02 Camry 4cyl - engine noise

The 4 cylinder engine in my 02 Camry (67K miles) has been getting louder and louder. When the engine is under load, right after starting it cold, it sounds like diesel - like metal banging against metal. Its almost as if something in the engine is not getting enough oil. Once it warms up, it quiets down a bit, but it is still a LOT louder than when it was new 2 years ago. The noise level is very weather dependent. On very cold mornings, its so bad that I'm almost afraid to accelerate for fear of something breaking.

Took it to the dealer yesterday. They're telling me that there is nothing wrong with it, and that this engine is known for being noisy when cold. ???? The engine was first used in 2002 models. How can it be "known" for being noisy?

I'm thinking of a few possible options: take it to another dealer? Use one of those oil flushing additives next time I change the oil? Switch oil types?

Suggestions?

Reply to
DrWho
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There is a TSB regarding that complaint, but I am not sure of the VIN range/ year off hand. I do remember that it is for the newer camry, 02 -

03, and it involves replacing the intake manifold. Apparently the induction flow during cold startup causes a knocking-type sound. Should be covered under the 3/36k warranty.
Reply to
qslim

If your oil-pressure light is not blinking on at idle when the engine is hot then its reasonable to assume the OP is ok,..but it would be much better if you could have an OPgauge fitted to monitor it accurately.

I haven't been able to listen to one of those motors, but the 5SFE in the preceding models is not what I;d call a quiet motor. The overhead gear seems to be noisey and gets louder as the motor warms up and clearances increase. It tends to inidcate piston rattle if the noise is loudest when the engine is cold,....but as I said, it may just be normal for those motors especially if you re comparing it to another make of car. As a rule, any noise that gets louder on load, indicates pistons or bearings.

Jason

Reply to
Jason James

Hmmm.... I see a TSB 01804 (NHTSA #10008384) regarding intake manifold noise on 02 Camrys. The website doesn't provide anything more than that. Can anyone out there get the full TSB for me? I wonder if I can get the dealer to print it out for me.

Thanks for the tip, qslim.

--
Bill G
Reply to
DrWho

Reply to
Car Guy

Ummm.. I don't see how that will quiet the engine down.

I am inferring that you think perhaps I have not maintained the engine properly. Just FYI, I change the oil and filter every 4-5K miles. I use a non-synthetic brandname oil (usually Castrol), and premium filters (Hastings or Wix).

--
DrWho
Reply to
DrWho

Mobil is a 10-50 oil,..but I found it too light to maintain adequate oil-pressure below 2000 rpm in a Cleveland V8 351,.....I'd use dino oil in all but the newest of hi-tech motors.

Jason

Reply to
Jason James

Copied from : Message 1 in threadFrom: Dirk Broer ( snipped-for-privacy@kaos.gsfc.nasa.gov) Subject: Synthetics part I _____ "Film strength" refers to the amount of pressure required to force out a film of oil from between two pieces of flat metal. The higher the film strength, the more protection is provided to such parts as piston rings, timing chain, cams, lifters, and rocker arms...wherever the lubricant is not under oil-system pressure. Synthetics routinely exhibit a nominal film strength of well over 3,000 psi, while petroleum oils average somewhat less than 500 psi. The result is more lubricant protection between moving parts with synthetics.

------ The oil filters you mention are reputed to be of good quality, but why not use the oil filter specifically designed for your vehicle by the Toyota engineers who designed the rest of the engine? The canister size, anti drain back components, filter media flow and filtration are all optimized for your engine. Just a suggestion - a place to start if you so choose.

Reply to
Daniel
5SFE in the preceding models is not what I;d call a quiet motor. The overhead gear seems to be noisey and gets louder as the motor warms up and clearances increase.

----------- With all due respect, your engine may have not received timely past maintenance service, or be out of adjustment. The valve actuation mechanism on my '94 5S-FE reminds me of a precision clock movement. With the engine hot at idle, the valve train (though it's a short train) makes a gentle quiet whirring / clicking sound - not at all to be described as noisy.

-------------- The 20-RE Toyota engine with SOHC and rocker arms set to .008" and .012" makes much more noise with its clicking and clacking, but that is normal for that engine.

---------- The lifters on the modern 4 cylinders remind me of jeweled clock components, the lightest touch with the end of a thickness gauge and they spin, floating on a cushion of oil, even with the engine off. Polished hardened steel, precision clearances - usually require no adjustment for the life of the engine. Not noisy. Just one opinion.

