Sniff Sniff, Whatcha got there boy?

That's my point. And it's been my experience, too. Just take the car apart yourself, and don't involve the law. Why take the chance? The odds are against it helping you IMO. Your motive is automatically suspect. I did back off and say it could possibly be paranoia, but on the whole, just why risk it? No exposure to them at all is the best way...

SVTKate opined in news:ap%Pd.30$ snipped-for-privacy@newsread3.news.atl.earthlink.net:

And 80 to 90 percent of the time, you would be right. but if you want to gamble on those type of odds, go to the nearest casino and play the slots.

I didnt "make up" my little nightmare scenario.

My brother was driving his van in a neighborhood of Dayton OH that he rarely traveled and was stopped for an "inoperative taillight" (classic).

Before he knew it, he and his van was being searched and while they found nothing in the van, they found a little in his shirt pocket. Van confiscated.

He got off with essentially a one year probation.. but he hired a lawyer to get the van back.. and thought he was being smart by hiring one that specialized in the field. Said lawyer told him he had a good chance to beat the grab but kept stalling the process. At the time i worked for Lexis and found several cases on point. One that was almost exactly the same. All where the search was upheld.

I told him that and he said.. naw, this guy actually trained the cops in how to do the stop and search. I just shook my head.

Brother has friends on the police in suburb where he lives and after he wised up, had one check out the van. Seems the van was now registered to the brother of the cop that stopped him.

So, my advice stands... either call a friend or relative in the justice system or go to the local big paper and have their reporter with you.

The system has always worked for me.

I have had a lot of experience with the law. Mostly either through family relation or growing up in a neighborhood full of CHP. And the list goes on. I have never known a cop who would conbemn you for the very reason that you DON'T want any surprises out of the car.

Yea but it was HIS WEED! HE was in posession of his own accord and knowing full well that he was in violation of the law.

Stop for just one second. First, I have to say I am PRO pot. I think that the ;aws against it are BS

Ok, back on my soapbox. Sam's scenario is completely different. He is trying to abide by the law and keep himself out of trouble.

Another point. Why take the car apart if you dont have to? They never go back together as tight as factory.

Kate

| | And 80 to 90 percent of the time, you would be right. but if you want to | gamble on those type of odds, go to the nearest casino and play the slots. | | I didnt "make up" my little nightmare scenario. | | My brother was driving his van in a neighborhood of Dayton OH that he rarely | traveled and was stopped for an "inoperative taillight" (classic). | | Before he knew it, he and his van was being searched and while they found | nothing in the van, they found a little in his shirt pocket. Van confiscated. | | He got off with essentially a one year probation.. but he hired a lawyer to | get the van back.. and thought he was being smart by hiring one that | specialized in the field. Said lawyer told him he had a good chance to beat | the grab but kept stalling the process. | At the time i worked for Lexis and found several cases on point. One that | was almost exactly the same. | All where the search was upheld. | | I told him that and he said.. naw, this guy actually trained the cops in how | to do the stop and search. I just shook my head. | | Brother has friends on the police in suburb where he lives and after he wised | up, had one check out the van. | Seems the van was now registered to the brother of the cop that stopped him. | | So, my advice stands... either call a friend or relative in the justice | system or go to the local big paper and have their reporter with you. | | | | | -- | - Yes, I'm a crusty old geezer curmudgeon.. deal with it! -

SVTKate opined in news:EbbQd.841$ snipped-for-privacy@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net:

You STILL dont get the point, kate!!!!

As I said, it PROBABLY would work out ok.. but WHAT IF A COP WANTED THAT CAR?!!!!

Would you go outside the house if you thought there was a 10% chance you'd lose your car? I put my finger in the wind and i really think it may be that high.

And note the lawyer who kept collecting from my brother when he KNEW the plea had no chance!

Yet, I'm the one who makes stupid remarks according to you.

No, you were correct. THat was exactly what I was going to say. Call and make an appointment to get the car checked out. It might be fun to have the info on the previous owner as well :p

Two hours passed... Buzz just wore off eh?

