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91 900 wont start

Hi Thanks in advance for any suggestions, I have searched through past messages and havent found anything helpful to my case

turn the key and the dash lights come on slowly and dimly, turn to start, nothing, lights go out, will no longer start with a boost turn key to on, turn on headlights and dash lights fade

Car : 91 saab 900 2.1 litre battery voltage is 12.75

has been not starting lately ( bought it 3 months ago, always seemed to turn over slowly), every few days would need to take a boost and start I have a 100 amp booster/ battery charger that i used to boost previously and it worked, hasn't now though, although the dash lights get nice and bright

Started looking at cables and positive cable to starter solenoid was frayed and corroded a bit, about 2 inches before it joined starter

replaced cable with canadian tire 61 inch cable, has not started since Here's the kicker, when replacing the positive cable back to battery, wrench slipped and bounced off sidewall of engine compartment, sparked a bit. - probably fried something there and caused current(pardon the pun ) problem

previously to replacing cable, would start with a boost, all dash lights came on fine, just turned slowly when starting, there was no parasitic drain, I remove the neg cable clamp to battery and tested there was .3 amps when nothing was running, apparently acceptable

I thought it may be the solenoid, replaced it, while I had the start out, did a bench test with old solenoid and it spun the starter, replaced solenoid any way, as it was out and I had already paid for it!

read more stuff on the web ( Haynes book is on order, wont be in for another 2 weeks ) tested terminal 50 on solenoid, connected to terminal

50 spade connector, (not term. 50 itself) got 5 volts when key was turned to start, apparently thats too low

I have tested that I have good voltage at solenoid, also tested resistance of new cable, 0 at bracket that pos cable connects to tested resistance of negative cable to bolt on engine, 0, tested resistance of neg cable to rad cross member ground, also 0, but looks like had antifreeze dripping on it, so I removed the bolt and wire brushed all cable ends and re attached.

-should mention also that I thought I would double check both pos and neg connections and put a booster cable jump between the battery and the solenoid, no effect, tried same with other pos cable to where it connects, and tried both negative connections, checking if the cables were ok by jumping over them with booster cables, no effect I believe the cables from battery are ok

I connected a voltmeter to battery, like I say 12.75 ish volts, when I turn the key to start, it drop to 5 ish volts, returns to 12.75 when I release key

Questions, Is there a fusible link somewhere? How do I trouble shoot the ignition system, is there a relay somewhere I could test? or other component? How do I trouble shoot the key setup itself, where and what ( and how) do I test for the voltage drop? I ran out and bought a dig multimeter a while back, has 10 amp unfused capacity, dc volts and resistance

I am guessing the drop to 5 volts from battery when turning the key to start is a short or a failed component, any thoughts? I also assume this is not normal, but couldnt find a voltage recommendation when key is turned

Previously when the car was running I put voltmeter on when running, no accessories, 13.8, dropped to 13.3 when all accessories where turned on, it seemed to have problems when we ran all, rear defrost, wipers, defrost fan, etc while driving, needed a boost more frequently.

Did have a problem when first got it, turned the key and the starter stayed engaged, key did not return, ran engine for a few minutes with starter engaged, SRS light started blinking after that and still does, since then have been careful to ease the key back from start position after it starts. (shutting that off would be nice as well, but not a major concern return)

Whew, sorry for telling my entire life story, but want to narrow it down as much as possible Any suggestion what else to test? Please cc my email as well as the newsgroup so I can get it quicker, I check that several times daily

snipped-for-privacy@hotmail.com

remove the spam filter, of course

Pat

Reply to
Pat Noonan
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SRS blinking was caused by a battery voltage dip. It needs to be reset in the shop.

How old is the battery? Is it possible your battery is not holding charge. You should know the booster does nothing to charge the battery.

Reply to
yaofengchen

Yah, the battery is old, but it is a battery charger and a booster, I have charged the battery with it as well, but it wouldnt turn over with a boost either

I thought the problem was the battery a while ago, and switched the battery out of my tempo to try it, no difference Thanks, Pat

Reply to
Pat Noonan

You need a new battery

Reply to
Yo

Most likely. Wouldn't hurt to check the terminals though for corrosion, and put it on a charger overnight. Could be the battery is dead because the dome or glovebox light stayed on or the alternator isn't charging rather than just being worn out.

Reply to
James Sweet

Were it the battery, it would turn over with a boost, which it doesnt. the battery is at 12.75 volts, it is charged up I tested the boosting with my battery charger/booster, and also with one of those portable boosters that is essentially a battery with cables attached, no turn over either the cables and post have been cleaned, at the battery, and at the other ends, Thanks for the suggestions Pat

Reply to
Pat Noonan

What's the voltage at the starter? Measure it both there and at the battery while cranking. If it drops substantially at the battery then you have either a bad starter or a bad battery (I've seen them bad enough that even a charger isn't enough to help) and if it holds up there but drops at the starter then you have a bad cable.

Reply to
James Sweet

stuffed with wild rice. Or keep it simple with a hearty main course such as stew, lasagna, or meat loaf.

