92-96 Camry: Sludge? Common Problems?

grading

think Mobil 1

engine. I

Well, let's take your points individually:

1). I was in PepBoys yesterday. Mobil1 retailed for $4.79 while the PepBoys brand was $1.19. Most of the Valvoline/Quaker State/Pennzoils were $1.99-2.29. All are SL grade yet .... it would be foolish to expect an absence of sludge formation using maximum drain intervals from the $1.19 stuff. There is also the matter of extreme temperature viscosity stability afforded by synthetics.

2). I would agree with you IF the car was being operated as mildly and optimally as the car manufacturer expected the vehicle to be operated. But... life presents us with unusual cold, heat, and loads that warrant special considerations. For example, the Geo Prizm I had carried only THREE quarts of oil in the engine. Couple this to short gearing (3,000 rpm at 60 mph), mountain driving followed by prolonged interstate driving at 75 mph (about 4,000 rpm) back and forth across the deserts of southern CA, AZ and NV year round and you've got ample reasons for running a "superior" oil.

3). No doubt about the additional margin of protection from a synthetic. (I know Huw is spinning around about some FUCH mineral oils that can outperform some synthetics for long drains but ... I'm choosing from the typically limited American auto parts shelves).

Go read bobistheoilguy.com

Mobil 1 turns in consistently good oil analysis numbers, but there are some modern non-synthetic oils that turn in as good or better numbers.

Most oils vastly exceed minimum specifications, so there still a big difference between oils. Remember that "the spec" is just a minimum. A good oil exceeds the API minimums (but note that I do NOT advocate the non-API approved oils like Spamsoil).

That said, the general conclusion I've heard is that Toyota has gone a bit overboard with PCV system to reduce emissions, and the result is a POTENTIAL sludging problem under certain combinations of oil brand, driving habits, and drain intervals.

European cars have been long intervals for much longer than synthetics have been around. For example, a mid-late 90's Saab spec's API SH grade. That was previous to them adopting synthetics in their line later on. It's not all an oil grade issue.

Don't get me wrong - I do 3K and/or synthetics, even in my Euro cars. But, the point is that there's something about those Toyota motors that are cooking oil unlike any other motors from them or others. I ran Toys for many years and we never heard of or saw those issues, even in some pretty badly abused motors.

That's my point too: there's something wrong with the *current* design for this motor. Perhaps it runs fine when everything is done to spec - but other manufacturers are not having these issues with slightly under maintained cars. In fact, AFAIK, even Toyota is not having these issues with some other motors they use.

Uh, that doesn't pre-date synthetics at all. Not by 20 years! Mobil 1 has been common since the mid/late 70s.

In news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com, Jimmy being of bellicose mind posted:

According to the SAE, sludge is the result of LOW oil temperatures permitting the accumulation of acids, water, and carbon. If high oil temperatures were the cause, then I ask YOU to explain why all the air cooled motorcycle engines running around with NO positive crankcase ventilation are not plagued with sludge or varnish.

Because their designs don't suck like Toyotas ?

I should have said "synthetics have been in common use and spec'ed by European manufacturers".

In news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com, Jimmy being of bellicose mind posted:

You think a Harley Davidson engine is designed better than a V6 Toyota? Try again and this time, engage your brain and reasoning faculties.

As a matter of fact... YEAH.

Oops! The little buggar messed up and showed he's a 14 year old brat that enjoys playing mind games. Are you that same pimply-faced Jimmy that tried to incite folks a while back? davidj92

Since you claim to be so well versed in Toyota's faults, would you enlighten us as to the actual NUMBERS of Toyota engines that have had a sludge issue rather than your SWAG's? davidj92

You've been washing down drugs with drink.

You're perceptive abilities are incredible! You ought to go on stage as a psychic.

Now, back on topic: He asked a question. I responded. Most manufacturers are able to produce engine designs without sludge problems. Apparently Toyota can't. Next question ?

When did I claim that ?

Nope. I've seen enough posts about sludge problems to perceive that the issue is real. In fact, even some Toyota supporters here are contradicting you as they are not arguing that the problem does not exist, only that "properly" maintained engines don't have it. My argument is that the design is deficient in that it is that easy to sludge the engine - as compared to other manufacturers engines and even other motors from Toyota.

In news: snipped-for-privacy@4ax.com, Jimmy being of bellicose mind posted:

Ok, the design of WHAT is deficient? Try to be more specific that just saying "the engine."

Your statements contain no ambuguity. Your statements claim unequivocally that Toyota engines have sludge by nature. That to me says you know something more than 99.9% of all other Toyota owners/users.

1. The posts you speak of are just like yours, conjecture at best. Then you try to support your postulations as fact once they get quoted in a response.
2. You are just like the other Chicken Littles when asked for numbers. Your scream your postulations, then expect us to accept them as fact.
3. You have no argument, only conjecture and assumptions. You know what they say about assumptions? Your starting to fit the description. We aren't because we aren't buying into your stage act. Again I ask you: What are the actual NUMBERS of Toyota engines that have a sludge problem? If you can't supply this one small request of your vast knowledge then I will catagorize you with Charlene as another Chicken Little and ignore your rantings. davidj92

That's your opinion. "Better" is wide open to interpretation. A Harley Davidson engine is certainly better designed for a motorcycle than a Toyota v6.

And the fact that I don't like the generic people-transporters that are generally wrapped around Toyota v6 engines might factor in a bit too :-p

Don't take me too seriously here, I'm really on your side. How many years did I have to listen to Blake's asinine bleating in the Chrysler newsgroup before she decided to go pick on Toyota owners? Way too many. You have my sympathies. just hope she buys a Nissan or BMW or something else next. You know whatever it is, it'll mysteriously develop a "major defect" that "affects millions" shortly after she buys it. Come to think of it, lets hope she buys a Mercedes next.... then she and Parker can spend years sniping at each other :-)

Well, do you expect to find a Toyota V6 in a Harley frame? ;-) We're not talking Boss Hoss here! You will never find a Harley engine maintained by the Owners Manual lasting anywhere near what a Toyota V6 will last when maintained by the Owners Manual and operated similarly. Not even in your wettest dreams where you woke up in a feverish sweat.

Yeah I know. LOL