Reply to
Daniel

Mobil is a 10-50 oil,..but I found it too light to maintain adequate oil-pressure below 2000 rpm in a Cleveland V8 351

-------- May not be comparable to a newer Toyota engine. V8 bearing clearances could be greater in that specific engine, or the oil pump have some wear. Can easily check the specifications for the Toyota - think they're around .002" and manufacturer is currently recommending 5W oil. 10W for my year seemed thin to me also intially, but the tolerances are tighter overall in the Toyota. If I'm not mistaken, with the Cleveland V8, as engines are machined, the toleerances can increase such that some engines are closer to spec than others. There's a range of acceptable limit and as machine tools wear, manufacturing tolerances increase. Random samples are taken and rejected if needed. Perfomance enthusiasts find improvement from "blueprinting" engines - taking them apart and setting all the tolerances where they should be. Whereas Toyota altered the manufacturing process by calibrating the machinery to stay on target - sampling the machine tools rather than the engine parts, while practising - sorry forgot the Japanese word "Kaizen?" meaning "continuous quality improvement" and attention to the smallest details. Just means you can't necessarily accurately generalize across engine families from different designs and manufacturers.

Reply to
Daniel

Mobil1 comes in a RANGE of viscosities, Herr Jason. 0w-30, 0w-40, 5w-30,

10w-30, 15w-50 just off the top of my head. CERTAINLY a 10w-anything would be light for one of those old crap Cleveland Fords. Crank and rods on those things would rattle and knock every morning loud and clear until the oil pressure built up to max. They were that way from the beginning. You'd have to run single 40 weight in those things with snow on the ground for the bottom end to start up quietly. LOL
--

  - Philip
Reply to
.Philip.

and I think you misunderstood my suggestion.

You stated that as the weather cools, the noise increases. I have tried mobil in my 2002 Camry LE v6 and other cars and it runs smoother in colder temps then regular oil.

As for when you change your oil, it is nice that you say every 4,000 to

5,000 miles but that all depends on driving style, etc. I change it at 4,500 miles using mobil 1 and I drive about 100 miles a day on highways and no short trips.

And using a NON Toyota filter might change the drainplug design on the filter and that could cause more dry starts which may cause the noise

Try the next oil change with a Nipp>> try mobil 1 and a oem oil filter..

Reply to
Car Guy

umm

MOBIL 1 5W30 grade.

Reply to
Car Guy

Explain: "And using a NON Toyota filter might change the drain plug design on the filter ..."

LOL

--
  - Philip



Car Guy wrote:
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Reply to
.Philip.

The new dealer has determined that the noise is due to a bad belt tensioner. I suppose that's possible, but I'm sceptical that a tensioner could make that amount of noise. I am also disappointed that the tensioner would die after only 67K miles.

That want $400+ to replace it. I'll be doing it myself this weekend.

Unless. Would the tensioner be covered under the 5/60K drive train warranty? I would think it should be, but the warranty booklet is non- commital about it - doesn't explicit mention the tensioner in the "covered" or "not cover" lists.

-- Bill G.

Reply to
DrWho

I thought that might the case. :)

I thought I heard that you should not switch to synthetics after running dino for so long.

--
Bill G.
Reply to
DrWho

Ahhh Philip,

If memory serves, you (and others) stated some time ago, that the deisgn of the drain back plug (if this is what it is called) allows how much oil remains in the filter and helps prevent dry starts. Perhaps you can enlighten me on the more technical basis of these things.

Reply to
Car Guy

I just had my tensioner replaced (02 Camry LE 4-cyl), under a TSB that the dealer mentioned. (I don't know the name.) While my Camry is out of warranty (58k miles), the dealer replaced it *under* warranty as I complained about belt squeaking quite a bit while the car was indeed under warranty.

Steve

Reply to
Steve B

"Anti drain back valve" "VALVE" The valve is a rubber disc that is readily visible behind the drilled holes radiused around the threaded center hole for the stand pipe. The valve is supposed to ensure that an inverted filter remains primed between the outter side of the filter media and the metal housing. However, the filtered oil can still drain through the main bearings via the oil gallery.

- Philip

Car Guy wrote:

Reply to
.Philip.

would

those

the

Bull-puckey,..Philip. Actually I suspect the Clevo has a loose rod-journal running 3 thou or more. Seriously tho,..I thought *all* bearing clearances in new motor vehicles were in the vicinity of 0.75 to 1.0 thou of an inch for bigends regardless of make.

Jason

Reply to
Jason James

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