Do I stick with Saturn?

I have been a two saturn owner for a while, and only recently a single saturn owner(one of my saturns gave it's life to protect my wifey from a red light runner). Althougth I have had great experiences with one,

96SL2, and very mixed with the other, 97SL2, I have to say I would have probly continued buying SL's but saturn changed that. I think if you look up consumer reportings, they said saturn's SL act was good with the last few years of the model, but then erased learned lessions about quality and design with the whole new ion model.

When my 97SL2 goes, it will be my last saturn, unless I can get a good used 2002SL2. :(

imho,

Tom @

See if you can negotiate a better purchase price for the SL2.

Get a red-line :-) I recently purchased an ION 3 quad coupe when the lease expired on my LS 300 and love it. One of the biggest criticisms of the ION is the crappy interior. However, if you get leather interior it changes everything. I would have gotten the red-line but my wife didn't want a standard transmission.

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I had a '98 SL2. My mom liked it so much, she went out and bought a new 2003 Ion 2 in the spring of that year. A year later, she passed away. I inherited the car when it was a year old and had 4,000 miles on it. I then sold my '98 when it had

80,000 miles on it and have now been driving the '03 Ion for about six months and 6,000 miles, including a couple trips from Boston to DC and back.

My biggest complaint is that the seats are nowhere near as comfortable on long trips, and the material isn't as nice. The adjustable lumbar support is gone from the driver's seat. The car in general feels "cheap" where the SL2 did not, in ways that I can't quite put my fingr on.

The center instrument binnacle is goofy. Unlike some Ion owners, I've grown accustomed to it, but I still think it's a mis-design.

The HVAC control unit had to be replaced at about 8,000 miles due to failure of the fan switch. My car needs the DRL recall and the headlamp lens on the right side has started turning a milky white near the top. By contrast, my SL2 had two minor problems during its warranty period: as delivered, the right hand headlamp assembly was loose (corrected next day by the dealer) and the reverse light switch died at about 22,000 miles resulting in failure of the reverse lamps (fixed under warranty).

They did rearrange the dash so that use of the cupholders no longer blocks access to the heater controls. The door pockets are also now sufficiently large to hold a standard-sized folded road map. Those were my two most-hated annoyances on my SL2.

On the other hand, the cigarette lighter^H^H^H^H^H^Hpower outlet is in a place that's utterly useless. Try releasing the handbrake while not whacking whatever's plugged in there.

The car is peppier than I expected for a 4cyl with an automatic (my SL2 was a 5-speed). It's pretty fun to drive, for a family econo-sedan.

I'm not sure what the Ion 3 would get you other than power everything.

I understand that the seats have been changed in the 05 model...but all in all the few comments posted so far are not exactly overwhelmingly positive

can one really negotiate a better purchase price? What happens if I just walk away from the SL2?

Well, add a positive vote for the ION 2. After driving a SL2 for 11 years, recently replaced it with a 2005 ION2. Prior to purchase had misgivings about the styling, center instrument cluster, and the misc. comfort & appearance complaints I'd read about the early year ION's.

Depending on which ION (1,2, or 3) you buy, the various appointments are slightly different, but I'm VERY happy with the 2005 ION2 (manual tranny) I bought. I find the seats comfortable, the handling outstanding (equivilent to the SL2 with a better turning radius), & the car has a well made "solid" feel to it. The center instruments is a non-issue, takes very little time to adapt to, and in fact I now like better because it makes the driver's area seem more roomy & you don't have to look through the steering wheel to see it. The only problem I had test driving the car (a 31+ mile test drive), was my elbow smacked into the center armrest/storage box cover whenever I went to shift gears. At my request the dealer replaced the armrest/storage box center piece with the open top tray configuration. Problem solved.

I really liked my old SL2 (may she rest in peace ...), but the ION2 (so far) has been an outstanding replacement.

My 2 cents ...., Bill Davis Colorado

I tried that with my car and they wouldn't go for it. They wanted $11K for my 3 year old LS 300 and, as much as I liked that car, it just wasn't worth it when I could get a new 2004 ION 3 with all the dealer incentives for about the same amount. You can just walk away from your lease with no problems as long as the car isn't damaged, over mileage, or has excess wear.

