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Tire speed ratings

I just bought from a local dealer a new set of tires because my original equipment tires wore out at 33,500 miles on my 2000 Toyota 4Runner 2WD.

The tire dealer said the SUV had the wrong tires from the start. The originals were S. The new are T.

He said the speed rating is all wrong and that is why the tires wore out so fast (the rear tires were way worse than the front, especially the left rear tire). Brakes were shot also so he replaced both the rear and the front brakes.

He pointed to a bunch of numbers on the old tires and the supposedly better numbers on the new tires which he charged me 180 US dollars per tire, plus 28 dollars per tire for what he called spin balancing, plus 5 dollars for new valves per tire, and 3 dollars per tire to throw them away (even though I kept two for the kids' swing set).

I looked up all the numbers. I can look up a chart as well as anyone can so I can see that the speed rating is all about how fast you can go. Not how long the tires last. I read all there is in this newsgroup on speed ratings and from what I can see here it seems nobody really understands them. All they can do is report what a chart says. They don't seem to know any more than that.

Do you think this is typical of dealers that they blame problems on the speed rating. Since nobody really knows what the speed rating is (other than looking it up on a chart) I guess they can get away with it.

Is there anyone who double checks that the speed ratings are correct for tires? If it makes so much difference, there must be an agency somewhere that checks that this information is correct. Can you refer me to that agency?

Also, I did not fill out any warranty cards but a friend said it was he law and I could get a ticket for not filling out that card. Can I send in something after the fact (I don't have a card or anything from the dealer).

Reply to
Yokohama Initsui
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Speed ratings have a lot ot do with wear.

An off road tire (lower speed rating) wears fast on the highway and a highway tire (high speed rating) gets chewed up fast off road.

Then you compromise.

At 33K, your tires should still be under a warranty and then you only have to pay a percentage for some of the wear 'if' you rotated them when you were supposed to, doesn't sound like you did...

And the 'recycle' $3.00 fee is on the new tires, not the old ones.

Mike

86/00 CJ7 Laredo, 33x9.5 BFG Muds, 'glass nose to tail in '00 88 Cherokee 235 BFG AT's

Yokohama >

Reply to
Mike Romain

Approximately 9/10/03 19:25, Yokohama Initsui uttered for posterity:

Depending on how you drive and whether or not you keep them balanced and rotated, could be.

It would help to know what make and model the original tires were and what make and model this crooked dealer stuck you with. The new ones *might* be good tires, but avoid this dealer like the plague in the future.

You can usually get tire prices from local newspapers, but you can also get considerable information from online sources like

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or
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either one of which would be a good place to go before shopping locally.

Summary: Stupid or just flat out crooked tire dealer. From the price you got gouged and the sheer BS, I have to vote for crooked.

Yeah, all those Toyota design engineers sure are silly compared to a tire jockey. Right. Right. Right.

It isn't at all uncommon to fit even 4wd SUV's with passenger car tires.

As for the difference between an S rated tire and a T rated tire, *both* are rated for faster than anyone in their right mind should ever be driving a Toyota 4Runner.

S rated are good for 112 miles/hour T rated are good for 118 miles/hour which is only 6 miles per hour.

I don't know of any Light Truck tires that are T rated, but too lazy to check. There are several that are S rated and several more that are not even S rated.

Worse, I don't suppose this tire dealer told you that in general, the FASTER the tire rating, the more the tread tends to wear out faster.

Perhaps the brakes were shot, but given how badly the tire dealer lied about speed ratings, I'd strongly suspect there was not a thing wrong with your brakes either. I guess the good news is that you didn't get ripped off for ball joints, shocks, alignment, etc.

The speed rating was NOT WRONG. And all else being equal, a T series tire will wear faster than a S series.

This guy is a crook.

If you go to

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you can get Michelin premium tires for $120 apiece. The particular model tends to be higher because it is used on Ford Explorers and is in short supply. There are far cheaper models of premium tires ranging down to about $60.

All of the tires are "S" or SR rated. There are also LT grade tires, also known as "Light Truck" which can handle loads better, none of them are in the $180 price range. Even a Pirelli Scorpion Zero [ a premium street truck tire] is cheaper than that.

The five bucks for new valves is always a good idea. The $28 bucks for spin balancing is a bit on the high side...

Although the speed rating is for top speed, it is a pretty good rule of thumb that the faster the tire rating, the less the lifetime. Basically because to get the higher speed rating you use less tread.

It is more typical of *some* dealers to simply rip off the public and outright lie to do so.

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Or you could check your owner's manual for the Toyota, or ask the Toyota dealer.

You don't need to fill out any warranty card. Those only go to the manufacturer of the tires, so you can be notified of a tire recall. A good tire dealer uses their computer to do this for you.

You *should* have gotten a hard copy of some sort of tire warranty from this dealer...spelling out how long the tread is supposed to wear and whether or not road hazard is covered.

Reply to
Lon Stowell

Or, looking at it from the road-only perspective, a high-speed tire will generally be a high-performance tire that offers a lot of grip by using a soft compound that wears quickly. (Plus, they're generally molded with relatively little tread depth, for less squirm.)

I guess it depends on where you live. Here, in California, I pay the fee if the shop disposes of my old tires, but if I take them home, no fee. The dump will take the old tires for $1.00 each, instead of the $3.50 or so the shop charges.

Reply to
Matthew Hunt

PURE BS. Speed rating has nothing to do with tire wear.

The numbers are usually a trade off. You can get longer wear out of tire if you are willing to sacrifice grip.

Exactly the point.

Could be. That is one reason to find a different dealer who knows what they are talking about.

When a tire dealer sells you a tire he has to sell you a tire that is of at least the same, or higher, speed rating.

Your friends are also giving you bad information. It is a good idea to fill out the warranty cards just in case your tires get recalled. Then the manufacturer can get in touch with you. No fines or tickets are involved. It is for your benefit to fill out the cards.

----------------- Alex __O _-\

Reply to
Alex Rodriguez

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