10% Ethanol in Gas

And you've taken food out of the mouths of humans.

Funny how the beef industry cites the rising cost of animal feed, caused by ethanol production, as a reason for the rising cost of beef.

Reply to
clifto
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The problem with this is that the mixture isn't optimal anymore, if the thing has been tuned to run properly with conventional gas. Drilling your carb jets out may be in order to get a slightly richer mixture.

Of course, then you can't go back...

--scott

Reply to
Scott Dorsey

Some of us still drive vehicles with Carburetors and in my case 'lose'

50 to 100 miles per tank range with the crap mixed into gasoline.

Mike

86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 'New' frame in the works for '08. Some Canadian Bush Trip and Build Photos:
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Reply to
Mike Romain

ethanol blended gasoline. its high octance and prevents gas line freeze up. that's good enough for me. i think i would rather give my money to the farmers than the arabs. the farmers haven't got into suicide bombing just yet.

Reply to
boxing

Fully agree with this, Ed. Everybody has a different axe to grind in this situation.

Reply to
HLS

In our case we are experiencing troubles with the ethanol and gasoline mixture. In most of the mechanic workshops that i have to visit cuz of the job, at least 7 out of 10 cars are having some kind of problem with the fuel system. Burned pumps, dirty injectors and carbs are what u see. And we grow sugar cane to produce ethanol because of the latitude, but i sure agree with some people who think there is still too much hunger in the world to just drop food production to make fuel. That doesnt make sense to me i have to say, cuz id rather feed my family than my car. And im not willing to pay more money for food either.

Besides, we are so used to good and cheap fuel that this crappy gas the goverment is selling to us just doesnt cut it. Ill turn to alternative fuels when they manage a way of using the hydrogen from water to run a V-8. ill bet its gonna have a lot of "gas mileage".

Reply to
VZLN.Biker

I have a variable main fuel jet with a moving needle and tried running it a bit richer there and I have a variable 'air' jet needle which I also tried running richer to the point of seeing black smoke when floored at 65 mph. Both just gave me crappy mileage and no top end power.

My owners manual even says not to use any alcohol mix of any type except if in an emergency and then to only use enough to get to real gas...

So what are 'we' now supposed to do that the law says all stations have to switch for the new year here in Canada? My vehicle isn't supposed to have 'any' alcohol because it eats parts, let alone the running issues.

Right now Toronto Canada has a gas shortage going on because they ran short of real gas while 'converting' so they can jack up the price which they have before they jack it up again when the alcohol law hits in the New Year.

What a freaking Scam!

Mike

86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 'New' frame in the works for '08. Some Canadian Bush Trip and Build Photos:
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Reply to
Mike Romain

Mike Romain wrote in news:476ab22f$0$5205 $ snipped-for-privacy@unlimited.newshosting.com:

We can go into this again if you like. If your loseing that much milage your eng is not set up right. I have extensive experience with all kinds of engs. carbed and not, and not one had the extream loss you claim. Chemicaly it can not be explained either. KB

Reply to
Kevin Bottorff

Mike Romain wrote in news:476acabb$0$5196$ snipped-for-privacy@unlimited.newshosting.com:

In spite of my disagreeing with you. At least in the US you can get a exemption if your viechiel is not said by the manufacture to use any ethanol. On the other hand, I know of very few that offically say they can not use it. KB

Reply to
Kevin Bottorff

The claim was only true RELATIVE to other crops. I don't know if its valid or not.

what

I don't disagree with that AT ALL. Urbanites are ruining the planet, not rural people. I grew up on a farm and only live in an urban hive to make a living- once I retire I'm outta here and they can HAVE the stinking place. I'm just repeating the report, and speculating on how the environmentalists will spin it.

Reply to
Steve

As a carubretor driver my biggest gripe is NOT with the 10% ethanol- the ol' gal digests that just fine and I really don't lose any mileage compared to the older fuels with MTBE instead of ethanol. My gripe is with "winter blend" fuel with a high vapor pressure. The theory being that it will vaporize better in the intake system, burn more completely, and lower winter emissions. Feh! what it actually does is evaporate 10x as much on warm winter days contributing to ground-level ozone, do almost NOTHING to improve vaporization especially in modern cars with high pressure fuel injection which represents most of the cars actually on the road, and it makes *my* carbureted car want to vapor-lock when the ambient temp. gets over 65. On "summer" fuel it can stand 110 degrees ambient with the AC blasting and under hood temperatures pushing

220 degrees, but the winter crap tries to boil in the lines at 65 and an under-hood temp of maybe 150. What a joke.
Reply to
Steve

No, a lot of us just think that ethanol as a widely-used replacement for gasoline is not viable for North America when you balance the energy budget. I personally, however, think bioDIESEL has an enormous potential. The difference is that far less energy is required to extract corn oil from corn (or other plant oils from their parent plants) than to distill ethanol from fermented corn.