Sunset Sam wrote:

Yep. It's just 'legalized' theivery. They get around constitutional protections by charging the property with a crime. The vehicle has no constitutional protection.

Another thing is having large sums of cash. If the cop thinks it's from the drug trade he takes it and then you have to prove at great cost it's not.

It's the war on the bill of rights sold as protecting children from the evil drugs.

Ok BM, I get your point.

Here's why.

When I was in town yesterday I actually considered going down to the local cop shop and asking them about this You know... "I have a friend that... and there is a difference of opinion" and all that.

What stopped me from doing it is the *what if* factor.

What IF they got suspicious, what IF they decided I was up to no good and what IF they decided to check me out. and what IF I just happened to have some pot at my house when they did come check me out.

So, I chickened out.

Now, if I were't a child of the 70's and never ever had anything to fear, I would go there. Since none of the above is true, then I still think "what if"

As far as the laws about them confiscating people's property. I lived in CA when those were passed. I was completely against the laws and agree with you completely. It is legal theft. For a guy to lose his vehicle over a coupla joints is so incredibly wrong that there are not words. Same thing goes for people losing their houses and so on. God forbid you should have a joint and a gun in the same house.

Anyway.. just wanted you to know that I DO understand.

Kate

| | You STILL dont get the point, kate!!!! | | As I said, it PROBABLY would work out ok.. but WHAT IF A COP WANTED THAT | CAR?!!!! | | Would you go outside the house if you thought there was a 10% chance you'd | lose your car? I put my finger in the wind and i really think it may be that | high. | | And note the lawyer who kept collecting from my brother when he KNEW the plea | had no chance! | | | -- | - Yes, I'm a crusty old geezer curmudgeon.. deal with it! -

Here is my take on the whole thing....

1. We often had our dogs check out people's cars at their request. Good training for the dogs. Many departments did this. Even pre-sale checks. All based on availability of a dog. You can't tie up the dog totally doing these checks because we could only work the dogs a set amount of time per day, per shift.

1. We had a form to complete to show that the car had been inspected by us, what was found, etc, that the individual could leave in the car in case of a future stop.

2. If the stuff was personal stash you are gonna have seeds, and other residue in the car, especially in the carpeting between the seats, where the smoke permeates the upholstery, and where it gets on the glass, etc. You can not get rid of it, you can't mask it effectively. (Like a car which contained a dead body... it's there forever.)

1. On a hot day, just as with tobacco, the odor will hit a cop or dog pretty quick.

2. As for hiding places, any place there is space. air cleaners, heat/AC ducts, under sill plates, false mufflers, headliners, and even the stuffing in the seats. Generally, personal use situations, it's where the user has easy access... and some get so wasted that in plain sight is just right.

1. If there is a question about the department you would use, call first, anonymously, and inquire if they have such a program. I never heard of a department busting someone who brought the stuff in to them. Like who would be that stupid... or wasteful. We saw parents bring in baggies a lot. We didn't bust them, and we didn't go after their kids. (we would try to learn where it came from.)

2. If still worried, see a lawyer first.

1. So many vehicles have been used for smuggling (a large number of those government sale cars for example) or the owners have smoked (though not inhaled) weed in their cars, that I am sure a very large number would result in dog alerts. A good defense lawyer might use this as a defense. You just can't clean a vehicle good enough to get rid of it all.

2. What most do not realize, in ever stack of green in the USA, whether in a bank drawer, a wallet, a purse, etc, you can "almost" guarantee that there is some residue of drugs or narcotics which would show up in a chemical test, or be detected by a dog.

1. And, there are various items which will alert a dog, but are totally >SVTKate wrote:

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Believe it or not, we have a LOT of humor!!!! Emergency services workers generally do. Ever watch MASH? It's very much like that, only worse. It's our way of self defense against the stuff we have to deal with. Wanna see cops with humor? Check out a station house when one day the cops find marijuana plants growing in the dirt behind the station.... Quite often, we laugh at the stupidity of the human race... kinda like going to a bar (off duty) and watching the drunks stumble around.

