New car suggestions

You appear to be able to pick the worst possible cars! Do you have *any* taste or automotive knowledge?

The message from "Darren Jarvis" contains these words:

I got an L-reg Audi 100 2.5TDI Auto a few weeks ago for less than that. The only thing it hasn't got in your list is air-con but at that age it often gets unreliable anyway. Does over 40mpg if I'm nice to it, and goes reasonably fast if I'm not.

Wouldn't touch any with a bargepole, you've even chosen the worst Scorpios (IMO).

If you want a good towcar, then you /might/ find a 2.3 Scorpio Ultima Estate for £1500 which will have A/C and so forth, 30mpg is more like 'possible' than 'average' though. Automatics, for a towcar, are your friend at this age.

My gf has said she'd sell hers for that, but I won't let her (it's a 98R and they're £3K asking in Autotrader).

Tell you what, though - if you want a real laugh, and can scrape together another £1,000 and fancy fixing a head gasket potentially, I'll sell you a 1999 Subaru Legacy Outback 2.5 - it can, just, average 30mpg, had a new clutch 20,000 miles ago, and has a dual range gearbox. It's got a coolant leak though, which the garage has suggested is an external leak at the head gasket (and it's a common fault with them).

£7K+ in Autotrader, though I've seen a couple of the same shape ones for about £6K.

My honest, sensible suggestion, is that you want a 1994 Subaru Legacy

2.2GX, which can be found with A/C, £1,500 will get a damn good one, and the dual range box makes them excellent towing cars.

If you want a coupe (Rover 220 mentioned) - look for a 1991 or so Toyota Supra 3.0i Auto.

Alternatively, drop some age - I reckon a 1990-ish BMW 320/325i Touring Automatic would be a fantastic car for your needs.

Here's the order in which I'd consider your shortlist:

Ford Scorpio 2.5TD Rover 620 diesel Rover 825 diesel (if it's on a P-plate) Ford Scorpio 2.0i (but the 2.0i is pretty crap. 2.3 is vastly superior) Rover 420 diesel (bubble shape) Rover 820 vitesse Rover 220 coupe (slightly more than I can afford but it looks very nice) Rover 416 tourer Vauxhall Frontera 2.0i (for £1,500 it's going to be a dog, they were new, and 30mpg? No chance) Suzuki Vitara JLX-SE 1.6i estate (you want to TOW?! With that? And they also struggle to do 30mpg on the motorway).

2.0 doesn't always mean economy. I used to get 33mpg in my 2.9 Granada Scorpio (12v) auto estate, compared with the 27mpg I get in the much newer 2.3.

Richard

It might be kinda important to know the weight of the caravan The Vitesse has got to be a non starter

Looks like I can forget the 4x4s then and insurance quotes on the coupes are >£400 TPFT. However the 820 Vitesse Sport Lux weighs in about fifty quid more than my 620 diesel which was surprising. I actually meant the original Granada Scorpio 2.0i. My uncle had a H-plate 2.0i auto Ghia which did nearly 40mpg on the motorway according to the computer, and my B-reg 2.8i Scorpio managed over 30mpg using cruise - a pity the rear arches rot so badly.

I do like the Rover L-series diesel engine so was considering another 600 but the one I've got has put me off (rust holes on an N-reg!?); I've no idea how the new 400s will compare in quality. I also like the 800 series but find them a little narrow and basic (my previous 2.0 auto Sterling didn't have even have cruise, none of them have a computer and it also did about

24mpg), though they are much cheaper than the same age Granada/Scorpio and usually in better condition. I believe the same diesel engine is used in the 800 as the Scorpio (an Italian VM), though Parkers shows the 800 as being more economical.

For comfort, toys and economy I'd like a Scorpio,but IME Rover bodywork seems to be much better with the exception of my current 620. Mind you, in the paper there is a dealer offering an M-reg 1.8TD Escort with "long MOT" for £195 so I may just save my money and buy another banger to run until it's MOT expires or it falls apart...