Some suggestions

Pre-mie pot pies, beef stew, leg of lamb, stuffed chicken, roast pork spiral ham, Cranberry pineapple salad, sweet potatoes in butter, vegetable platter, tossed salad with tomato and avocado, parsley new potatoes, spinich cucumber salad, fruit salad Bran muffins, dinner rolls, soft breadsticks, rice pilaf, croissants Apple cake with rum sauce, frosted banana nut bread sherbet, home made brownies Iced tea, water, beer, bloody marys, lemonade, coffee

The guests select food, beverages, silverware... everything from the buffet table. They move to wherever they are comfortable, and sit with whoever they choose. Provide trays so your guests will not spill everything all over your house from carrying too much, nor will they have to make 10 trips back and fourth from the service stations.

Roast Leg of Amputee

By all means, substitute lamb or a good beef roast if the haunch it is in any way diseased. But sometimes surgeons make mistakes, and if a healthy young limb is at hand, then don?t

Reply to
James Sweet

Meat is not necessary every day, don?t be afraid to alter any dish to vegetarian tastes.

1 premature baby, born dead Large bunch of mustard greens 2 white onions, 1 cup chopped celery Vegetable oil (or hog fat) Salt, pepper, garlic, etc.

Lightly brown onions, celery, garlic and meat in large heavy pot. Add a little water and the greens (which should be thoroughly cleaned and washed). Smother slowly for at least 2 hours, adding small amounts of water when it starts to stick. Stir frequently. When ready - serve with rice, grilled smoked sausage, green salad, and iced tea. Coffee and apple pie then brandy.

Maternity Ward Pot Luck Dinner

If you can?t get anything fresh from the hospital, nursery, or morgue; you can at least get rid of all the leftovers in your refrigerator.

1 - 2 lbs. cubed meat (human flesh, chicken, turkey, beef...) 1 -2 lbs. coarsely chopped vegetables (carrots, potatoes, turnips, cauliflower, cabbage...) Bell pepper onions garlic ginger salt pepper, etc. Olive oil butter

Brown the meat and some chopped onions, peppers, and garilic in olive oil, place in baking dis

Reply to
Pat Noonan

That's an interesting diagnosis. on what are you basing your opinion, please?

Dave Hinz

Reply to
Dave Hinz

Seemed like a pretty reasonable diagnosis to me, it's similar to what I've experienced with a very flat battery, turn on a load and the battery will sometimes "wake up" a little, but any serious load (like the starter motor) will cause them to go out.

Reply to
James Sweet

Sure, it's the sign of a low battery, but is that the _cause_, or a symptom of the real problem? I'd go over the charging system, and check for parasitic load before buying another battery. Only thing worse than killing a battery with another problem is killing a second, brand-new one.

Dave Hinz

Reply to
Dave Hinz

------------snip---------------

Hinch:

The only "parasitic load" as far as I can see comes only from the depths of your head. Go back to bed, dork.

Reply to
Barabas

Yeah that's something I commented on too, but a new battery is the place to start if the old one is too dead to take a charge, then one needs to measure the current draw with everything off and then check the voltage with the engine running. Only tool required is a cheap DMM.

Reply to
James Sweet

Is Ohio really _that_ boring?

Parasitic load, put in language that _you_ can understand, means "Check to make sure there's nothing that isn't turning off when you turn off the key". Common suspects include power antenna if fitted, power seat belts if fitted, and so on. An ammeter and selective pulling of fuses is helpful in diagnosing this condition.

Dave Hinz

Reply to
Dave Hinz

But, he could do that with the old, mostly-dead battery, right? We can get voltage on it, just not current capacity. Voltage is all we need for this test, we don't need the 600 cold cranking amps or whatever.

...unless the car draws more than the 2 Amps the fuse in the DMM blows at. Been there, done that. On my '88 900 Turbo, it was the "mouse belts". But, with a supply of those fuses, that _is_ one way to check which circuit the load is on; pull all the fuses (note where they go!), put them back in one at a time, and when the AMM shows a jump in current (or the fuse pops), that's the problem circuit.

Fun times...

Dave Hinz

Reply to
Dave Hinz

Hmm, my DMM has a 10A range, but then it wasn't cheap. If it's drawing more than 2A with everything off though something is wrong.

Reply to
James Sweet

I would suggest 2A, or 20 Watts, is too much to support a clock, radio memory, etc. More like 500 mA.

Reply to
Misterbeets

Interesting. Is it using a sampling resistor, or is that actual direct measurement of current? Got a model number? I need something like that _just_ often enough that it might be worth getting.

I've seen it where a C900 that was turned off, drew enough current to produce an audible and visible spark when the battery ground cable was disconnected or reconnected. I think that was an automatic antenna that was stuck in the mostly-parked position, so it wouldn't turn off the motor, but the motor couldn't turn.

Dave Hinz

Reply to
Dave Hinz

Right, but if you're troubleshooting a parasitic load, chances are there's something wrong, and that's just when you'll have more than the

2A of current. I'm just trying to save someone the surprise of blowing their last fuse.
Reply to
Dave Hinz

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