Way too many people are paranoid about the cops. They forget that we are human beings.

As for the baggie... flush it.... of course, there will very likely be residue of some type in the car so if you get stopped and a dog checks the car, you are still in a bind trying to explain it then as opposed to now.

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Heh, where are you located? I'm not a cop, but my dog is trained for narcotics detection. If youre nearby and dont care about dog hair everywhere, I can search your car in about 30 seconds. If I find any weed tho, can I have it? Its not for me, its for, um, a friend.

My final point(s)

I am charged with enforcing the laws regarding pot, even though I am not anti-pot. In all my years of enforcement, I never had to physically fight with a pot smoker (providing that's all they were doing). But drunks, meth users, and their ilk, it's almost always physical from the git go. Might not have to fight them, but nearly always have to manhandle them.

I may like a suspects car (and indeed, I have seen many I would like to have had) but I am not going to violate my own integrity to bust someone so their car will be confiscated. Heck, I don't even agree with those who confiscate a car jointly owned because one party committed a crime in it. That is unfairly punishing the other owner who may have had no idea.

I have never personally seen or heard of a situation where we went after an individual who turned in contraband (including weapons). If the citizen stated it was found we accepted that it was. Yes we did a short report to account for it's sudden appearance in the evidence locker. But we didn't even require the citizen to give us their name.

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I'm glad you checked in Spike. I was already leaning toward dong it, and now after reading your comments I'm pretty sure I will. I'd say what I found under the boot was just personal stash because it was a small amount. The car was detailed pretty well before I bought it, but I imagine there will probably be some residue somewhere. The only thing that now holds me back is if the dog finds too many "false alarm" spots, and we end up having to dismantle them all, and there not be anything there anyway. Could end up being a chore! I appreciate everyone's input on this matter. You all made good points! There were a few situations mentioned that I'm sure were extreme exceptions to the rule, and it's too bad those kinds of things do happen. I'll probably see if there are any dogs available soon(Askin' for trouble with that comment, lol!) and I'll post the results.

You trained your dog to find it for you?

I must say, that's very creative. No need to quietly ask around anymore. Just take the dog for a walk.

JS

From your description, I suspect it was only a personal stash, and, generally, you don't find more than one personal stash. Why? Because they know that if the first is found, the cops are gonna look harder all over. So why bother to hide a second. Also, the individual income is often sparse ('cause ya know what they spend it on: ) so affording a spare stash to sit around and go bad is a waste. I have never seen a detailer get really down into the creases and crevasses. Remember, a dogs nose is several thousand times more sensitive than the human nose (depends on breed). A good dog, like a German Sheppard or a Bloodhound can detect a couple of seeds and stems. And usually, the tricks used by smugglers (and not normally used by personal users) simply do not fool the well trained dog...... although a good roast beef sand which might some times... LOL.... I KNOW it would me.... : )

False detects? I personally wouldn't worry. A good handler, and few poor ones last long because they lose their respect in court, knows the difference between a solid alert and a false alert in his dog. Unless you have a real reason to suspect the cops of being out to get you personally (like they have had run ins with you before...they haven't have they?) it's null.

By the way, I was serious about those government sale vehicles. Go to an auction and you might find a cheap Lambroghini or whatever.... in boxes. Stuff gets hidden everywhere.

And cops laughing? I supered an airline baggage inspection once where the baggage had to be open and set in a circle. If the dog alerted, it pushed the bag out of the circle. The dog was working. Each time it went around the circle it hit on this one bag of a VERY well dressed passenger.... but it didn't push the bag out of the circle. Still, we thought we had us a good one and we were ready to make the bust.... The third time around, it jumped up on the open bag and dropped a very loose load all over the guys expensive suits. I had to quickly make my way out of the room because my laughter would have been totally un-professional. So did the rest of my team... except the poor dog handler. The guy got brand new suits. Some days ya just never know....

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Precisely!