that allowing easy access to firearms will lead to shoot-outs in the streets, but where carry permits have been issued in the states or where there are very few gun controls this has simply not happened. I suspect this is because there is a world of difference between blowing up and wishing to effect administrative punishment and actually trying to kill someone. Those who believe that others are likely to do so are usually projecting their own mistrust of their own self-control onto others.

A handful of links for those wishing to know a little more:

a light hearted dig at the gun control network (a secretive closedmembership society thought to contain no more than seven members) snipped-for-privacy@cssd.org.uk

Actually this does seem to be true, even when in the UK we had essentially no gun control laws and guns were fairly common the murder rates were very low indeed and murder by the use of firearms most uncommon.

snipped-for-privacy@cssd.org.uk

Er no, this is not true. The law is based on banning guns which might otherwise be legal, by which I mean that the government accept that their law does nothing to combat gun misuse or crime but ensures that when the next atrocity comes at least it won't be with a legally held gun. Which makes it all right apparently. Challenge the home office on the 1997 laws being ineffective and this is what they will tell you.

Any of the recent shootings could have been resulted in greater fatalities if the shooters hadn't been just scumbag chancers - regardless of the choice of weapon.

snipped-for-privacy@cssd.org.uk