It still doesn't alleviate the problem with food crop being displaced for fuel crop while much of the world starves, and it doesn't make a big enough dent in oil demand because not enough of the automobile fleet is diesel powered... but I just want to point out that in my case its not a matter of "follow the money" at all.

Reply to
Steve

Believe there is something like a 50 cent a gallon import tax on ethanol. Otherwise it would be cheaper for US to buy from Brazil than make our own. Chalk another one up to ADM ;(

Frank

Reply to
Frank

I also think biodiesel holds a lot of promise. Corn may not be the best source for the fatty acids to make biodiesel either.

Reply to
HLS

Although I said I agree with your biodiesel statement, I dont totally agree with your energy balance assessment. We dont have to replace gasoline with ethanol to make a substantial dent in oil imports. Every little bit helps.

At some point we may see that liquid fuel is needed even though it costs as much as petroleum to produce. If you dont have enough petroleum, you CAN burn ethanol. Maybe we could invent a car that would burn the corn directly, but corn would still be a poor choice of fuel sources.

While corn is not an ideal material to product fuel ethanol, it could be used where sugar cane, potatoes, etc cannot be raised. Corn stalks, cobs, and husks can be burned to help regain some of the energy in the equation. But, again, corn demands a lot of petroleum based fertilizer, produces relatively little grain, and therefore relatively little ethanol.

In a similar sense, corn may not be the best crop for biodiesel either. Planting pine forests can guarantee a future of wood, and also tall oil, which could be converted to biodiesel..And, the trees help the environment. (I am a tree farmer too, among other things)

We have to think in worst case scenarios.

Lastly, small diesel engines in light weight passenger cars make sense.. Perhaps not for the freight hauler or industrial user but for most of us. We might have to go back to trains for transport instead of 18 wheelers. For the long term benefit of the nation, we, as a people, need to do better.

Reply to
HLS

Adjusted for inflation food prices are low. And although the cost of corn has risen in recent years, even this year, unadjusted for inflation, corn prices were no higher than the mid-70's. If you adjust the prices for inflation, they are less than half of the mid-70's prices. If you adjust them for inflation corn prices are still at historically low levels.

Ed

Reply to
C. E. White

Not to mention the fuel pump diaphragm, if you still have a mechanical fuel pump.

Other comments about having to rejet the carb are correct, and even so there will still be a slight drop in MPG. I also am not sold on ethanol, at least corn-based ethanol, being an eventual renewable replacement for gasoline.

nate

(however, when served over ice, certain forms of corn-based ethanol can be downright tasty.)

Reply to
N8N

The advantage of ethanol in the short run is that it can displace 5% or 10% of foreign oil with minimal changes to existing products. We will need to build a lot more diesel vehicles before Biodiesel can make the same sort of impact. Plus, you seem to be worried that using corn to make ethanol is diverting a lot of potential food to the fuel industry. Even if this were true, the same is true for biodiesel.

Much of the world starves??? PLEASEEEEE, that is crap. People may be starving in the world, but it is not because farmers in the US are selling corn for ethanol production. War, disaster, bad governments, economics, all have a lot more to do with people starving than corn being used to make ethanol. I just saw a long attack article blaming US farmers for destroying the economy of Africa because we were supply too much cheap agricultural produce. The article was demanding that we produce less cotton so that the price would rise and allow the third world to compete. Quit reading the anti-ethanol playbook and pay attention to the facts.

While you personally might not have an economic incentive to attack ethanol, you are getting information from other sources. Do you think they all have pure motives? Most ethanol attackers conveniently ignore the fact that the dried mash left over after you make the ethanol is high quality animal feed and they leave the value of this feed out of the economic balance. It make a huge difference in the numbers.

Ed

Reply to
C. E. White

True, there are many many sources. Another advantage....

Reply to
Steve

I've heard that soybean makes a better biodiesel than corn.

Reply to
Don Stauffer in Minnesota

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