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I had a 93 Saturn SL1, which was my favorite... Worked like a dream and never costed me much at all for maintence.... Think all I put in it before I sold it at 300,000kms was an alternator, battery and the front control arms.

Then I bought a used 98 SC1, which I just sold a month and a half ago. It was a great car as well, but it was going to need a head gasket soon (very slow leakage around the outside of the seal in one corner). Plus I was getting bored with it, wanted something new.

My original plan was the Smart Fortwo, but Mercedes-Benz had awful lease prices on it. I'll wait a couple years. Then I was considering either an

04 Ion or 04 Echo hatch. I decided I really like the idea of a hatchback, and was very close on the echo. Then I found the Chevy Aveo (aka. Pontiac Wave, Suzuki Swift+). I leased an 04 Aveo LS, loaded with everything except automatic tranny. With all the rebates on 04's, and the GM gas card, my payments are much lower then the base echo hatch with air. Even after driving both, the Aveo is quieter inside, and drives much better, although the echo does have better fuel mileage and a little more peppy.

Anyway, I'm very happy with my purchase, I'd highly recommend the Aveo/Wave/Swift+ to anyone. Also, if you want to buy, and want the coolest car ever designed, check out the smart fortwo.

your kidding right? We got potholes around here that will eat "cars?" like that alive.

canadians have strange taste :))

Nah, just much better roads.

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Well because they never salt them would be my guess.

Plenty of salt, they just take better care of them.

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They use more sand than salt.

The roads around here are generally very good but there are pot holes that show up in places right after winter from snow plows breaking chunks out.

The biggest problem with those tiny cars he mentioned is there isnt any crumple zones to speak of. They looked more like small caskets than cars. I want more than headlights and tail lights around me, I want a "hood" in front and a "trunk" in the back.

bosco took wrote in news:uPSdnXEbWuv0eF3cRVn- snipped-for-privacy@rogers.com:

I leased a '94 SL2 (only 30 days), then owned a '95 SL2, then leased a '97 SW2. We LOVED the SW2, but the residual to buy it at the end of the lease was crazy like $12k (US). I tried to haggle a bit, but the sales guys said they couldn't budge on it, though they could work a deal on a new 2000 - "afterall you have to have a car right?"

I actually did not HAVE to have a car, as I had a working old and rusty full-size van at the time and was only driving a few miles per day anyway, so I handed them the keys and walked away.

8 months later we custom ordered a 2001 LW200 and got the 0.9% financing, which was way better in the end than either buying the 3 year old SW2 (though we liked it more), or getting a newer vehicle at that time without the financing incentives.

If you are truly happy with the existing vehicle and can finance it without losing too much money, do so. You might wish to take the opportunity to also add extended coverage to it, since you will be making payments on it the added cost for the extra warranty financed is minimal.

My dealer wants $1600 for the extended coverage...ridiculous, in my opinion

p.s.

for the cost of financing the 2001 I can get a 2005 Ion

i would purchase your lease return with an factory extended warranty, if i were you.

snip

Just curious what it was about the SW that you liked better than the LW ?

My next will be a wagon but I can't decide between getting a used SW, a used LW or waiting to see if Saturn brings out another one ( a wagon version of the ION would be nice).

Ron Charlottesville, va

94 SL1

"Ron Herfurth" wrote in news:cqbsiv$fqj$ snipped-for-privacy@murdoch.acc.Virginia.EDU:

The SW2 was big enough for us. The LW200 is bigger and more comfortable with a leather interior and heated seats but since we also have a mini- van we did not necessarily need the extra space of the LW200. Also the SW had a longer run, lots of people able to work on them, parts easily available (for now).

Well they did away with the SW body, and I hear they are hard to find. The Lw series was also phased out, I have trouble finding someone who knows anything about the LW200 with a manual, as it was a "new" to Saturn transmission (from Saab I think). Also becuase of fewer cars out there the glass windows on the LW are more (yes we have a crack in the windshield).

The Relay is what is coming off their line currently for "big cars". I am not thrilled with the Relay, though have not seen or driven one yet in person.