On or around Wed, 24 Nov 2004 18:35:12 -0500, "Scot Kight" enlightened us thusly:
hmmm. mine whines *and* clunks. They're not supposed to clunk, really. But I venture to suggest that they'd not have redesigned the gears to make 'em quieter if gearbox noise wasn't a common problem.
Thats my feeling, though I am still concerned mostly about reducing the whine. New tires (bridgestone at revos) and a few new exhaust gaskets have brought me a much more quiet ride. Unfortunately that quiet ride really shows off the whine!
65-70mph and the whine all but dissapears, below that 50-55 its very loud, and at a frequency that drives me crazy. I can hear some dog whistles and this is pretty similar. Not going to be patting the ground with my legs or anything, but still for a long drive the sound is just unacceptable.Oh well, I will get the MFO somehow, I think I found another uk company that is a steve parker reseller who will be able to ship it to me. Just need to verify this with them and I should have it next week sometime.
Scot
Oil feeder or not, it won't stop wine, besides it is a landrover modification anyway, not exclusive to John Parker.
AFIAC, the wine is a characteristic of the transfer box. Some do, some don't. We once had a 1988 Defender 2.5TD which wined from new. My 1998 Disco shows sines of wine occasionally especially on the motor way.
Mick
My 13,000 mile late '02 Defender 90 CSW has just gone in to have its whining transfer box replaced under warranty.
Steve. Suffolk. remove 'knujon' to e-mail
jeez! you'd think after all these years of building them they could get it right
What is more is that they had to wait 3 weeks for the replacement as they were on back order from Land Rover as they were having issues with them!
Steve. Suffolk. remove 'knujon' to e-mail
On or around Thu, 25 Nov 2004 08:34:48 +0000, Mick enlightened us thusly:
The thing under discussion, AFAIK, was designed and marketed by Steve Parker. It might be that LR did their own similar mod, as was mentioned in another thread recently, or it might be that they bought 'em from Steve in order to fit 'em...
some people have reported reduced noise as a result of fitting the kit, so I'd not rule it out, although in principle gear noise normally comes from the teeth and the mod. supplies lube to the shaft.
On or around 25 Nov 2004 14:04:13 GMT, snipped-for-privacy@aol.comknujon (AN6530) enlightened us thusly:
hmmm. I'm not sure if the 230Q was fitted to Defenders, although I'd have expected it to be. Maybe not, as ISTR different ratios, so it might have been disco-specific. I've got PDFs of the relevant manuals, somewhere, 'angon...
aha. 36D and 37D - discovery. 38D and 40D - defender.
"The LT230Q, whilst similar to the LT230T differs mainly in the following areas: Helix angle of gears increased to 31° together with an increase in the number of gear teeth thus giving quieter running and an increase in power transmission efficiency. Increased length mainshaft input gears together with increased thickness bearing housing and repositioned bearing. Redesigned intermediate gear bearings. Redesigned high gear bush giving quieter running."
aha. looking at the LT230T one, it lists "oil feeder plate***" in the parts, where *** is "if fitted".
it don't look like Steve Parker's one, either - wonder if a) it worked or b) it's available?
It looks like it would be obvious if it was installed too. I'd never looked at the pdf for the tbox before now.
I need to get underneath and grease the props so I may take a look at the same time if I get a chance. As mines at 156,000 I guess its either got the cross drilled gear or the oil feeder.
Well I have my fingers crossed on this one. My feeling is that if it can somehow increase the gear oil getting to the teeth, it should reduce the whine. Basically the whine is a harmonic being created by vibrating metal somewhat similar to a brake pad squealing. The oil will hopefully provide some sort of damping to the gear possibly reducing the overall amount of vibration generated. The crossdrilled shaft may also do this, though by just being crossdrilled it should change the base resonant frequency with the weight change.
Of course if it is some other gear in there making the noise, the crossdrilled shaft will do absolutely nothing, as will the SP oil feeder.
I found a dealer who can ship it, and has it in stock, so I will report back probably next friday if I get it by then.
