[Saab_c9000] Saab C9000 SuperSwede's in Australia?

Hi everyone,
Following on from Clifford Bernard's SuperSwede being offered for sale via Ebay recently, it has started me wondering just how many of these unique
Saab 9000's made it to Australia, and apart from Cliff's (which is a beautiful car and I wish I had $10k to buy it!) what happened to the others.
So far nobody seems to know. Myself and a few other people have posed this question in the Saab C9000 web-forums at:
http://www.saab900classic.net/phpBB2/index.php?c=3
and hopefully we'll eventually track down one or more of the other SuperSwede's in Australia and gather some info about their history. I've set up a skeletal web page on the SuperSwede because it's such a unique car (much like the Saab C900 Enduro was back in 1981) at:
http://www.saab900classic.net/superswede.html
which will be updated with more info and pictures in the next few days.
In the meantime if you're interested in Cliff's SuperSwede, the Ebay listing is at:
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&itemq77636405&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT
Regards,
Craig.
--
Craig's Saab C9000 Page - http://lios.apana.org.au/~c9000 - Sydney Australia
Craig's Saab C900 Workshop -- For all Saab C900/C9000 Enthusiasts world-wide!
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Craig,
Excellent! A C9000 page!
Are you enjoying all of the Saab videos on the Saab video site that I posted in here yesterday?
SG

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&itemq77636405&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT
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in article mailman.3.1124837321.582.saab snipped-for-privacy@lios.apana.org.au, Craig's Saab C9000 Site at snipped-for-privacy@lios.apana.org.au wrote on 23/08/2005 23:48:

Now if I didn't know what an enormous venture maintaining a "special editions" website would be, I might be inclined to start a site dedicated to SAAB 9000 special models and start with this car! :)
Great looker and this one, particularly, is in excellent condition. The older-style 9000 with body kit looks sooo evil, but in a good way :)
Paul
1989 900 Turbo S http://saab.go.dyndns.org /
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Craig's Saab C9000 Site wrote:

http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&itemq77636405&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT
Nice C9000 site, but please correct some inaccuracies. You write:
"Saab's C9000 (ie. 'Classic' 9000) family of cars was produced between 1985 and 1992 as a joint-partnership between Saab and Fiat, Lancia, and Alfa-Romeo. In 1990 Saab became part of General Motors (everyone has a different view about why and how this occured!), and GM initiated a complete re-design of both the 900-series and the 9000-series. The 'next generation' 9000's were released in 1993, and the redesigned 900's were released a year later in 1994.(refer to the note below)"
The 9000 wasn't re-designed in the same way as the 900. The 9000CS used the same basic design and platform, nothing to do with GM. The changes to the 9000 were mainly styling changes front and rear. Hence it's false to distinguish the C9000 as a Classic 9000 in the same way as the C900.
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Johannes,
Regardless, it is terrific to finally have a C9000 page.
It is long overdue
SG

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Saab Guy wrote:

But the 9000CS is not a GM model as is implied on the site. In fact, Haynes manual is titled: Saab 9000 1985-1998, thus indicating the mechanical continuity of the range. It is far from a "complete re-design" by GM as suggested on the site. I doubt very much that GM was involved at all in the 9000CS, apart from buying a share stake in the company.
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Johannes wrote:

Indeed - the changes are really quite minor - it's a facelift, similar to that which was carried out on the C900 in 1988.
--
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On Wed, 24 Aug 2005 13:23:21 +0100

So, this means that in 2006/2007 the 9-5 will be the C9-5
SG
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Saab Guy wrote:

Possibly. I think GM has a very different rear wheel drive car in mind.
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On Wed, 24 Aug 2005 16:00:54 GMT

Jonannes,
Right, the rear from the spy shots looks BMWish
SG
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On Wed, 24 Aug 2005 16:04:28 GMT

So here is the Historical Timeline for the 900 and 900.
The years may vary depending on country
I believe the years indicated below are internationally accepted
1979-1994 (C900) - Classic 900 1994-1998 (NG) - New Generation 900 1999-2001 9-3
1984-1992 (C9000) - Classic 9000 1993-1998 (NG9K) - New Generation 9000 1997-2005 (C9-5) - Classic 9-5 2006-? (NG9-5) - New Generation 9-5
SG
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Saab Guy wrote:

These are obviously not Saab's own descriptions, so I can't see this having some kind of international status. They may be convenient labels for the purpose of discussion, but NG9K is not a label I would want to see in general use when there is already the CS/CSE labels. But that's just IMO.
The C900 and NG900 are very different cars, whereas C9000 and CS are not. The NG900 are build on a platform shared with GM Opel cars at the time, whereas the CS carries on with the same platform as C9000. This platform was superficially shared with Type 4 cars, but Saab used their own Panhard rod rear suspension. The CS was a facelifted C9000, unlike the NG900 which was a completely different car from C900. As said, Haynes manual is titled 'Saab 9000 1985-1998', indicating the mechanical continuity of the range. There is no merit in distinguishing the CS as a different creation, the difference is cosmetic. Some people like the C9000, others think the CS looks cleaner. It's a matter of taste.
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On Wed, 24 Aug 2005 17:00:56 GMT

