Automatic vs. Manual

Thanks to all. At the time of purchase last month, the dealer had the manual RS 2.5 in stock, but I was reading literature on automatics at the dealer and the marketing dep't at SOA seems to really stress the difference between the manual's simple 50-50 split and use a lot of fancy words (to me) to describe the way the automatic works. They made the automatic seem far superior to something that's stuck in a simple

50-50 ratio.

I just moved to the high Sierras and needed a reliable and economical year-round commuter car. Many of my new neighbors have Subbies, which led me to the purchase and to place my gas guzzling full-size 4WD onto the "B" list..

One thing that has always stuck with me was that in my youth, I can remember always being able to push start a manual transmission vehicle with a dead battery and get it going. I haven't done that in many years, but I seem to have always needed it to happen to every one of my manual tranny cars that I have owned at least once in their lifetimes.

The 2005 RS5 manual does get better gas mileage than the automatic counterpart according to the U.S. Subaru website (23/30 vs 22/28). This may be due to the relatively "unsophisticated" nature of the least expensive automatic that Subbie makes.

I'll stop questioning my purchase decision at least until I break my right leg skiing!! Blizzaks are in my future. Thank you.

Go ahead, tell us how it all works.

Barry

You can still do that with a manual Subie. I've done it myself (usually with a downhill gravity push rather than a push-start, though that's obviously still possible). I've been able to start it both in 1st and reverse, depending whether the car was facing up or down the hill.

Yousuf Khan

Well, actually, depending on which Subie you get (model, model year, etc.), you will have at least a little bit of power going to the rear-wheels. In most literature I've seen, there is a 90:10 front:rear powersplit in the default position (others argue that there is a 60:40 or even a 40:60 ratio, but regardless). This ten percent to the rear might simply be as a result of the clutch pack never fully disengaging and putting a little drag on the rear wheels at all times. When the clutch pack hardens its hold, it may firm upto a 50:50 powersplit.

Yousuf Khan

Well, think about it this way, a 50:50 split is exactly the split you would get when an automatic's central clutchpack hardens upto its maximum level. So with a manual, you're actually starting out with the split that the automatic aspires to.

Yousuf Khan

Even when manuals do better on paper, you'd have to be living in a retirment home in Florida to get those better numbers in real life. Who's going to consistanly shift at 3500 rpm when there's 3000 more to use on the tach.

No Bazza, you can to the Subaru website yourself and read up on it (Subaru Australia's website has a detailed description). In case you're wondering, the static ratio is 60/40 front to rear for my Outback. If the static ratio delivers at least 40% drive to the rear wheels, then how can you say it's "front wheel drive" on clean dry pavement ?

Huh?

I shift before 3000 rpm all the time, if I am driving for mileage that is.

Spirited driving is something entirely different. I shift later only when I am driving with spirit, or have a need to accelerate quickly. Otherwise, I drive for mileage, and I all but gaurantee that I do better around town than an auto with my stick. I am 33 years old btw, and nowhere near retired.

Yousuf Khan is right about the final drive. 5th turns too fast on the highway. Its a shame.

nate

02 OBW mt3 32k miles

Generally where do you shift? I find the engine to be sluggish if I shift too soon. I have a 2.2 though so not quite as powerful as the 2.5

AUSTRALIA

David... can u explain, for us non-techno's, the terms you are using please?? And possibly, if anyone can, a bit of a descriptive as to HOW these functions work???

VDC = ??? Viscous Distribution Control ??? VTC = ??? Variable Traction Control ???

Total guesses there

Cheers Sp>

sophisticated too.

(I've read various claims

it deliver 90% of the torque

slipping wheel. Of the 4 Subaru

no center differential.

but it's arguably their

You can go to

for more information. They even have little animated demonstrations to show you how each system works.

Depending on the market and model, it looks as if Subaru gives the front or rear bias a different ratio. Most of the heavier cars, such as the Legacies and Legacy Outbacks have a 90:10 front/rear ratio. I think the WRX automatic came with a 60:40 front/rear. And apparently the Australian models come with that reversed to 40:60.

Yousuf Khan

I shift around 3000 myself. In fact most of the time that I'm over 3000, I'm usually in fifth! :-)

I think we're being short-changed (literally in this case) a bit on the Outbacks. The same engine in an Impreza seems to be doing about 2500 at the same speed and gear.

Yousuf Khan

LOL

Damned spellcheck again.... " su R prised" :)

Sp> Damn spell check!

My 2.2 Impreza 5 speed turns 3k plus in 5th on the highway

Both the auto Forester and Outback on the Australian market have a static ratio of 60:40 front to rear.

VDC = Vehicle Dynamics Control - kind of like stability control to reduce bordyroll and oversteer/understeer

VTD = Variable Torque Distribution, used on the Outback H6 / 3.0R and WRX auto. Static ratio I think is 45:55 front to rear.

Woody pretty much said what I wanted to regarding why a stick's a better choice than an auto for the purposes the OP mentioned, but on this mileage thing: do the automatics get equal/better mileage in REAL life, or just on paper with some made up EPA test? It's been my experience a manual beats an auto for mileage every time, all else being equal.

Rick

You said it all with "marketing dep't." These are the same guys who advertise "symmetrical all wheel drive." To me that means 50-50. As the owner of a 4wd Subie, with a 5 spd, where you switch it yourself, I think 50-50's the way it should be.

As others have said, I don't like the computer doing my thinking. If it were any good at it, it would put things in the gear I want when I want it, shift where I want to shift, etc. Haven't found one yet that thinks like I do...

Rick