Austin Hi,
I seem to remember reading about the LR made and sold oil feeder in one of the LR magazines (in fact I think it was in the LROI but around in the mide '90's.)
It did have a spare part number of its own but I think it listed as No Longer Available. Most probably it has been superceded by the drilled main gear.
As for the reduction in noise, when I had the SP oil feeder installed on my Discovery (a 1994 200Tdi) it did make a difference on the whining noise from it. It had NOT reduced it totally but there was a noticeable decrease in its level. Maybe it had to do with starting using synthetic gear oil on the same time but even my wife had noted the reduction in noise. (she is mechanicaly knowledgable and has a very good ear on strange LR noises or the lack of them)
Take care Pantelis
On or around Sat, 27 Nov 2004 07:50:07 +0200, "Pantelis Giamarellos" enlightened us thusly:
yebbut, anyone who drives a Land Rover soon develops a discerning ear for changes in the noise level.
Helps with our excellent taste in music I guess !!!!!!!!!!!!! :-)
That's only until the Land Rover induced terminal hearing loss sets in!
Steve. Suffolk. remove 'knujon' to e-mail
Steve parker n' co suggested the noise is from the bearings on the main shaft. This would make sense to me if the oil feeder reduces the noise a bit, but not completely by changing the shaft's resonant frequency. Others have suggest the splines also have something to do with the noise, which also makes sense to me but they would definitely be changed by proper oiling. I am going to try to get some grease back in there on the bearings, but the workshop manual leaves a bit to be desired in terms of how to get the bearings out. It appears there are some bearings on the shaft, which i will re-pack easily enough, and then there are some bearings in the tcase that, well its less than clear what I can do with those. The manual states "Do not remove these bearings at this time". By the time it starts to describe removing them, you should have a thousand peices of tcase all around your garage awaiting you to solve one heck of a heavy jigsaw puzzle.
Oh well, I suppose I should take pictures of this operation and try to add to the rover technical docs out there if it works.
Scot
BTW: is there anything special about the bearings on the shaft? If they are gone, do I need a LR offiicial part or is there a much cheaper workable substitute?
sawdust :O)
Stick it in the main box, watch the car try to engage all forward gears and reverse at the same time.
Don't do this. Please.
P.
Ok since I am sure everyone here is waiting with baited breath. The steve parker mainshaft oil feeder did NOT fix the gear whine. Absolutely no change whatsoever. Neither did repacking the mainshaft's bearings in grease. Be aware, I am not disparaging SP for their unit, as it still supplies oil to the shaft and is still "a good thing" for those of us without the crossdrilled mainshafts. It just does not do anything to remove any noise in my vehicle.
If anyone else has any advice, please let me know. The whine is driving me nuts in the 30mph range.
BTW: The mainshaft bearing keeper was "stuck" on in my case because the service people working on the truck before I purchased must have taken the PTO cover off for an inspection, and decided some RTV was just as good as the proper gasket. Once I broke it free from that, it came off.
Scot
Scot Hi,
sorry to hear that you have not had a reduction in noise. But 30 mph sounds a bit slow as a speed to have so much noise generated from the Tbox.
Have you also checked your automatic gearbox and front/rear axles?
What type of gear oil are you using in your Tbox and axles?
Take care Pantelis
The noise is directly related to vehicle speed and not gearing so I doubt it is the transmission related. It could of course be either diff, but the sound appears to definitely be coming from the passenger side floor. It begins at about 15mph, by 30-40mph it is fairly loud, I would estimate 80db or so, maybe a bit louder, and somewhere around 8000hz. As the vehicle goes faster, and under load, the sound will increase to about 12khz but not get much louder at 50mph, by 60mph the sound goes up to about 13khz, but the amplitude drops dramatically and it can barely be heard any more.
Tcase/Diffs are all using 75w90 Mobile 1 synthetic gear lube. Synthetic ATF in the transmission. Fluid levels are all correct. All fluid is brand new.
Scot
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