Johannes,
I completely agree with you, and I'm sure others do but..
that means that if you are saying "same platform" then there is no NG that can be applied.
It's almost like saying that the Pontiac GrandAm is A Saab 9-3 SS, saying that there really is no different "Since" they are on the same platform, and I disagree, there are enough changes.
I mean, if we line up the last year C9000 (1992) with a 1993 CS, they LOOK different, and there were some changes with the engine, etc. The entire rear was redone, even though it is technically on the same platform.
SG
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Saab Guy wrote:

there really is no different "Since" they are on the same platform, and I disagree, there are enough changes.

different, and there were some changes with the engine, etc. The entire rear was redone, even though it is technically on the same platform.

But then you can use the CS/CSE labels for the facelifted models. There has been engine variations (the same block) over the entire model life 1985-1998, not just for the 1993 model.
Secondly, in case of the 900, the 'Classic' tag was introduced because the car's unique styling and mechanical principles. That made it a classic, whereas the NG900 is much more a mainstream (ordinary) car. Note that 'Classic' is used as a special word with special meaning, not just a label. Since all 9000 are similar, they are much more likely to share the same status as potential 'Classic' cars; this should not be reserved for 1985-1992 models. Whether a car is can be termed 'Classic' depends on how it stands out from the crowd. It's also indicated by the secondhand prices of well kept models. The 9000 is a very well designed and build car, but secondhand bargains, so the jury is still out.
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snipped-for-privacy@yahoo.com says...

No it isn't, nor is it like saying a Saab 9000 (either CC or CS/CD) ia an Alfa 164, or a Lancia Thema, or a Fit Tempra.
A Saab 9000 whether in the CC early model, or the Later split CD and CS based models is no different. It is an Evolution rather than a rebirth.
The C900 is a totally different animal to the NG/GM900 and the C9-3 (yes this applies), because the GM900 and the C9-3 are based on the Cavalier/Vectra platforms and share a body shell shape, where as the C900, only has a similar engine to the others, but a near unique engine/transmission layout that it only shares with the 99. Remember different body shells and design tweaks is a Saab standard.
Saab 99 3 and 5 door hatch and 2 and 4 door sedan/saloon. Saab C900 in 3 and 5 door hatch, 2 and 4 door saloon/sedan and 2 door convertable NG/GM 900 sam Saab 9000 CD 4 door Saloon, and CC/CS 5 door hatch with facelift.     
--
Carl Robson
Car PC Build starts again. http://smallr.com/rz
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I think that the timeline splits are pretty much universally accepted in Saab enthusiast circles, but yes they're not Saab's own definitions and I bet that GM is even less keen to see distinctions made between model changes introduced since they took over the company.
However, it's a lot easier to distinguish the models using the most common terminology, particularly when chatting amongst other enthusiasts.

But the fact remains, IMHO anyway, that the pre-1993 and the 1993+ 9000's are different in ways that do distinguish them as being seperate build series. They're not a totally different car like the C900's and NG/GM900's, but they are different in body styling, and other areas as well. If it was simply just a body style change, then there would be plenty of contention for saying the two builds of the 9000's were not different enough to be given seperate 'enthusiast titles'.
Regards,
Craig.
--
Craig's Saab C9000 Page - http://lios.apana.org.au/~c9000 - Sydney Australia
Craig's Saab C900 Workshop -- For all Saab C900/C9000 Enthusiasts world-wide!
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On Fri, 26 Aug 2005 00:56:26 +0000 (UTC)

Here, here!
By the way, do you know of Mr. Wade from trollhattensaab.net, your fellow Saab Enthusiast also from Australia?
SG
out our web-forums, mailing list, etc.
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Can't say this I do know that person, but I could well have met him if he was one of the people at the last SCCA NSW branch event last month...
Craig.
--
Craig's Saab C900 Page --> http://lios.apana.org.au/~c900 Sydney, NSW Australia
Craig's Saab C900 Workshop -- For all Saab C900 Enthusiasts world-wide!
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Craig's Saab C9000 Site wrote:

Well, then we'll never agree. I just think it's idiotic to say that 9000CC is a classic car and 9000CS is not. Why not use their Saab names instead of the Classic/NG nonsense.
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Johannes wrote:
< snip >

I'm 100% with you here.
The '92-93 model on 9000 was simply a 'facelift' in my view. Nothing significant in the mechanical dept changed for sure. The bodyshape isn't changed much either other than to be a bit sleeker.
In comparison the C900 / NG900 is a clear difference, not least in the chassis and indeed the total body has no relationship whatever to the previous model.
Graham
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