Sludge revisited

When your engine reaches operating temp the water is gone (unless you have a massive leak that needs fixing). Most unburned hyrdocarbons will also evaporate at operating temps. What doesn't evaporate should be filtered out by the oil filter.

So why the comment about "what kind of cheap oil are you wasting your money on"? I said 6K changes for the sake of argument, and you say that interval means cheap oil? then you come back and say 5K is typical for dino?

5K dino intervals vs. 10K synthetic intervals, the cost is a wash. 3K dino intervals is very very very very good insurance for very very very very little money.

I see water coming out of the tailpipe on short trips even when I get home. I still am going to change oil at 3 K miles. If it were that I was going to change cars every two years I might think about changing at

5 or 6 k miles, but I keep my vehicles for quite a few years and so I baby them. I don't mind the few extra dollars it costs, it is cheap insurance plus IF there is a problem with the motor, it will be far more in my favor if it goes to court than if I had changed oil at 5 or 7 K miles or not at all. Again, to each his own, change or don't but if you have problems don't blame the MFG of the vehicle regardless of the name.

Water in the tailpipe has nothing to do with water in the oil. I've got a 93 thats run on synthetic oil I change my oil every year or

25,000 miles. It has no engine issues at all. If you want cheap insurance, use synthetic oil. You are right, if you don't change the oil every (and dont use UOA) then you can't blame the MFG.

Maybe, but you'll getter better performace and increased mpg from a synthetic. I don't use 10K oil chanages on my synthetic, its more often than needed. You can probably increase your mpg by 5% using synthetics, which more than covers the cost of the synthetic oil.

Herb, my 2003 Sienna has so far no sludge problem, but I'm concerned. Thanks for exposing in such convincing manner loudmouths, who tout the company line of blaming the owner without having anything to back it up. As you have shown here, they are their own worst enemy once one starts probing!

Why do I get the idea that you don't change your oil at the manufacture's specified intervals?

No reason to be concerned about sludge if you have changed your oil.

If you have not....then sludge is on the way.

The sludge issue is not a Toyota only issue. When I still owned my 1994 Dodge Caravan there was mention of changing oil at regular intervals and the sludge buildup that could occur if regular oil changes were not performed. Why not try to play it safe and get oil changes at recommended or before intervals and quit trying to pass off responsibility to others. It is the owners responsibility to maintain his or her vehicle. No court will back you up in legal action if you have not maintained your vehicle, that is plain and simple fact.

What about my comments regarding trips, short trips v. long trips?

Sorry, I thought I answered it, with the engine reachine operating temp. Please repost

I agree, this thread is getting too long and I snipped. Here is what I asked previously:

"Are saying that if I drive say 150 miles at 65 mph without a stop is the same as driving 2 or 3 miles of city stop and go traffic, winter driving stop and go for only a few miles and that is the same as a long trip? The oil will be the same regardless?"

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As long as the engine reaches operating temp.

How long running does that take to reach operating temp? I expect it does not take but a few minutes in the warmer weather, but where I live, in the winter and at times in subzero temps it can take a bit longer. If it does then what effect will that have on the engine oil? Especially with short trips?

I've been told every 5k on my Echo - not only by independents, but by Toyota dealers.

Natalie

And if it don't then how does that affect the oil?

If your car has a temp gauge, you'll know. If you don't then check the upper radiator hose, when thats hot, your at opertaing temp. Sure it can take longer to get there in the cold. Where I live, Wisconsin, it gets very cold.

If you engine does not get up to operating temps and your not running a good filter, your likley to get more condensation in the oil.

See my other post

Is this situation like the Audi 5000 sudden acceleration problem (nonexistent, no mechanical cause ever found, drivers at fault), or is it more the Ford problem with transmissions shifting by themselves from Park or Neutral into Drive or Reverse (cause found, including engine vibration; this doesn't excuse people who fail to use their parking brakes)?

At least 6,000 miles in New York taxicabs, according to a Consumer Reports test done 10 years ago with Chevy 3.4L V-6s and oils rated API SH. Oils are now usually rated SM, a better quality grade.