Darren

Might be worth a look, though I've not previously been a fan of German cars (certainly not the ones I've been in - the newer Golf seems mostly well thought out but is too small and out of my price range).

Darren

Christ, how many miles are you doing in this second car?

Richard

In news:NWrme.2263$ snipped-for-privacy@newsfe2-win.ntli.net, MrGrumpy decided to enlighten our sheltered souls with a rant as follows

No point in trying to tow with a car that doesn't start.

It's like trying to make a useful point on Usenet by top posting.

Aaargh!

I've got the manual version. Looks nice enough (I think, anyway) but no torque as such, and pathetic space inside for such a big (1500kg) car. Wouldn't be a good tow car at all.

Before this I had a Carlton GSi (3.0 24V) - same weight, same rated BHP, much much more torque, higher top end (not that I ever went over 70...), 5 adult sized seats and a boot you could put a Micra in.

The *only* thing the Supra does better is go round corners. Like it's on rails.

Wish I'd never got rid of the Carlton though.

It's really a weekend car which can cope with towing, though it will get used during the week as well. At the moment I have been out the office every day since April but that's not guaranteed to be the case every day so I don't want anything that does much less than 30mpg. As I'm also selling my bike I'm estimating 8-9K miles/year.

Darren

The caravan weighs about 900Kg so even a 1.4i could cope with it though not very well. Not sure why towing would rule out the Vitesse - at 60mph (ahem) towing 900Kg it shouldn't be a problem surely?

Darren

I have no taste whatsoever, but still I'd recommend the best thing to do with a car with a 'Rover' badge is to either sell it or turn your back on it. Better still, recycle it!

Slight possibilities for the Scorpio, but only if you like feeting the monster petrol! The Frontera will steal your wallet - it may share the engine with a Vectra, but the aerodynamics and gearing are different, resulting in circa 22mpg.

Artie

The message from "Darren Jarvis" contains these words:

Oh, and it was an estate, too.

Actually the vitesse (turbo) has a lower allowed load than a manual nasp, I'm not entirely sure why, however any would be fine for a 900kg load (assuming its braked)

800 Series Max Towing Weights:

820 Models w/manual transmission: Braked Trailer (all models except turbo) .... 1550 kg Braked Trailer (turbo) ............ 1025 kg Unbraked Trailer ........ 500 kg

820 Models w/auto transmission: Braked Trailer ........ 1025 kg Unbraked Trailer ...... 500 kg

825/827 & Sterling models: Braked Trailer** ........ 1550 kg Unbraked Trailer ...... 500 kg

Maximum towing hitch downward load ..... 70 kg

**On auto transmission models, an auxiliary fluid cooler must be fitted if the towing weight is to exceed 1000 kg

Hth

Well that makes it even more attractive - sounds like you got a bargain.

Darren

How about a Citroen? Despite what others here may tell you I have had no problems (no big ones) with the 3 I've owned and the suspension should make them reasonable tow cars. The best one I had was an XM which was their equivalent of the Granada although they had the worst reputation for reliability.

That's interesting, the 800 user manual says the 2.0 engine with manual box is good for 1550 and the auto1025 as you say, but there's no mention of any difference between the turbo and standard...

Darren

To tell the truth I have considered them (including the XM) and I do like the suspension, though there are two main reasons I probably wouldn't buy one:

1) Friend of mine has an XM and swears by Citroen (especially the older ones - he's always going on about how wonderful the DS was) and has had nothing else for many years. However he's always having to do something or other to them and they seem to forever be leaking LHM. I also can't stand the handbrake (sorry, parking brake) arrangement in the XM! 2) I swore to friend above that I'd *never* deliberately buy a Citroen. I'd never hear the end of it if I did...

Darren

P.S.

A guy at work bought a Xantia estate a few weeks back. We had a look under the bonnet and was baffled. His older ZX (which he's trying to flog me but it's really beaten up) was much simpler and used the same engine as my last Rover.

So are you going to qualify that statement or not?

Darren