Toyota Quality ?

Dan J. S. wrote in rec.autos.tech

We bought a new Plymouth Caravan in 1991, while it never spent a lot of time in the shop, it left us very disappointed. I maintained it according to the manual. From the start it had problems with the brakes, upon occaision they would overheat, and I would have to stop and let them cool. Reported under warranty, supposedly fixed, but always went through front brakes exceedingly fast. And would still overheat. We had some fairly normal problems, but had to replace the 02 sensor at 45K, after paying the dealer 3 hours to trouble shoot it. Then the MAP sensor went at 60K, the O2 again at about 90K, then at hundred K the tranny started slipping, and the final blow came when I went out one morning and started the van and the head gasket blew. Never lost coolant before hand, never had any white smoke, never used oil, just suddenly blew and started blowing huge clouds of white smoke. Oh, and the number of recalls due to poor quality of parts, or poor design was unbelievable.

Brent P wrote in rec.autos.tech

Yeah, people who buy big American cars trade them every 2 to 4 years, why add on an expensive sales tool when it isn't needed?

Daniel J. Stern wrote in rec.autos.tech

Anybody who doesn't think that long warranties are a sales tool only needs to look at Kia's advertising. They make a major point out of the length of their warranty, while usually ignoring what are major selling points on other cars.

I am not saying Chryco has quality built in, but some of their trucks, etc are doing fairly well on the road... However, in comparison to a Kia or Hyundai, I would take a Chryco any time!!!

Nissans are unreliable? Since when? Friend of mine has a '93 Altima that's just clicked over 200K, all he's done is basic maintenance.

And one thing about Nissans is interesting - they use timing chains, not belts.

How many miles? 5 years is short for a transmission - at least most. Chrysler makes transmissions that are dreadful lately. As in mid 80's GM bad.

Yes, it does have a bit higher compression ratio. Other than the windshield wipers, it's all minor stuff that most cars today have. Consumer Reports lists how many defects it finds in every car it tests. So far I've never seen one vehicle without some defects form the factory. My guess is that the ones on your Durango were'nt as noticeable.

Mechanically, it will wear like iron compared to the Durango. Q: did you get the V6 or the V8?

Chrysler/Dodge/Plymouth all suffer from the same sorts of problems Ford does. Take the 80-90s Escorts. Just a dreadful car. Ford Tempo? I took a new Contour out and the transmission had a full second lag time between me hitting the gas hard and it downshifting. Then it went into gear with a loud "thunk". New from the factory. (this exercise almost got us run into, btw - the lag time was in the realm of a hazzard)

Toyotas and Hondas have good engines and transmissions. For me, that's 3/4 of the car right there. Who cares if the window stops working. Trim is for looks. What I want is to have it start and run well.

Then there's VW that has one of the best factory certified programs and a 10/100 drivetrain warranty but does virtually nothing to notify customers about it. Transferrable, too, unlike the KIA/Hyundai one which drops in half if it's resold(even as a factory certified vehicle).

The smart money walks across the street from the Hyundai dealer to the VW or Toyota dealer. Want sporty? Get a Golf - just stay away from the turbo engines. Want economical? Get an Echo.

Don't confuse JD's 90 day quality measurement with LONG TERM quality. That's where the Japanese manufacturers shine and the domestic ones falter.

Like what? We see Focus' with over 100K on the clock and we don't see anything in particular in the power train that has gang bad. Specifically, what went bad in your Focus that was not covered?

mike hunt

Chris Philip wrote:

Triple the price, equal unreliability.

brands)

I quantified Nissan. I was not too sure. I am seeing and hearing a lot of negative stuff on them, although I love the new Altima and Maxima looks! I would be worried about buying a car from a company that just went through a bankruptcy... but yea, they are ok but not as good as Honda or Toyota... but that's just my opinion.

Lame. I didn't know that...

Heh. Like the Rusty Jones rust-proofing scam?

I respectfully disagree, but you knew that. Besides, a VW is about as nice driving a car as you can find without going to RWD.

nate

AT least a smart buyer knows not to buy extended warranty. We have no choice with basic warranties. They do nothing but add to the 'base' price of the vehicle, period. I don't remember every having a single warranty claim on any of my vehicles, foreign or domestic, in the past twenty years or more. I wish I had the choice of buying a car for the thousands of dollars less that it costs to provide a 'free' warranty. It is not too many years ago that the warranty on the new cars I bought was 1,000 miles or thirty days. For the longest time the warranty was 90 days or

4,000 miles and it only covered the power train, not bumper to bumper. The problem today is buyers expect the manufactures to baby-sit the car for its lifetime. Nobody wants to do the maintenance and then they expect the manufacture to fix it for free if it ever brakes down. The result is we pay a hell of a lot more to buy new cars.

mike hunt

"Philip" wrote:

So why did you trade it on a foreskinner? A '99 Durango would have had an A-518 transmission, which is based on the A-727 that debuted in 1956. Its a most thoroughly debugged transmission, reliable as gravity, and not at all prone to the kinds of problems minivan transmissions are. You took a financial bath bath on a vehicle that probably had 200k miles left in it (and even if it didn't that transmission is cheap to fix) and traded it in on an inferior vehicle, IMO.

But even the "bad" ones are better than the import-o-philes would have you believe. I bought an Eagle Vision (Dodge Intrepid) in 1993. At

150,000 miles, the transmission was leaking from an O-ring that required removing the transmission to replace so I had it rebuilt even though it was still working fine. The car has 209,000 miles on it without any other major repairs, still going strong.

My '73 Plymouth is still in daily use at 432,000 miles, and my '66 Dodge made it to >260,000 miles, and will go on much further once I finish rebuilding its engine (which still RUNS fine, but down on power).

In contrast, I've never nursed an Asian-built car past 150k without it suffering massive multiple organ failure- like the whole front suspension falling apart on a Mazda.

Geez, can I have some of what you're smoking?

98 Durango: 5.2 (318) or 5.9 (360) v8 engine. A-518 transmission. 8.25" ring gear or 9.25" ring gear rear axle. We're talking "forever" truck, here. The whole drivetrain is composed of some of the most reliable and thoroughly proven pieces to ever roam the roads. 500k miles is not out of the realm of possibility, and 250k is quite reasonable to EXPECT with proper care.

"Nissan" is a misspelling of "Renault."

:-p

Every warranty has a mileage limit as well as a time limit. I.E. ten years or 50K, WOF. At the US average of 15K a year the warranty runs out in less than seven years. In addition the manufacture knows the buyers on average will replace the vehicle in three to four years in any event, making a vehicle with a ten year warranty a salable item.

mike hunt

dizzy wrote: